Split grade printing question

[adelorenzo]

Because some day you will hit the limits of what merely changing grades can do. And if you can avoid making a registered mask or need to make an 'impossible' burn they are life & material savers. Or maybe you want to finesse highlights to make the print feel right.

Don't get me wrong, I use both overall and local bleaching when I need it. But if I can get the results I want using different filters I'll take that every time. It makes life way easier on the processing end.

Meanwhile flashing paper requires a second enlarger, dedicated light source and/or removing the negative.

 

[ic-racer]

This graph shows what split grade exposures do in terms of standard print contrast nomenclature (ISO (R) values for contrast).
For example Blue exposure zero seconds and yellow 120 gives iso 1.9 or about grade 00. Likewise exposure Blue 15 sec and Green 60 sec gives the same middle gray value in the print but with an overall contrast iso of 1.2 or grade 1. etc.
Likewise Blue 50sec and Green 12 sec gives the same middle gray as the other two but with an overall iso 0.7 or grade 4.
BTW the different colored lines are don't deal with exposure color, they are just to follow the lines easier with your eye.

 

[alentine]

Found this:

Find the ISO(R) of the paper from the manufacturer's data. ISO(R) is the density range required to give a full tonal range, to two significant figures, with no decimal points. Thus ISO(R) 90 is a density range of 0,90.
Do not forget the importance of enlarger + lens flare. To take an easy but not inconceivable case, if your enlarger + lens has a flare factor of 2 (1 stop, log = 0,3) then you need a log density of 1,20 on the neg to give a full brightness range.
Paper grades are NOT standardized, so one manufacturer's paper grades may have a different ISO(R) from others. There's a lot of overlap, but very roughly, grades go from under ISO(R) 40 (grade 5 graded) to ISO(R) 180+ (grade 00 VC). That's from memory after a big dinner and lots of wine so don't hold me to it...

Cheers,

R. (and you might find The Photo School at www.rogerandfrances.com interesting)

 

[alentine]

This graph shows what split grade exposures do in terms of standard print contrast nomenclature (ISO (R) values for contrast).
For example Blue exposure zero seconds and yellow 120 gives iso 1.9 or about grade 00. Likewise exposure Blue 15 sec and Green 60 sec gives the same middle gray value in the print but with an overall contrast iso of 1.2 or grade 1. etc.
Likewise Blue 50sec and Green 12 sec gives the same middle gray as the other two but with an overall iso 0.7 or grade 4.
BTW the different colored lines are don't deal with exposure color, they are just to follow the lines easier with your eye.

Thanks indeed racer.
The chart is much useful.
This is my sketching on the same chart, hope no mistakes.
If there is any, please let me know to delete it or change it.

For the red circle on the chart above,
If the same print was printed on grade4 directly using a colour head and same paper batch/development, No split grade filtration, what's exactly the difference between the 2 prints?

 

[Rudeofus]

My impression is that there is no difference. One possible advantage of split grade would be different burn/dodge regimes at different gradations. At the same time, overall burn/dodge is much more of a hassle with split grade.

 

[ic-racer]

Thanks indeed racer.
The chart is much useful.
This is my sketching on the same chart, hope no mistakes.
If there is any, please let me know to delete it or change it.
View attachment 208341
For the red circle on the chart above,
If the same print was printed on grade4 directly using a colour head and same paper batch/development, No split grade filtration, what's exactly the difference between the 2 prints?

Should be the same. Only the photographer knows if the print is made with a single exposure of mixed light or two exposures. The paper can't tell the difference.

 

[ic-racer]

I think split grade is good for photographers that want one exposure for the highlights (green or yellow) and another for the shadows (blue or magenta). I found it too hard for me to zero in on the middle values.
Single mixed light exposure is good for me because I like to set an overall print intensity for the middle values then, while keeping those middle values the same, increase or decrease contrast to my liking.

Also, this is a tip with a tungsten lamp Dichroic head: to burn with yellow (to burn a highlight) you can just as well burn with white instead. The amount of blue light in the "white" is less than the green (see graph). The reason this is good to know is some color heads allow all the filters to be removed from the path with a single lever or button. Rather than having to dial in 200cc of yellow and 0cc Magenta just to do a highlight burn. Try it some time.

