Rollei Digibase C-41

[JLP]

1. The stabilizer is important according to what i have read in other threads, i don't know what will happen but i suggest that you buy some C41 stabilizer (Kodak is easy to find) Rewash your negatives and run them through the stabilizer.
2. There is only 25ml in the 10 film kit. the 20 film kit comes with 50ml.
25ml should make 500ml working solution.

 

[2F/2F]

It is nice that somebody has put together a kit again, but the price is out of hand compared to Kodak's. When Kodak had the one gallon kit, I used to spend $75 for 7.5 L worth of processing chemicals (at least 64 rolls, and often more, as I would go through the chems a third time with less important pictures). That is 10 dollars per quart, compared with Rollei's price of $35 per liter.

Kodak chemicals can still be purchased individually, for even cheaper than I got the kits for. The developer is $7.50 for a quart of concentrate to make nearly 18 gallons of working solution. At that price, you can even feel ok using it one shot. One shot, you would get 288 rolls, two shot (which works perfectly fine), you would get 576. The fixer is $7.50 to make five gallons. This is theoretically enough to process 300 rolls of film going through the chems only once (twice as many if going through twice), plus you can use the same fixer for all your black and white film and paper processing needs. Again, cheap as dirt, and both of these chemicals can be mixed bit at a time as needed, so they do not spoil. The stabilizer is about $3 a bottle, good for about eight weeks or 180 rolls. The expensive part is the bleach. It is about $40 for about 100 rolls worth of bleach, in a pre-mixed 2.7 L container. (When the one gallon bleach was around, it was $25 for 120 rolls worth.) There is a starter/replenisher way to do it for much cheaper, but I am not familiar with it.

When you do all the maths, you see that for $35, you get about 50 rolls of processing (one shot developer, using other chems twice), compared to Rollei's $35 for 20 rolls reusing the developer multiple times; if one shot developer, it would only be five rolls (or four, as most people do not have five-roll tanks), so the Rollei chemistry is over 10x more expensive...and for what reason?

It is perhaps a good kit for teaching classes, in which the students might shoot 10 to 20 rolls in the course of a class, they do not want to rely on the group chemistry's purity, and they will likely never process color film again. It is also good for those who process infrequently. However, it is economic folly for anyone regularly doing even moderate quantities of color processing at home.

 

[kb3lms]

It WOULD be really nice if Rollei/Compard came out with E6 chemistry. (HINT HINT!)

Whats the kodak part number on the quarts for Flexicolor developer? I need to purchase some. Thanks!

 

[scarletbegonias]

If you live at altitude, you might avoid it.

Hello all,

I'm not sure if this has been addressed, but if you live at altitude, you might find leaky/burst bottles. The West Coast merchant is certainly trustworthy (I'm placing an order through them right now) but living at 7000' creates quite a messy situation. I'm not sure if this applies to you, but if it does, you might wish to pursue a different avenue for C-41 chems.

Larry

 

[Antix818]

I'm confused, does the 10 roll kit make 500ml of working solution or 250ml?

 

[RobertV]

I'm confused, does the 10 roll kit make 500ml of working solution or 250ml?

It's for 2x250ml working solution. But if you have a 500ml tank you have to use it all.
But in 500ml you can develop 1x 220 or 2x 120 roll films or 2x 135-36 films.

 

[AgX]

It WOULD be really nice if Rollei/Compard came out with E6 chemistry. (HINT HINT!)

In Europe there are still 5L E-6 kits on the market by different manufacturers. Even a 1L kit.

So it's an issue of an US importer. Whether it makes sense importing those with own photochemical manufacturers around is something different.

 

[billdlv]

JLP thanks I'll look into getting the Kodak C41 stabilizer. BTW I double checked the instructions that came with the kit, they say 25 ml concentrate will only make 250 ml working solution, not 500.

 

[JLP]

billdlv, The Rollei instructions are at best misleading. I am sure that the 25ml will make 2 x 250ml working solution. The 20 roll kit makes 1000ml working solution but i believe both kits are made to make two sets of working solution therby the confusion about the qty in each.
The 10 roll kit = 2x250ml
The 20 roll kit = 2x500ml

 

[billdlv]

Anybody have times for 1 stop push? Did not see in the instructions.

