9x12 Plate holders 1

[Ian Grant]

I'm posting dimensions again in the hopes someone has a plate holder or two in the size I need. The plate holder has a rectangular bump that sticks out in the back of the camera. It is 10cm wide or 3 7/8 inches wide by 16cm long or just over 6 1/4 inches long. That is plus draw slide handle and a 1/8 inch or 3cm lip on the bottom. There are pictures in the plate camera forum on page 9 showing the groove in the side. (there was a url link here which no longer exists)
Just asking…

thankyou

I found two plate holders with the right dimensions, they have a grooved edge, and identified your problem, you don't have a 9x12 Cameo !

You have a Postcard size Butchers camera, I just checked the dimension and I'm 100% certain, that's why you can't find 9x12 holders that fit. Also 9x12 film inserts won't fit unless you modify the plate holders to hold them in place. They do fit width wise, at least the ones I've just tried.

Ian

 

[studiocarter]

You're right. I found a link this morning after I looked up the lens on the internet.
http://www.historiccamera.com/cgi-bin/librarium/pm.cgi?action=display&login=pocketcameo
the postcard size hit my eye.
So, it's a Pocket Cameo, Model 1 with rise and fall and side to side movement of the front stand, in the 3 1/2 x 5 1/2 postcard size, made in England.
Great to know all that. Thanks all.
And here she is cleaned up a little bit.

 

[Ian Grant]

Just an update on edge types this image may help with identification, I have a 2nd to finish.

Ian

 

[studiocarter]

The Kodak No. 3-A camera took 122 film. It also can accommodate a glass plate with emulsion on it. The plate could be changed in a big changing bag holding a box of unexposed glass plate films. I discovered this while making a ground glass for the camera. I had gotten a roll of film in the camera when I bought it. The film was good to use. My 122 roll film pictures were out of focus and I had to adjust the scale. So ground glass was needed.
The plate that fits the 3A also goes into the plate holder rails on the Cameo camera, without a plate holder in it. It is a little too narrow but it can be cranked or turned a little bit to engage both sides. The Cameo focus scale was spot on.
I made a YouTube video showing these two ideas.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0denr5zAzc
Click on my name to see how I developed the 122 roll film.

 

[studiocarter]

The Butchers Postcard Cameo plate camera had to have had a focusing back. Right?
Anyone have one that might fit?

 

[fedupwithdigital]

Just got two mystery plate holders. Was looking for holders for a KW Patent Etui 9x12 and have a Contessa Nettel 657 which fits perfectly. But the two new ones, although stamped Contessa Nettel, are too small! They're 91mm wide by 130mm long (ignoring the darkslide) with the usual Contessafalz edge lip. Internally, I'd say the maximum size of plate they could hold would be 81mm by 103mm.


Any ideas which camera they might be for?

 

[Ian Grant]

Some German manufacturers made Quarter plate cameras which were slightly smaller than their 9x12 models, others just made quarter plate holders that fitted their 9x12 cameras.

Ian

 

[fedupwithdigital]

Ah, so quarter plate it is. And no use to me (unless I acquire another camera, something I try to resist!). The seller described them as approximately 4 x 5 inches when they are much closer to 3 x 5. I'll see if he'll take them back. If not, does anyone need two quarter plate holders - will sell or swap for 9x12 holders that'll fit a Patent Etui!

 

[Simon Howers]

Ian,

Some German manufacturers made Quarter plate cameras which were slightly smaller than their 9x12 models, others just made quarter plate holders that fitted their 9x12 cameras.

Ian

I've got an Erneman (currently under restoration) which, I suspect, fits the bill. I have a pile of quarter plate holders. Are you interested in the data?

Simon.

 

[Ian Grant]

The more information the better Simon, I have a scrap 9x12 Erneman and used the focus screen back etc on another camera missing a back, there's some interchangeability between some cameras and holders,. I'm lucky all my 9x12 cameras will accept the same holders.

Ian

 

[paul ron]

207\5 9x12 maximar film holders
Im guessing from my edge to edge measurements off the gg back....
150mm x 94mm with a lip sounds right.
anybody have any spares they'd like to sell?


im also looking to buy avus 9x12 film holders... 101mm x154mm with a lip
if anyone has spares???

 

[Kino]

Reviving this old thread with even more information: a pdf on Rada Rollfilm Backs from camera wiki; https://www.fotografische.de/wp-content/uploads/rada-katalog-fotografische_de1.pdf

I wonder if there could ever be a definitive reference for all plate camera backs.

It doesn't look good...

 

[Nokton48]

I've decided to try some dry plate photography when I have time. I have about fifty Plaubel Makina 6.5x9cm plate holders.

I bought 30 dry plates from J Lane to try this out. Should be a lot of fun. He will make these in any size you desire.

I also want to buy some 9x12 plates for my RADA and other holders.

DSC01440 by Nokton48, on Flickr

 

[Kino]

Just realized I should have added this to the "database":

Photo-Plait "Appareil Pliant No3" 9x12cm plate holders.

104mm wide
100mm wide (inside dimension
140mm long
4.7mm thick
1.0mm thick lip
Square bottom; no lip around bottom of holder.

(full disclosure: images taken from the auction in which I purchased said holders)

 

[apelles]

One solution is to get a spring back as shown in the photo. Unfortunately they don't take double sided film holders as shown in the photo, however they do solve the problem of proprietary plate holders as these spring backs accept just about all 9x12 plate holders as the back relies on a spring rather than a notch and groove.

