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Maris

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How about

Mint Camera Instantkon RF70​

Totally different from the styles of photography you have already mastered. Instant pictures via Instax Wide. Rangefinder focussing. Folding compact design. Manual shutter speeds and apertures. Auto exposure option.
 

runswithsizzers

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Really? My girlfriend's daily driver is a Mini. Dear God. The money we spent on getting BMW's Vanos system to behave properly once more. Not that the problem was ever solved entirely. She's now driving it until the next major defect and will then ditch it in favor for something more sensible.
I can see how it's fun to drive though. For 30 minutes.
I'm too old for go-karts, I guess :wink:

(The woman was very happy with it for a while though! I gotta admit to that. I don't think that lasted a full year though.)
My experience is different. Bought mine new in 2010 and the mileage is now about 65k. The only parts mine has needed are: a thermostat, one coil pack, and the solenoid that releases the rear hatch. Including labor, the sum total I've spent on repairs is probably about $1000 (US). My total average fuel efficiency is 35.4 MPG and that includes a fair amount of agressive driving. Or as agressive as one can be with only 122 HP to play with. I've read the MINI horror stories, too, but I've noticed almost all of those with major problems have the turbo charged models. Mine is the base model (no turbo) - and it has actually proven to be very reliable and quite economical to drive.
 
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BrianShaw

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If your still talking about it, perhaps you don’t really want one.
 

mshchem

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How about a nice M2 and a Cosina Zeiss 35mm f2 lens used, or a little less expensive Cosina ZM 50mm f2. The Cosina made M mount lenses are very nice. Finding an M2, in nice, doesn't need an immediate CLA, condition, will be close to 2k USD.
 

Paul Howell

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In the world of 6X6 fixed lens, then a Mamiya folder, the lens is really nice, camera has pretty good build quality, and not too expensive. You will to add a good lens hood and likely a few filters if you shoot black and white. But as you are printing you can go up scale to a Mamiya press, 6X9, great 90mm lens is standard on the press, the last model Universal takes a 100 as normal, decent viewfinder, it can be serviced. As a pro line press camera rugged but heavy.
 

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Mtnbkr, The M2 has a wonderful viewfinder.....especially if you like 35mm. Big, clear and uncluttered with well-defined rangefinder patch. The body is less angular than the Canon and to me feels more comfortable in the hands. I find the film advance and all the handling smoother....but i've used Leicas for years and they're almost 2nd nature to me. If you favour a 50mm lens then the M3 might be your choice, but I love the 35mm and so to me the M2 is the quintessential Leica rangefinder. Get one in your hands and see if it speaks to you.
 

MattKing

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In case you haven't already figured it out, this may not be the place to come for advice on how not to spend money.:whistling::whistling:
 

GregY

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In case you haven't already figured it out, this may not be the place to come for advice on how not to spend money.:whistling::whistling:

He did say "Help me spend my money"
........
.& $1200-1500 & up is is pretty modest for a Leica these days.
 

mshchem

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Personally I would get an M4, if only one Leica is to be had. The German M4, original gangster, version is the most expensive, the Canada, ELC, version is quite a bit less, M4-2 M4-D. Has 0.72× finder, canted rewind crank, and the rapid load no fumble take up spool. The later versions will take the motor drive, which will get you banned from eating with the Cool Kids.
 

Hvesterlos

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Well, if you've wanted one for years and now have the funds... Why not? Life is short. It will becompatible with your existing glass, and you can aquire new lenses as you go. I bit the bullet and got an M3 a year ago. I haven't regretted it at all. I turned to Voigtländer for optics, and haven't been dissapointed. I don't think I'll ever be able to afford Leica glass.
 

GregY

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Personally I would get an M4, if only one Leica is to be had. The German M4, original gangster, version is the most expensive, the Canada, ELC, version is quite a bit less, M4-2 M4-D. Has 0.72× finder, canted rewind crank, and the rapid load no fumble take up spool. The later versions will take the motor drive, which will get you banned from eating with the Cool Kids.

Yes! they seem to be in the same price range as the M2 & M3.
 

mshchem

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Well, if you've wanted one for years and now have the funds... Why not? Life is short. It will becompatible with your existing glass, and you can aquire new lenses as you go. I bit the bullet and got an M3 a year ago. I haven't regretted it at all. I turned to Voigtländer for optics, and haven't been dissapointed. I don't think I'll ever be able to afford Leica glass.

