Rollei Digibase C-41

polyglot · Jun 4, 2011

dbla: you are absolutely meant to reuse/replenish it. Each film uses only a fraction of the capacity of each solution. Even worse if you discard after processing a 4x5, which is only 1/4 of a roll! The question is whether you're willing to push the chems twice as far as Rollei recommends.

dbla · Jun 4, 2011

Cool, I'm gonna guesstimate that 5 uses are about all I can expect to get out of it... I usually run 10 sheet batches... 210ml a batch.

cbphoto · Jun 20, 2011

Does anyone know where in the US to buy individual components? Freestyle only sells the kits.

dwilks · Jul 31, 2011

Hey folks. this is one of the most valuable posts i've read online in a long time!! You all are pretty awesome.

Most importantly :
Did anyone develop a technique for using the 250ml working solution in a 500ml tank? Not sure i totally understood what Rollei meant by saying you can use it twice.. with no agitation. do i let it sit for 1 min and then flip the tank upside-down for another min? seems weird. anyway, i'll do whatever.

More general help :
After purchasing the 500ml kit i realize that the tank i have is an AP Compact that needs 590ml working solution for 120mm and 650ml for 2x rolls of 35mm.

Freestlyle is closed tomorrow. Do you think i can get away with doing two rolls of 35mm with 500ml solution in a 650ml tank? Till i can get more of the chemicals....

I already pre-washed 1 roll of 35mm and so now its still in the tank and in the fridge. Is that film ruined? (its just test shots.) it will sit overnight till i can get to samy's to get some containers.

thanks for any help
doug

zsas · Jul 31, 2011

WELCOME TO APUG!!

How many ml does your tank need to process 1 roll of 35mm?

Couldn’t you mix up your full C-41, get 500ml of working solution, put your 1 roll of 35mm in the tank, on the bottom, then put a blank 35mm reel on top of that and develop? Dont do two since two need more than that amount of working solution that you have.

I wouldn’t recommend doing 120 also since it needs more than 500ml of working solution for your tank.

Also, I believe you have misunderstood the reply that Rollei-Film gave on 12-02-10, Rollei-Film was talking only about the stabilizer being able to be used twice without agitation. He/she said:
"Another question has been the working solution of the stabilizer. The stabilizer can be used twice. (Without agitation!)"
per (there was a url link here which no longer exists)

Last, I dont believe pre-washed film can ruin whilst sitting in water so long as it is light tight, but I defer to others here...

dwilks · Jul 31, 2011

thanks for the warm welcome!

ok. got it. i will not attempt 2 rolls at once or a roll of 120 until i can get more chems from freestyle (monday).

oh regarding the stabilizer. i totally mistyped. sorry.
So i was planning to make a 500ml working solution; since that is the limit of my kit. they give you enough to make 500 ml of developer, bleach, fix, but only enough to make 250ml of stabilizer. I am looking at the bottle now it says Cont: 25ml. Thats enough to make 250ml working solution of stabilizer. 1 35mm roll in my AP compact tank takes a 375ml working solution of stabilizer according to their instructions.

So now to what Rollei was saying, does that address the (lack of?) stabilizer? So do i just make the 250ml working solution and "use it twice"? what does that mean? (this is why i assumed maybe let it sit for 1 min and then invert the tank for another min or something...)

I hope that was more clear this time. It was really late when i wrote that and i think i was loosing my marbles!

doug

zsas · Jul 31, 2011

That is exactly why I bought the 1 liter solution so I would have 500 ml of stabilizer stock. I think in your instance, you might need even more since your 120 needs 590ml of stock and your 2 roll needs almost 700ml.

My tank only needs 500ml of stock to do 2 35mm and 1 roll of 120 so I was able to just use the medium Rollei Digibase kit.

So in your situation, you might want to buy something like this also and mix up 1 liter of stabilizer? I think I saw someone saying that in this thread as a solution. I dont believe in the US you can buy just the Rollei stabilizer but the Kodak should work?

http://www.calumetphoto.com/eng/product/kodak_c41_stabilizer_replenisher_iii/kp02858?gdftrk=gdfV23423_a_7c1267_a_7c4147_a_7cKP02858

MattKing · Jul 31, 2011

For 120, your AP tank and the stabilizer step, just put 300 ml of solution in the tank, turn it on it's side and gently roll it continuously through the entire time.