 

[Pieter12]

My impression is that there is no difference. One possible advantage of split grade would be different burn/dodge regimes at different gradations. At the same time, overall burn/dodge is much more of a hassle with split grade.

Not really. I believe you can make overall moves with a single grade filter.

 

[Lachlan Young]

Also, this is a tip with a tungsten lamp Dichroic head: to burn with yellow (to burn a highlight) you can just as well burn with white instead. The amount of blue light in the "white" is less than the green (see graph). The reason this is good to know is some color heads allow all the filters to be removed from the path with a single lever or button. Rather than having to dial in 200cc of yellow and 0cc Magenta just to do a highlight burn. Try it some time.

I'd agree on this approach. Or set enough M to get the shadows you want & post-flash (+dodging & burning) for the highlights. Not hard to do, looks amazing, but not terribly popular outside of the world of professional printers. Probably because it's not a readily marketable doctrine but relies on the printer's taste & judgement.

 

[scheimfluger_77]

I always do a test strip with the soft filter to determine exposure for the high values. Make a print. Then make another soft print, switch to high contrast filter, and make a test strip over top. Sometimes adjustments to for the soft filter exposure need to be made. I use large, blue, and green Roscoe filters above the negative for large format. I sometimes split grade with my VCL4500 head. Split grade is such an easy and effective way to print.

Which Rosco gel numbers do you use for blue and green?

 

[alentine]

I'd agree on this approach.

Thanks Lachlan.
Burning in without dichroic filter is in fact burning on grade 2. It has advantage only of gaining around 1 stop comparing with equivalent filters. Now we are back to the first point!
What's exactly the difference in the print or in the method capability, between direct and split grade printing?

Or set enough M to get the shadows you want & post-flash (+dodging & burning) for the highlights. .

I do not think post flash will be easy. Could you Lachlan explain it?
As far as I understand, the only advantage that usually and repeatedly explained with split grade printing over direct, is easier dodging/burning in.
But, even the beginner printers know that they should burn in with lower grade filters after direct printing on the optimal grade for overall contrast, but that does not "technically" make the whole process split grade, though "effectively" it is.
This 5 pages PDF link has a very useful information(click the underlined text or the link):
http://www.berk-edu.com/BAS_subsite/PDF_bas/SplitFiltration2b.pdf
This technique works well with negatives "that" are relatively flat (not contrasty) with lots of texture and detail.
It looks that split grade is only for easier negatives.
When studying the results and comparison on page 4, anybody can realize that split grade technique is much sophisticated than the achievement.
Could not understand why the comparison was not done with grade 2.5 at little more exposure direct print, for example?

 

[CMoore]

From: darkroom Dave:

• In simple terms, the grade 0 low contrast exposure gives you control of the light grey areas in your print. To add more detail in these ‘highlights’ increase the grade 0 exposure time. To increase the overall print contrast increase the grade to 0.5, 1, 1.5 or 2. Be careful to avoid having white patches with no detail in your print. If this happens reduce the contrast again. Obviously if your print looks dull and without any bright areas (assuming it should have bright areas!) then decrease the exposure times until you see some.
• The high contrast exposure gives you control of the blacks and shadows. Increase this time until you see good blacks or decrease it until you can see some details in the shadows without completely losing your blacks. Be careful not to reduce your blacks to dark grey or your print will look low contrast! I always use grade 5 for the high contrast exposure.

The text is from: Darkroom Dave
Click the Text above, or this link:
http://www.darkroomdave.com/tutorial/split-grade-printing/

There is a lot of good (and valuable) discussion on this thread but the simple answer to your question is to try changing the 00 filter to a 0 or 1. This will boost the overall contrast of the print.

