A better comparison would be: The Spot meter is like a Jeep that can go both to highways and to challenging mountian tracks with rocks in the middle. Other meters may be more convenient for the highway but they cannot go through challenging tracks.
Here you have 3 examples of challenging situations where an incident meter won't be useful: .
You’re missing the point. The point is about need not about useful.
People starting out in large format photography do not need a spot meter. It’s not helpful to go on and on about how useful it is if it makes them feel overwhelmed or confused.
Useful? Maybe.
Necessary? Absolutely not!
Brad, to start in LF one not even needs a meter. Also in LF also there is no need to use Zone System or a derivative... but let me point that for anyone starting it is an amazing teaching, of impressive value, learning the heritage treasured since Adams and Archer, and this involves exploring the scene spots to realize how the print will be, metering the different zones. Later do what you want, but first know the classics.
Now, please explain me how the hell would you meter that shot with an incident meter, if not owning an helicopter:
View attachment 263901
You and the camera are in the shadow, the snowy mountains are miles far... is it that difficult to realize that an spot metering can be critically useful ?
Look, spot metering is the easiest way to meter accurately, and the easiest way for a LF rookie get control on what he gets. You point to different areas and you know what under/over exposure you will have in each spot. What is difficult or confussing in that ????? One has to be a total dummie to not understand that.
childish name calling.
I believe the sunny 16 rule works on snow too. The rule doesn't know what subject your shooting.Not at all... I know you can use an spot meter, I was saying that someone starting in LF has to be a dummie if not being able to judge an spot evaluation. If he is not able to understand that in 5min then better he gets a DSLR, because this is the easiest thing he has to learn.
only tell me how you would meter the Owens Valley shot with an incident meter. Have you an answer or not ?
All we are able to meter that scene with Sunny 16. At f/16, ISO 100, 1/100s we have that snow at around +3 overexposure, perhaps a bit more.
This said if we want an accurate metering of that mountain:
> The Incident meter won't give any clue.
> An averaged meter won't tell what overexposure will the snow have
> The spot meter will tell the precise under/overexposure in any spot we want to know.
IMO, a Rookie has to use the spot meter to learn and to get precise feedback, when one is experienced then he can use other ways.
You’re missing the point. The point is about need not about useful.
People starting out in large format photography do not need a spot meter. It’s not helpful to go on and on about how useful it is if it makes them feel overwhelmed or confused.
Useful? Maybe.
Necessary? Absolutely not!
only tell me how you would meter the Owens Valley shot with an incident meter. Have you an answer or not ?
Easy. A softball question. Aim the incident meter in the direction that points towards the camera.
I believe the sunny 16 rule works on snow too. The rule doesn't know what subject your shooting.
This won't work...
In the Owens Valley shot the camera is in the shadow so you are to measure the incident light in the shadow, while the far snowy mountain is illuminated by direct sun rays, having a very strong incident illumination around 3 stops higher.
If you metered that way then the snowy mountain would have been overexposed by around +6 or +7, as you have to add the extra snow brightness to the incident overpower in the sunny area.
I believe the sunny 16 rule works on snow too. The rule doesn't know what subject your shooting.
I believe the sunny 16 rule works on snow too. The rule doesn't know what subject your shooting.
So you believe a digital camera as a light meter should read the same whether you point it towards the light source or away from it?
So you believe a digital camera as a light meter should read the same whether you point it towards the light source or away from it?
Imagine the extreme case of the meter being in a dim doorway. An incident meter with proper diffuser will read the ambient light, while an undiffused meter, whatever you call it, will meter the exposure that makes the outside area middle grey when pointed in that direction. Try an app with "incident metering" in this kind of situation, or a less extreme one, such as a room with a single window. With the brightness sensor, at least you have a chance; good luck if it uses the camera!
By contrast (ugh), the light sensor on my phone is entirely directional, but the front camera isn't. My light meter doesn't have the flat lumi-disc for 2D readings, but I suspect that would be closer in nature to the light sensor.
What you quoted was a response to 138S talking about "incident" metering apps that use the front camera, stating they'd work more or less the same (perhaps more "directional" as a diffused actual incident meter. If that was the case, then any camera that meters off the sensor would read the same exposure whether pointed toward the light source or toward the subject, as it's designed to. That's obvious humbug.So you believe there's no difference between a single CDS photocell and an array of photosites behind a lens?
Is there anyone out here who practices photography ?
That's it.I really have no idea why people want to make metering as difficult as possible - they should be able to get a more than sufficiently accurate exposure with one meter reading, two if they really need to know the contrast range.
stating they'd work more or less the same (perhaps more "directional" as a diffused actual incident meter. If that was the case, then any camera that meters off the sensor would read the same exposure whether pointed toward the light source or toward the subject
That's it.
Moreover, it is inconceivable to me that photographers like H.C.B, E. Adget, R. Doisnau, S.Leitner and countless others have been so intensively involved with their light meter. Experience, intuition, imagination and other factors come into play here.
How would one get a phone based app calibrated? If it is off what would one do?
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