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110/16mm Camera Image Quality

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xkaes said:
Very nice results -- and with 100 film. I guess that ISO 100 is as low as you can go with the Pentax 110 -- am I wrong about that?
Click to expand...
yes, you are right, there is only ISO 100 and 400 see https://www.subcompactcam.com/110_pentax_auto.htm. As there are filter threads, you could "fool" the camera with ND filters, but using ready loaded cartriges with real 110 film is such a relief...
 
Well, you can use ND filters on the Pentax 110 SLR if you want to use faster than 400 speed film, but how can you use slower than 100 ISO speed film and still get it correctly exposed?
 
xkaes said:
Well, you can use ND filters on the Pentax 110 SLR if you want to use faster than 400 speed film, but how can you use slower than 100 ISO speed film and still get it correctly exposed?
Click to expand...

Shooting 50 speed film at 100 isn't going to kill it. With some cameras you can put a filter over the electric eye. Instamatic 60 comes to mind. I've shot microfilm through it and had good results.
 
xkaes said:
Very nice results -- and with 100 film. I guess that ISO 100 is as low as you can go with the Pentax 110 -- am I wrong about that?
Click to expand...

Thank you. Even though I only used two 110 cameras (the other one Rollei A110 is no slouch), the Pentax Auto 110 is definitely in a league of its own. And so far I like the 50/2.8 lens best. The Orca 100 film performs well with Adox FX-39 II. And I did no sharpening on those scans.

Yes Pentax Auto 110 can do ISO 100 or 400 film. I actually bought my own bulk roll of Kodak Double-X 16mm 100ft, mainly because 200 is more versatile ISO for indoor/outdoor occasions. I saw there is a newish Foma 100 in 16mm single perf 100ft package, which might get even finer grain.

I try to avoid slicing 35mm or 120 in the dark with very sharp razors.
 
blee1996 said:
Thank you. Even though I only used two 110 cameras (the other one Rollei A110 is no slouch), the Pentax Auto 110 is definitely in a league of its own. And so far I like the 50/2.8 lens best. The Orca 100 film performs well with Adox FX-39 II. And I did no sharpening on those scans.

Yes Pentax Auto 110 can do ISO 100 or 400 film. I actually bought my own bulk roll of Kodak Double-X 16mm 100ft, mainly because 200 is more versatile ISO for indoor/outdoor occasions. I saw there is a newish Foma 100 in 16mm single perf 100ft package, which might get even finer grain.

I try to avoid slicing 35mm or 120 in the dark with very sharp razors.
Click to expand...

"there is a newish Foma 100 in 16mm single perf 100ft package"? Have you any further info about this?
 
Cholentpot said:
Shooting 50 speed film at 100 isn't going to kill it. With some cameras you can put a filter over the electric eye. Instamatic 60 comes to mind. I've shot microfilm through it and had good results.
Click to expand...

Sure, but the Pentax 110 SLR is TTL metering, isn't it?
 
blee1996 said:
I saw there is a newish Foma 100 in 16mm single perf 100ft package, which might get even finer grain.
Click to expand...

I'll have to check this out. That's great NEWS -- if I can get it.

I just checked and all I see is a reversal film for movie cameras.
 
WD4AON said:
"there is a newish Foma 100 in 16mm single perf 100ft package"? Have you any further info about this?
Click to expand...

Both the ISO 100 negative and the reversal film (100R) have been available in the small cine formats (16 mm single and double perf and double 8) for many years. The 100R has a silver antihalation layer, so it's tricky to get a usable negative from it, but folks have done it.
 
xkaes said:
Well, you can use ND filters on the Pentax 110 SLR if you want to use faster than 400 speed film, but how can you use slower than 100 ISO speed film and still get it correctly exposed.
Click to expand...

xkaes said:
Sure, but the Pentax 110 SLR is TTL metering, isn't it?
Click to expand...
you got it. So no fooling of the camera, just influencing the speeds and aperture.
 
The beauty of the 16 mm single perf is that it also works in every Rada cassette submini camera (some require single, some will work equally well with unperfed), Minolta 16 and Yashica 16 compatibles, and most other 16 mm cameras (a very few need double perf).
 
WD4AON said:
Buy one or two of Jim Anderson's 3D printed reels. Paterson size fits Yankee Master, Yankee Clipper, Paterson, and JOBO, too.
Click to expand...

Go those a while back. Also lucked out and have a pair of metal 16mm reels. Thems pretty rare.
 
I got some free 16mm microfilm, then went and bought about $20 more of a couple of different types, and now I have 600 total feet of the stuff. Will I ever use it? Who knows! If I find a camera I like enough and a developing solution that works, it'll definitely be a cheap way to shoot with film...though I'm not sure there's much of a point, really.