This has always confused my about split-printing.
Contrast .....when i read that word, i think the picture has lots of whites and lots of blacks, and not a not of "Mid-Tones".
Why would decreasing the soft filter...going from 0 to 1...increase the contrast. Wouldn't that reduce contrast.?
Thank You

 

[MattKing]

This has always confused my about split-printing.
Contrast .....when i read that word, i think the picture has lots of whites and lots of blacks, and not a not of "Mid-Tones".
Why would decreasing the soft filter...going from 0 to 1...increase the contrast. Wouldn't that reduce contrast.?
Thank You

When you go from a 0 filter to a 1 filter you are increasing the contrast. Just as when you go from 1 to 2, or 2 to 3, or 3 to 4 etc.
When a picture has lots of blacks and lots of whites it doesn't necessarily have lots of contrast. What it has is a wide range of tones.
Contrast is a measure of how similar tones are differentiated. A low contrast result will reveal tiny differences between similar tones, while a higher contrast result will reveal larger and more distinct differences between similar tones.
Think of two images as if they were stairways - the low contrast one has little steps and a shallow incline, whereas the high contrast one has bigger steps, and a steeper incline.
Multigrade paper has at least two emulsions, and one controls contrast by varying the response of the two (or more) emulsions. The lower the contrast filter number, the less it acts on the faster, blue sensitive emulsion and the more it acts on he slower, green sensitive emulsion. An image built mostly from the green sensitive emulsion will be fairly low in contrast but fairly complete.
Exposures through the lower number filters give you a fairly complete but low contrast image - the highlights and midtones are well revealed, but the shadows are weak and the tones are close to each other. Exposures through the higher number filters darken and accentuate the mid-tones and dark parts of the image, and cause the tones to differentiate themselves from each other.

 

[Patrick Robert James]

Someone really needs to write a flow chart for printing one of these days.

I split print everything. I've been doing it for a couple decades now. Currently on my Focomat I use blue57/green58 glass filters below the lens. On my Saunders I use the yellow/magenta of the VCCE head. I just dial it all the way in each direction. It works great. Never had any issues with highlights people talk about. I think that might be a product of the negative, but everyone has a different type of thing they do.

I look at split grade printing as finding your end points. Those need a certain amount of light regardless of the rest of the image. You can then adjust the rest of the image accordingly by dodging or burning the individual hard or soft filters. Or flashing. Or SLIMT. Lots of things adjust the middle. I think it is a way better system, but everyone has their own thing, so whatever works.....

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Which Rosco gel numbers do you use for blue and green?

Rosco's CalColor Filter Kit. Couldn't tell you the numbers, but I can tell you that I use the deepest blue and deepest green filters. The filters are a foot square. They've worked really well for me over the years.

https://ca.rosco.com/en/product/calcolor-filter-kit

 

[CMoore]

When you go from a 0 filter to a 1 filter you are increasing the contrast. Just as when you go from 1 to 2, or 2 to 3, or 3 to 4 etc.
When a picture has lots of blacks and lots of whites it doesn't necessarily have lots of contrast. What it has is a wide range of tones.
Contrast is a measure of how similar tones are differentiated. A low contrast result will reveal tiny differences between similar tones, while a higher contrast result will reveal larger and more distinct differences between similar tones.

Wow...OK.
I have had it all wrong.
What you describe as "High Contrast" certainly jibes with what other have said (and is what has been confusing me).
What you guys are calling High Contrast, i would have called it Normal Contrast.
My thinking was.....a HIGH Contrast photo would have Blacks and Whites, and nothing in between.

 

[MattKing]

Wow...OK.
I have had it all wrong.
What you describe as "High Contrast" certainly jibes with what other have said (and is what has been confusing me).
What you guys are calling High Contrast, i would have called it Normal Contrast.
My thinking was.....a HIGH Contrast photo would have Blacks and Whites, and nothing in between.