I smashed my piggybank and recently bought a Leica Summilux 35mm FLE 1. Not to be confused with the recently introduced FLE 2. I purchased from MAP camera in Japan, they had at least 3, people trading in their 5 year old lenses for the new lenses. This lens is truly amazing (the old one for sure). Sharp wide open.

The Cosina Voigtlander and Zeiss lenses are fabulous, purchased used in top condition are a great value. The Zeiss ZM 50mm f2 in chrome is beautiful on a vintage chrome Leica M. Excuse me, now it's Silver not Chrome. 😀
 

Sirius Glass

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In case you haven't already figured it out, this may not be the place to come for advice on how not to spend money.:whistling::whistling:

Au contraire mon frère we take great efforts in aiding people spending money in a most enjoyable, effective and efficient ways.
 

VinceInMT

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You're really pushing this Swedish camera thing. :D

You won’t find me doing anything like that unless we talk vintage cars and I’ll recommend Volvos. I’m currently driving a ‘59 544 and an ‘83 wagon. I sold a ‘72 1800E just a few years ago.
 

mshchem

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You won’t find me doing anything like that unless we talk vintage cars and I’ll recommend Volvos. I’m currently driving a ‘59 544 and an ‘83 wagon. I sold a ‘72 1800E just a few years ago.

The 1800 line are beautiful. Isn't that the car that some fellow drove 3 million miles ?
 

koraks

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My experience is different. Bought mine new in 2010 and the mileage is now about 65k. The only parts mine has needed are: a thermostat, one coil pack, and the solenoid that releases the rear hatch. Including labor, the sum total I've spent on repairs is probably about $1000 (US). My total average fuel efficiency is 35.4 MPG and that includes a fair amount of agressive driving. Or as agressive as one can be with only 122 HP to play with. I've read the MINI horror stories, too, but I've noticed almost all of those with major problems have the turbo charged models. Mine is the base model (no turbo) - and it has actually proven to be very reliable and quite economical to drive.

Well, great to hear you've been happy with it :smile: As I said, it's just not for me and I suppose as a fashion statement it also lost its sheen for my significant other.
She generally gets around 41 mpg with it, but that's without any aggressive driving. Hers is a very basic 1.6 without turbo. Basically the kind of engine that should have been the most reliable. When the whole Vanos business went down I looked into it, obtained a technical description from BMW of the system and decided it's a rather tricky proposition conceptually. The defect this particular engine experienced is apparently a common one; the chief mechanic at the local BMW dealership immediately recognized it, got a very worried look on his face and before we knew it, we somehow found ourselves €1500 poorer 😆
 

runswithsizzers

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Well, great to hear you've been happy with it :smile: As I said, it's just not for me and I suppose as a fashion statement it also lost its sheen for my significant other.
She generally gets around 41 mpg with it, but that's without any aggressive driving. Hers is a very basic 1.6 without turbo. Basically the kind of engine that should have been the most reliable. When the whole Vanos business went down I looked into it, obtained a technical description from BMW of the system and decided it's a rather tricky proposition conceptually. The defect this particular engine experienced is apparently a common one; the chief mechanic at the local BMW dealership immediately recognized it, got a very worried look on his face and before we knew it, we somehow found ourselves €1500 poorer 😆

The German engineers do seem to love complex solutions. I wonder if that should be a warning to the OP or other Leica fanciers?

But to be fair, many auto manufacturers use variable valve timing systems that are inherently complicated - as are our mechanical cameras. The cost of maintenance and occasional repairs is the price we pay to enjoy our toys.

According to Pelican Parts, replacing the two VANOS solenoids should be about a two hour DIY project and parts are about $260 (US).
 

koraks

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But to be fair, many auto manufacturers use variable valve timing systems that are inherently complicated
There's that; I don't think any petrol engines are being made for automotive use without variable valve timing at this day and age. Maybe at the lowest end of the engine range of some cars, but I think in most cases it's just a necessity to meet environmental regulations.

According to Pelican Parts, replacing the two VANOS solenoids should be about a two hour DIY project and parts are about $260 (US).

Indeed. If it were only a solenoid. Which of course wasn't the case; the entire Vanos assembly had to be replaced. I think the part itself has a dealer price of around €350 and that excludes labor, which involves major work on the cylinder head. The problem is that often it's not just the solenoid, but it's the actual trimming mechanism that uses engine oil pressure that ceases to function. I guess having an assembly that uses fairly subtle forces to actuate it, but has to exert considerable force onto the camshafts and is also subject to large temperature transients and overall inhospitable environmental conditions doesn't help.