 

[epatsellis]

3:45, 4:15 for a two stop push, per Kodak's Z-133

 

[2F/2F]

It depends on the film a bit, as some color negs push more easily than others. Kodak sez add 30 seconds for a one stop push of Portra 400 and 800, and add a minute for a two stop push of these films.

 

[JLP]

So far i have not had a need to push the speed of color negative film, how does shadow details hold up and how does grain look like?

Thanks.

 

[2F/2F]

You can't really change the sensitivity of the emulsion ("push the speed") with development. You can just add contrast. Shadow detail captured on the film depends solely on the interplay of subject brightness range (A.K.A. luminance range) and exposure (f stop, shutter speed, and film speed). You cannot add anything that was not captured in the first place.

 

[billdlv]

JLP you have me a bit worried that I mixed the working solutions incorrectly, so please bear with me. For clarification I purchased the small 10 roll kit.

For the developer, parts A,B,C there were 50 ml of each solution. The starter solution was 10 ml. I mixed 345 ml water, 50 ml A,B,C, and 5 ml of the starter. This works out to 500 ml, or 2X 250ml. The capacity of this working solution at best would be 10 rolls according to the "distructions".

For the bleach there was 140 ml of concentrate, mixed with 360 ml of water gives 500 ml working solution with capacity of 14 rolls.

For the fixer there was 100 ml of concentrate, mixed with 400 ml gives 500 ml working solution with capacity of 14 rolls.

Now for the stabilizer, there was 25 ml of concentrate, which would have been mixed with 250 ml of water for a capacity of 15 rolls. This is where I am confused, if this was following the other concentrates there should have been 50 ml to make 500 ml. Based on what I am reading on the instructions, the kit only has 250 ml of solution available, but you should be able to get enough rolls out of the working solution to match the other chems. My problem is that I have a jobo 1520 which I use inversion agitation. So 250 ml is not enough, it needs 485 ml. However I could roll it in which case I only need 240 ml. I'm not worried about rolling since that is not going to affect the image development.

Now I need to get some of the stabilizer, I see the Kodak stuff but it is going to run about $12 and be way more than I need. I might get another kit or just forgo the stabilizer I don't shoot that much color C-41, mainly E-6 and B&W. I've read the forums a bit and found a recipe for mixing it yourself using formalin and photoflow. It seems though that the new stabilizers are not formaldehyde based according to the msds for the rollei kit and the Kodak info on the website for the flexcolor stabilizer?

As for the push 2F/2F spells it out, in my simple mind I think of it as giving whatever got exposed with light on the film more time in the developer since I gave it less exposure that what it needed to be rated at box speed. In my experience color grains less that B&W and you don't get as much shadow detail had you shot the same image with more sensitive film to start. I don't know of any 1600 speed C-41 film, I am shooting in low light without flash. I'm using Fuji Superia 800.

 

[Rollei-Film]

I'm confused, does the 10 roll kit make 500ml of working solution or 250ml?

Dear Antix818,
I would like to clarify the capacity of Digibase C41 Kits.

# RDC14, Digibase C-41 MINI KIT for 0.5 Liter (16.90 US Fluid O), capacity: 10 (400/27°) - 12 (100/21°) films.
# RDC15, Digibase C-41 MIDI KIT for 1.0 Liter (33,81 US Fluid O), capacity: 20 (400/27°) - 24 (100/21°) films.
For US customers: Both Kits are available by Freestyle LA.

In February 2011 Freestyle will offer a additional Kit:
# RDC16, Digibase C-41 MAXI KIT for 2.5 Liter (84.53 US Fluid O), capacity: 50 (400/27°) - 55 (100/21°) films.

At the moment not offered by Freestyle LA:
# RDC17, Digibase C-41 MAXI SUPER KIT for 5.0 Liter (169.07 US Fluid O), capacity: 100 (400/27°) - 110 (100/21°) films.
This is a complete C-41 processing kit, like RDC14; RDC15; RDC16.