Two renditions of the same image:
One I would describe as low in contrast, while the other I would describe as normal to high contrast:

 

[CMoore]

Thanks Matt -
Thanks.
Yes...In your example, if i had printed that bottom photo, i would have thought it had low contrast, and would have increased the Magenta to get a "better" photo...going from 2 to 3 for example.
I guess, with the Split Printing, i was thinking 0 would give whiter whites and 5 would give blacker blacks, creating a "high contrast" photo.
I simply need to spend more time with 1 or 2 negatives, and really get a better understanding of how the 0 and 5 work, and effect the final print when used together, in a Split Print scenario.
Thanks Again

 

[David Allen]

"Is there any fundamental difference between split grade printing or printing with properly selected multigrade filters (or a color head) ? In theory an equally timed exposure with grade 00 and grade 5 filters should be equal to grade 2.5".

Yes there is a big difference. If you use the 00 - 5 split-grade system you are laying a 00 exposure over the whole image. Now most lower values (shadows, and darker grey areas) are not one single tone but have a range of tones, spectral highlights, etc that, in combination, appear as say a Zone III. If you print with grade 2.5 these variations will be retained, However, if you use the 00 - 5 split-grade system all of the small areas of lighter tones will receive a 00 exposure that takes them move towards grey and makes the print appear flat (or at least loose it’s brilliance).

"Meanwhile flashing paper requires a second enlarger, dedicated light source and/or removing the negative".

For pre-flashing paper there is absolutely no need for a second enlarger. The simplest way is to buy a thin piece of semi-opaque acrylic and hold this under the lens and do your pre-flash. No need to remove the negative, no need for an extra enlarger or light source, etc.

Bests,

David.
www.dsallen.de

 

[Frank53]

Since I came back to the darkroom after 15 years I’m doing only split grade printing. I’m using the Heiland system (it came with the LPL 7452 I bought) so I have no choice, there is only 00 and 5.

My experience is that I can give a print any look I want and all arguments “against” split grade are imho based on not using all possibilities of split grade. There is a learning curve of course, but you can reach any result you can wish for.

It all starts with scanning (measuring) the negative. Often you get a good working print measuring the whole negative, but sometimes the result will be flat, as mentioned by others. In those cases it helps to leave ie the sky out when measuring the negative. The flatness will be gone and you can burn in the sky later using only 00.

Regards,
Frank

 

[CMoore]

I do not know what The Heiland System is, but if you COULD use other filters...would you.?
When i first Heard/Read about split printing...it always seemed easy..."You" used the 0 and the 5. The only thing that would vary is the time for each filter.
As i read more, i started to see some people "complain" about the 0 and 5 making for a "Flat" or uninspired print.
So it gets confusing. I realize there are frequently more than one way to accomplish something, but i kind of that that was the whole point of split printing.....0 and 5...vary the time, and you can make any print that was possible with a single filter, but you had more control when you split them in half.....

 

[Frank53]

I do not know what The Heiland System is, but if you COULD use other filters...would you.?
When i first Heard/Read about split printing...it always seemed easy..."You" used the 0 and the 5. The only thing that would vary is the time for each filter.
As i read more, i started to see some people "complain" about the 0 and 5 making for a "Flat" or uninspired print.
So it gets confusing. I realize there are frequently more than one way to accomplish something, but i kind of that that was the whole point of split printing.....0 and 5...vary the time, and you can make any print that was possible with a single filter, but you had more control when you split them in half.....

No, I would not use other filters if I could (well actually I can by using ie under the lens filters)
Using 00 and 5 is the whole idea of split grade.
It is a simple system and why make it more complicated?
As I explaned, getting flat prints is a matter of deciding what part of the negative has to be taken into account when measuring (or when making test strips)
https://heilandelectronic.de/splitgrade
Kind regards,
Frank

 

[CMoore]

Yeah...sounds good to me.
Like i said, there is always more than one way to do things, but using max filters is the way i was introduced to it, and makes sense. I will just stick with that, and put the time in to get better.....Thanks.
BTW, i am not a computer guy. Id there some basic way i can get your link translated to English.?
Do i just search Yahoo for some kind of Translator "program".?
Thanks Again

 

[Ozxplorer]

some basic way i can get your link translated to English.?

Yes... at the top right-hand side of the page is a representation of the British flag... click on it and the page changes to English from German and “vice versa”.

 

[CMoore]

Thank You.....