Or if you have a roller processor of some sort (Beseler, Cibachrome, Unicolour, JOBO etc.) let it do the work.

You can do this with any of the solutions. It is though a bit of a challenge to maintain the temperature of the developer to within the necessary tight tolerances.

mikecnichols · Aug 1, 2011

As far as the stabilzer step. What I have been doing is after a long rinse after fixing, I pour out the water, open the lid, take out my reel(s) and then shake out as much water as possible. Next, I pour the stabilizer in and I dunk each reel separately for the required time. This has eliminated two things. It eliminates the need to agitate (and the creation of air bubbles on my negs) and it helps me know that each roll has been fully submerged.

zsas · Aug 1, 2011

Wow what a simple and elegant solution! Great idea!

Diapositivo · Aug 1, 2011

Best would be to open the tank, take out to reel, and put either only the film, or the reel with film, on the stabilizer.

Some people warn that stabilizer is no good for your reel, but you can clean your reels with toothbrush etc.
The funnel and the light labyrinth of the tank are not so easy to clean inside. And you want to avoid any contamination by final rinse or stabilizer. So I would avoid having the tank getting in touch with the stabilizer. Your mileage may vary.

mikecnichols · Aug 2, 2011

Diapositivo said:
Best would be to open the tank, take out to reel, and put either only the film, or the reel with film, on the stabilizer.

Some people warn that stabilizer is no good for your reel, but you can clean your reels with toothbrush etc.
The funnel and the light labyrinth of the tank are not so easy to clean inside. And you want to avoid any contamination by final rinse or stabilizer. So I would avoid having the tank getting in touch with the stabilizer. Your mileage may vary.

I take the film out. I do keep the film on the reels, but wash immediately afterward to avoid them gunking up. To keep my fingers clean, I dunk each reel (separately), leaving it on the center that they slide down on to be put into the tank.

Ever since I started doing this method, my results have been a lot better.

Ottrdaemmerung · Aug 2, 2011

Question:
I've found that regardless of brand, C-41 developer always dies on me after about six weeks if I haven't used it to exhaustion by then. I know that the capacities of C-41 bleach and fixer in the Digibase kit differ from that of the developer. Are they prone to "expiring" as well if they haven't been used in a couple of months (but stored well), or are they rather inert?

I haven't used my last batch of Digibase chemicals in over a month, and I'm about to shoot a bunch of C-41 while on vacation, so I'm wondering if my old, but not exhausted, bleach and fixer will still function as they should.

dwilks · Aug 2, 2011

on the same note :whats the preferred way to store it for longevity?
i have regular bottles (they don't compress). should i try putting gas in the bottles to limit the oxygen? what do you all recommend for that.

doug

tbeaman · Aug 3, 2011

I've had good luck using common PETE plastic bottles, squeezing the air out, and then keeping them in the fridge. It was the Unicolor powder press kit, but I had a batch mixed in November that I used until sometime in the spring, and I only stopped because I didn't want to push my luck.

guyjr · Aug 21, 2011

Quick sanity check question: what color should the "Part C" concentrate look like when it is poured from the bottle into the measuring cylinder? Mine is pretty darn opaque / purple, and I am afraid that it has gone bad, but I want to confirm first before assuming the worst. I mainly use this stuff one-shot when developing 120 film in a Jobo tank, and I have to say I have not had good results at all (and I'm comparing against the true Fuji 3 bath kit that one can get from macodirect, which gave me superb results throughout its 5L lifetime). My most recent run of three films (in a 3 reel tank @ 330ml of working solution) produced horrible contrasty images, bordering on overexposed. I want to try and narrow down the culprit, and I believe it is either the Part C or possibly I didn't measure temp precisely enough before starting. Everything else in my process I know I hit spot on as before.

Thanks for the help in advance,

Guy

zsas · Aug 21, 2011

As far as what color Dev Part C should look like, mine looks like Merlot wine. I have had my kit about a month, mixed half as working solution, you see below the other half, that I have not mixed.