Components of the modular color chemistry system Digibase C-41:
At the moment not offered by Freestyle LA:

#RDC01FA C-41 Color Dev. Part A, 1000ml (33,81 US Fluid O) concentrate, up to 200 films.
#RDC01FB C-41 Color Dev. Part B, 1000ml (33,81 US Fluid O) concentrate, up to 200 films.
#RDC01FC C-41 Color Dev. Part C, 1000ml (33,81 US Fluid O) concentrate, up to 200 films.
#RDC01FS C-41 Starter, 100ml (3,38 US Fluid O).
#RDC01BA C-41 Bleacher, 1000ml (33,81 US Fluid O) concentrate, up to 400 films.
#RDC01BB C-41 Fixer, 1000ml (33,81 US Fluid O) concentrate, up to 400 films.
#RDC01S C-41 Stabilizer, 100ml (3,38 US Fluid O) concentrate, 400 films.

Another question has been the working solution of the stabilizer.
The stabilizer can be used twice. (Without agitation!)


With kind regards,
Sebastian Junghans
www.rolleifilm.de

 

[sage]

Will the 5 liter kit/independent chemicals be picked up by freestyle later on as well?

 

[mikecnichols]

Dear Antix818,
I would like to clarify the capacity of Digibase C41 Kits.

# RDC14, Digibase C-41 MINI KIT for 0.5 Liter (16.90 US Fluid O), capacity: 10 (400/27°) - 12 (100/21°) films.
# RDC15, Digibase C-41 MIDI KIT for 1.0 Liter (33,81 US Fluid O), capacity: 20 (400/27°) - 24 (100/21°) films.
For US customers: Both Kits are available by Freestyle LA.

In February 2011 Freestyle will offer a additional Kit:
# RDC16, Digibase C-41 MAXI KIT for 2.5 Liter (84.53 US Fluid O), capacity: 50 (400/27°) - 55 (100/21°) films.

At the moment not offered by Freestyle LA:
# RDC17, Digibase C-41 MAXI SUPER KIT for 5.0 Liter (169.07 US Fluid O), capacity: 100 (400/27°) - 110 (100/21°) films.
This is a complete C-41 processing kit, like RDC14; RDC15; RDC16.


Components of the modular color chemistry system Digibase C-41:
At the moment not offered by Freestyle LA:

#RDC01FA C-41 Color Dev. Part A, 1000ml (33,81 US Fluid O) concentrate, up to 200 films.
#RDC01FB C-41 Color Dev. Part B, 1000ml (33,81 US Fluid O) concentrate, up to 200 films.
#RDC01FC C-41 Color Dev. Part C, 1000ml (33,81 US Fluid O) concentrate, up to 200 films.
#RDC01FS C-41 Starter, 100ml (3,38 US Fluid O).
#RDC01BA C-41 Bleacher, 1000ml (33,81 US Fluid O) concentrate, up to 400 films.
#RDC01BB C-41 Fixer, 1000ml (33,81 US Fluid O) concentrate, up to 400 films.
#RDC01S C-41 Stabilizer, 100ml (3,38 US Fluid O) concentrate, 400 films.

Another question has been the working solution of the stabilizer.
The stabilizer can be used twice. (Without agitation!)


With kind regards,
Sebastian Junghans
www.rolleifilm.de

That's great information!

 

[Rollei-Film]

It is nice that somebody has put together a kit again, but the price is out of hand compared to Kodak's. When Kodak had the one gallon kit, I used to spend $75 for 7.5 L worth of processing chemicals (at least 64 rolls, and often more, as I would go through the chems a third time with less important pictures). That is 10 dollars per quart, compared with Rollei's price of $35 per liter.