I have a Feather-Lite Adapter For American Films Hollywood Photo MFG. CO. Hollywood 28, CALIF. U.S.A

There are other variations of this spring back made by small American companies such as this, they can be found on eBay often attached to cameras or some times more rarely sold individually.

Aside from solving the proprietary notch problem , the spring back allows you to focus and take your photo without removing the ground glass and swiftly trying to replace it with the film holder.

I've bought a cache of various film holders in all brands over the years , the best seem to be Zeiss and Voightlander. I have a few marked A.P Paris

I have been able to load 26 holders with Foma 9x12 film I bought at Adorama.

My problem is that I've only been able to load the holders that have septums or little metal plates that hold 9x12 or 3 1/4/ 4 1/4 made by Kodak and Agfa. Trying to figure out how to use holders that don't have these septums. Some were originally for glass plates as I have a few with glass plates still in them. Apparently you can do a work around with thin cardboard.

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Jojje]

I won (only bidder) an ebay auction of 22 boxes unopened glass negative plates from 1950's. Among them few of the size 3½x5½" postcard size, I believe. Has anyone seen plate holders for this size?
(Experiments with my Avus 9x12 showed at least Ilford HP3 stuff is alive and kicking at ISO32.)

 

[Ron (Netherlands)]

Found time to take a shot of my German double plateholders; they are not only 9 x 12 but thought it might be interesting to have them here:


German double plateholders by Ron (Netherlands), on Flickr

Click on the picture and you'll find some info on the holders below the flickr picture. I'll make a list with the German camera's to which they fit. Btw, most of them are not easy to find - my experience over the last few years is that they are not regularly offered for sale (not even at German sites).

 

[nokia2010]

I don't own a plate camera, but for the sake of the future I was curios if plate holders can be adapted for film. I found out you can.
But I'm curios how much 9 x 12 film cost... probably I will take a look with Mister "Google".

 

[BAC1967]

I don't own a plate camera, but for the sake of the future I was curios if plate holders can be adapted for film. I found out you can.
But I'm curios how much 9 x 12 film cost... probably I will take a look with Mister "Google".

I just started shooting 9X12, the only film I could find in that format is Fomapan 100. I may cut down some 4X5 film as well.

 

[Ian Grant]

I don't own a plate camera, but for the sake of the future I was curios if plate holders can be adapted for film. I found out you can.
But I'm curios how much 9 x 12 film cost... probably I will take a look with Mister "Google".

9x12 film is slightly cheaper than 5x4, it was the most common Continetal Eurpean sheet film size so is widely available.

Ian

 

[grat]

But difficult to find in the US.

 

[Nokton48]

J Lane Dry Plate Maki Brass Petzval 1 by Nokton48, on Flickr

9x12cm J Lane Dry Plate Test exposed EI 1 dev straight Legacy Mic-X 18 minutes at 60F. Plaubel Makiflex 8 inch Brass Projection Petzval about F4. Arista 8x10 RC Matte #2 dev Multigrade. Omega DII with Omegalite Diffusion Head. RADA 9x12cm Normalfaltz Plate Holder with Makiflex Attachment

 

[Nokton48]

Flowers Back Porch J Lane Dry Plate Multigrade dev by Nokton48, on Flickr

9x12cm J Lane Dry Plate, loaded into a 9x12cm RADA Normalfaltz Single Plate Holder. Exposed in Plaubel Makiflex Automatic with a lens purchased from an Antique shop in the UK. An 8 inch F4 (?) approx brass projection lens of the Petzval variety. 1/4 sec exposure at wide open F4 (?) approx EI of 1, lightest cloud veiling direct key sun. Almost key light. No fill. Glass neg processed in Ilford Multigrade paper dev 10 mins at 20C.

I also shot frames with modern film, Efke PL100 and FOMA 100. Will be interesting to see the differences.

It does have a period look to it.........

 

[Nokton48]

9x12cm J Lane Dry Plate Makiflex 210 Auto Heliar by Nokton48, on Flickr

The view off my front porch in subzero weather

Plaubel Automatic Makiflex 9x9cm SLR, 9x12cm J Lane Dry Plate developed 18 mins 20c in straight replenished gallon Acufine. Plaubel Makiflex Auto Iris 21cm Heliar. RADA Normalfaltz plate holder in Plaubel Makiflex Adapter. 8x10 Aristo RC #2 Omega DII black 180 Rodagon laser aligned. Iflord Multigrade dev

 

[Ron (Netherlands)]

J Lane Dry Plate Maki Brass Petzval 1 by Nokton48, on Flickr

9x12cm J Lane Dry Plate Test exposed EI 1 dev straight Legacy Mic-X 18 minutes at 60F. Plaubel Makiflex 8 inch Brass Projection Petzval about F4. Arista 8x10 RC Matte #2 dev Multigrade. Omega DII with Omegalite Diffusion Head. RADA 9x12cm Normalfaltz Plate Holder with Makiflex Attachment

Although this thread is not meant to respond on pictures (since it is not really a pictures thread) I'm must say that I get the impression that all your pictures - although made with quite a substantial amount of gear and effort - seem out of focus!
It seems your ground glass screen is not in line with the plates you are using. The latter seems obvious since you are combining a lot of different gear from different make: Plaubel, RADA, Makiflex .....