Re you issue, gosh, 330ml of working solution for three rolls of film seem a bit "thin". When I run 1 roll of 35 or 120, I use 500ml, just to ensure enough of the active agents in the chemistry are there. It might be a bit conservative, but has worked for me. Although I process by hand so maybe 330ml on a Jobo is normal.

Not sure what the min amount of developer per roll Digibase recommends, it might be in here?
http://www.freestylephoto.biz/pdf/product_pdfs/compard/Compard_C41_Instructions.pdf

guyjr · Aug 21, 2011

zsas, that is a good point regarding the volume used. I basically had carried over the volume from what I did when working with the Fuji Hunt C-41 chemicals, and wanting to keep volumes to a minimum I think that number is partly derived from the minimum that Jobo state is needed to cover 120 film when loaded in the tank on 3 reels.

Thanks for posting the photo of Part C too! That really helps... I've been wanting to buy a full-on color calibration chart for a while now, and I think this is going to be the reason I use to get one. With an upcoming family vacation, I'm planning on shooting quite a bit of negative & positive film, and don't want a repeat of this last run (which did surprise me given how consistent things had been before I started using the Rollei chemicals).

guyjr · Aug 22, 2011

Here is a sample image from the set. I also notice a rather strange vertical band along the right edge... I'm a bit puzzled as to what would have caused that, since in the rotary tank, the entire width & height of the film would have been immersed.

(scanned with Silverfast SE for Epson V750).

theoria · Aug 22, 2011

guyjr said:
I'm a bit puzzled as to what would have caused that, since in the rotary tank, the entire width & height of the film would have been immersed.

Looks like a light leak to me

Rollei-Film · Aug 22, 2011

Statement from Maco Hamburg/Germany:

Rollei Digibase C-41 Kits contain 3 color developer (Part A, Part B, Part C).
Only Part C is sensetive to oxygen.
The original color of Part C is yellow.

After partial use the remaining liquid needs to be protected from oxygen either by adding protective gas or by transferring the liquid to smaller bottles.
When turning from yellow to red this particular developer part is no longer applicable.

These instructions are part of the product specification provided by MACO:

"The very high life period of the original concentrates is min. 3 years.
(Retention samples, produced 5 years ago, are still working well)
The only exception is color developer Part C.
The life period of color developer Part C is 2 - 3 years, depending on the storage temperatures.
Information:
The coloring of the Part C concentrate has to be yellow.
If the coloring changes into red, the concentrate does not work anymore.

In this case, you can buy single replacements for Part C:

#RDC05FC 100ml concentrate
#RDC01FC 1000ml concentrate."

With kind regards,
Sebastian Junghans

zsas · Aug 22, 2011

Thanks for confirmation of Part C. Do you have an American distributor of individual chemistry?

I have only seen the full Digibase kits available here in the US.

Thanks!

guyjr · Aug 22, 2011

Hi Sebastian... first thanks for the info, that is really helpful!

I ordered two of the 1000ml kits from Freestyle in the U.S. back in April 2011. When I went to open the second kit, the Part C dev was already a deep dark purple (not really red, but most definitely not yellow). That would suggest to me that the bottle was not airtight and that the Part C should be replaced with fresh chemistry. Since it has only been 4 months since I received the kit, it seems like there might be a problem with the way the kits are assembled if the developer Part C is not lasting for the 2 - 3 years that Maco indicate it should.

jbl · Aug 22, 2011

This is really helpful. I have the 1L kit that I bought a few weeks ago. I've been unable to get the negatives to look right and I did notice that my Part C developer is purple. I called Freestyle just now and they said there was an issue with the 1L kits and specifically the Part C developer in the 1L kit. For anyone else who has seen this, what do your negatives look like? Mine seem generally more pink than brown and on the thin side.

Jonathan

guyjr · Aug 22, 2011

I can tell just by looking at the negative side by side with a roll I developed in January this year (with the Fuji kit) that there is a lot of color missing from the recent Rollei developed rolls. I'll try calling Freestyle as well. It's a bit unfortunate actually, because I called them right after I got the kits in April because of leakage from another bottle (the bleach was overfilled), and they promptly sent a replacement.

Rollei Digibase C-41

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