I picked up a Minolta 16QT and shot a few strips of Fuji HR-21 with it. As it turns out, the shutter is slowish, so lots of motion blur on the 1/30 setting. A camera that essentially limits you to 1/166 isn't necessarily the best fit for microfilm! The lens is ok in the center, but not fantastic on the borders. With a better lens and the same film, I don't see why you couldn't print a well-scanned frame at 16x20.

Full frame, shot at around ISO 80-100. I think this film/dev combo (HW Control) will probably end up being the most useful at ISO 50.
Scan01125.jpg

100% crop of the original. The dimensions are 5600x3900...I don't feel like doing the DPI math on that!
qtcrop.jpg
 
Microfilm and small cameras were made for each other -- and large prints are no problem. Since microfilm often needs LOW ISO -- 20-40 or lower (depends on the developer), it's best to have a camera with a full set of speeds. The Minolta MG-s has the same 12x17mm image size as the QT, and all the speeds from 1/30 to 1/500 -- and you can set the f-stop. And it has a tripod socket, but no SLOW speeds, and the lens does not focus. The later Kiev cameras might be an option, too.

http://www.subclub.org/creative/divide.htm
 
xkaes said:
Microfilm and small cameras were made for each other -- and large prints are no problem. Since microfilm often needs LOW ISO -- 20-40 or lower (depends on the developer), it's best to have a camera with a full set of speeds. The Minolta MG-s has the same 12x17mm image size as the QT, and all the speeds from 1/30 to 1/500 -- and you can set the f-stop. And it has a tripod socket, but no SLOW speeds, and the lens does not focus. The later Kiev cameras might be an option, too.

http://www.subclub.org/creative/divide.htm
Click to expand...

I definitely don't think I can live with a fixed-focus camera. I might go for a Mamiya Super 16 even though the frame size is smaller, since the features look great and the camera itself is real purty. The 110ED was appealing too until I realized how big it is, but I'll probably buy one anyway. I'd love an Auto 110 if there were any way to trick the meter into a slower speed, though I do have some Copex Rapid that might make it to ISO 80 in HW Control with the AH layer prewashed out. Orrrr I might shim the film gate of an SLR to get the 16mm on the right focus plane and have a neato panorama setup. Fun stuff...though I bet I'll get sick of it within a few months!

By the way, that's a great page. I suppose I've inadvertently been doing something a bit like a divided developer in washing out the AH layer with a dilute sodium carbonate solution, but the developer has carbonate in it too, so who knows. I definitely don't notice a difference in results other than the elimination of streaking.
 
xkaes said:
The later Kiev cameras might be an option, too.
Click to expand...

I'll agree with this. My Kiev 30 is my go-to for 16 mm. With a good shutter speed range and B (less than useful, given no cable socket or tripod mount and the Minolta clamp won't fit over the plastic shell), the focusing lens (a decent triplet) lets you make very good images. If you have steady hands, at least...
 
Donald Qualls said:
I'll agree with this. My Kiev 30 is my go-to for 16 mm. With a good shutter speed range and B (less than useful, given no cable socket or tripod mount and the Minolta clamp won't fit over the plastic shell), the focusing lens (a decent triplet) lets you make very good images. If you have steady hands, at least...
Click to expand...
I have quite some 16mm cameras with B shutter speed

Edixa 16 MB
Mec 16 SB
Mamiya Super
Mamiya 16 Automatic
Mamiya 16 EE de luxe
Rollei 16 S

see https://www.subcompactcam.com/

My 110 cameras tend to have an electronic shutter, but there a many with long speeds:

Agfamatic 6008 Macro Pocket Sensor 15 sec.
Balda 1000 EL BR and 1000 EL RX 4 sec.
Canon 110ED 8 sec.
Minolta Pocket Autopak 470 2sec.
Minolta 110 Zoom SLR 10 sec.
Minox 110S 4 sec.
Rollei A110 4 sec.
Vivitar 742XL 5 sec.
Voigltländer Vitoret 110EL 4 sec.

Only the Minolta 110 Zoom SLR Mark II has a B setting and the new LomoMatic 110 has a 30 sec. max B setting

They are all on the site metioned above.
 
It just occurred to me, it ought to be possible to 3D print a Kiev 30 compatible version of the Minolta 16 clamp to allow tripod mounting and cable release connection. Might even include an accessory shoe to attach a flash (the Kiev 30 has a PC sync socket). Alternatively, even to 3D print a replacement shell that offers these options...
 
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