Kodak chemicals can still be purchased individually, for even cheaper than I got the kits for. The developer is $7.50 for a quart of concentrate to make nearly 18 gallons of working solution. At that price, you can even feel ok using it one shot. One shot, you would get 288 rolls, two shot (which works perfectly fine), you would get 576. The fixer is $7.50 to make five gallons. This is theoretically enough to process 300 rolls of film going through the chems only once (twice as many if going through twice), plus you can use the same fixer for all your black and white film and paper processing needs. Again, cheap as dirt, and both of these chemicals can be mixed bit at a time as needed, so they do not spoil. The stabilizer is about $3 a bottle, good for about eight weeks or 180 rolls. The expensive part is the bleach. It is about $40 for about 100 rolls worth of bleach, in a pre-mixed 2.7 L container. (When the one gallon bleach was around, it was $25 for 120 rolls worth.) There is a starter/replenisher way to do it for much cheaper, but I am not familiar with it.

When you do all the maths, you see that for $35, you get about 50 rolls of processing (one shot developer, using other chems twice), compared to Rollei's $35 for 20 rolls reusing the developer multiple times; if one shot developer, it would only be five rolls (or four, as most people do not have five-roll tanks), so the Rollei chemistry is over 10x more expensive...and for what reason?

It is perhaps a good kit for teaching classes, in which the students might shoot 10 to 20 rolls in the course of a class, they do not want to rely on the group chemistry's purity, and they will likely never process color film again. It is also good for those who process infrequently. However, it is economic folly for anyone regularly doing even moderate quantities of color processing at home.

The most sold working kits in Europa are produced by Fuji, Rollei and Tetenal. I have compared these prices at the leading British Mail Order House, Firstcall Photographic Ltd.
Here is my list, one time the prices in British Pounds, one time in Euro (exchange rate today is 1,19).


Fuji Press Kit for 5 Liter £ 37,99 € 45,21
price for one film 400/27° € 0,75

Tetenal Colortec 1 Liter £ 14,29 € 17,00
price for one film 400/27° € 2,13

Tetenal Colortec 5 Liter £ 49,99 € 59,49
price for one film 400/27° € 0,99

Rollei Digibase C-41
#RDC14 for 500ml £ 18,99 € 22,60
price for one film 400/27° € 2,26

#RDC15 for 1 Liter £ 24,99 € 29,74
price for one film 400/27° € 1,49

#RDC16 for 2,5 Liter £ 32,99 € 39,26
price for one film 400/27° € 0,79

#RDC17 for 5 Liter £ 39,99 € 47,59
price for one film 400/27° € 0,48

With kind regards
Sebastian Junghans
www.rolleifilm.de

 

[malcolmjs]

Digibase C 41 as one-shot chemistry

I've been developing b&w for some time and using Tetenal C41 more recently. I bought the Rollei kit intending to use it as a one-shot process to eliminate the increasingly long bleach/fix times of the Tetenal when used and returned to stock.

I know I'm not as quick on the uptake as I used to be but I seem to have missed something pretty basic here despite using the other processes.

If anyone has experience of using Digibase in this way and is happy to respond to my elementary questions I would be grateful to hear from them.

 

[malcolmjs]

I have the mini kit making 500ml working solution for 10 films, my Paterson tank takes 290 ml.
Did I make a mistake in thinking I could use the chemistry as single use and discard?
If it is for re-use only, do I have to extend processing times? I may just as well have stayed with Tetenal ..
Why is life so difficult?

 

[wblynch]

If you use single shot you only have enough for one roll of film.

Too expensive. Must reuse.

 

[mikecnichols]

I have done 8-10 rolls and have not had to increase my times. I also combined the Kodak standard times in conjunction with the Rollei kit instructions, so I am doing a bleach for 6min 30 sec and a fix for the same time. Be sure to do water baths between bleach and fix and between fix and stabilizer. These make all the difference in the world from what I've experienced.

 

[malcolmjs]

Digibase C 41
Thanks for the help. It's clear that I was misinformed...explains why the information sheet seemed so inadequate. I'll be having some words with my supplier.

 

[keeklo]

Hello,

I've been trying to find either the 500ml or 1l kit in the U.S. and it seems almost impossible. Freestylephoto won't be having them before March 2011 (!!!). This morning, I found the 500ml kit on Digitaltruth.com and tonight, it's out of stock!!! I should have ordered right away... Does anyone know where I can find a kit online or in a store in the New York area?
Thanks!