Anyway, enough of the off-topic :smile:
 

VinceInMT

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The 1800 line are beautiful. Isn't that the car that some fellow drove 3 million miles ?

Yes, that was Irv Gordon, who passed away a few years ago. Those Volvo drive trains are pretty solid. My ’83, which I bought used in ‘88, has over 200K miles on it and runs like new.
 

VinceInMT

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But to be fair, many auto manufacturers use variable valve timing systems that are inherently complicated - as are our mechanical cameras. The cost of maintenance and occasional repairs is the price we pay to enjoy our toys.

I will say that while the more contemporary automobiles are more complicated, they are much more reliable. I’ve always done my own work and with my older cars, I have to be under the hood lots more frequently than people who newer rides. Adjusting the points, tightening up stuff that wants to come loose, monitoring fluids, packing bearings, etc.

When it comes to Asian vs. European, I bought a new motorcycle a year and a half ago after not riding for 37 years. I did a ton of research and high my list was dependability. I initially wanted a BMW so I started hanging out on the their forums and most of the talk was about problem solving issues, particularly related to stuff with sensors, and the high cost of service. I hung out on a sister forum devoted to a model of Yamaha and the chat was all about where they ride and what kind of “farkles” they add. I went with the Yamaha and have 20,000 trouble free miles on it so far.
 
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mtnbkr

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If your still talking about it, perhaps you don’t really want one.
"Still talking about it" over which timeframe? The last few days or the last several years? The last few days has had me exploring options, but the itch over the last few years has been tempered by not having the money (or having other priorities for it), and the perceived crash of the film industry (I got out of film in 2010 in anticipation of it going completely kaput very soon...turns out I was wrong).


Finding an M2, in nice, doesn't need an immediate CLA, condition, will be close to 2k USD.
They pop up now and then. I watched one close on ebay for $1300 that looked immaculate except for a minor top plate dent. Seller said (yeah, I know) that all speeds were accurate and everything was functional. I figure if I'm patient, $1500 is doable.
Mtnbkr, The M2 has a wonderful viewfinder.....especially if you like 35mm. Big, clear and uncluttered with well-defined rangefinder patch. The body is less angular than the Canon and to me feels more comfortable in the hands. I find the film advance and all the handling smoother....but i've used Leicas for years and they're almost 2nd nature to me. If you favour a 50mm lens then the M3 might be your choice, but I love the 35mm and so to me the M2 is the quintessential Leica rangefinder. Get one in your hands and see if it speaks to you.
I've handled an M3, which was what made me realize that while my Canon is smooth and quiet compared to SLRs, the Leica is in a completely different class. And, I agree the body fits your hand much better. The curves are in the right place. Yes, still talking about cameras...


In case you haven't already figured it out, this may not be the place to come for advice on how not to spend money.:whistling::whistling:
Yeah, that has become obvious. :D

Well, if you've wanted one for years and now have the funds... Why not? Life is short. It will becompatible with your existing glass, and you can aquire new lenses as you go. I bit the bullet and got an M3 a year ago. I haven't regretted it at all. I turned to Voigtländer for optics, and haven't been dissapointed. I don't think I'll ever be able to afford Leica glass.
The "why not" is the little voice in the back of my head that questions if my photography is good enough to justify a near $2k purchase and who am I to spend that much on a camera... It feels extravagant for a mere hobbyist.

Chris
 

BrianShaw

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I understand, Chris, as I’ve been in your shoes more than once with several different hobbies. If it is a “need” then the equation is easy to solve. But once you put “will it make me better” then it involves a crystal ball. More difficult!

A Leica might not make you better photographs but you might have a more fun experience doing the same quality of photography. That alone could be worth spending the money… when/if other priorities makes it available.

A bunch of years ago I stumbled into a windfall and bought the Hasselblad I craved for many years. It didn’t make me better but I sure enjoy using it. For me it wasn’t the initial investment that hurt but the subsequent “I could enjoy this better with this additional lens and that additional accessory “ that started to add up to money I never planned on spending. Now that I have every Hassy-thing I need and want all I need is time and motivation. Chronic procrastination is a debilitating disease to live with. :smile:
 
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