Back in June 2018, the Ferrania Folks hoped to be in continuous production by Fall

[Harry Callahan]

Wow, is there a market at that price bigger than a few people, certainly not a general public price point surely? We are talking about a cohort of old cameras and S8 quality, not a good quality S16. Back in 2007 it was about £14 for a cartridge in the UK and it didn't sell much then. One of those situations where it doesn't pass the common sense test if you ask me! I loved S8 but wouldn't pay £50+ for a cartridge.

Nobody said it was 50£. Were talking about 50 DOLLARS. And it was just for the Kickstarter-reward, when continuous production is running price was considered to drop a little. And these 50 DOLLARS were supposed to include developement.
But this was back in 2014.

 

[darkroommike]

Still waiting, I was one of the early contributors to the Kickstarter. I'll be 66 this year. Hope to see something before I die.

 

[cmacd123]

they were reposting some pictures on their Facebook Presence. perhaps they are as bored of the wait as we are

I am hoping for at least a quarterly update. even if it is "we have 1/3 of the equipment we need up and running...."

 

[fdonadio]

they were reposting some pictures on their Facebook Presence. perhaps they are as bored of the wait as we are

I’ve seen some activity on Instagram, too.

 

[faberryman]

Don't confuse posting on social media with activity.

 

[MattKing]

Maybe what they are doing is "continuos" production, rather than "continuous" production
(see the title to this thread)

 

[dutchsteammachine]

I suspect this is one of the few chances we still have left to revive a film factory. The locations, equipment and people are finite and running on borrowed time.

I am willing to wait this out if it means securing a source of film for the future.

 

[Harry Callahan]

+1

 

[warden]

I suspect this is one of the few chances we still have left to revive a film factory. The locations, equipment and people are finite and running on borrowed time.

Yep.

 

[Agulliver]

Yep...willing to wait if it means they get it right and Film Ferrania is saved. With the troubles Kodak are going through and the uncertainty over Fuji's future in the film market....we could do with another factory especially for colour film. I'm sure that Harman and Foma will crank out B&W film for as long as the chemicals exist.

Film Ferrania have stated categorically that they will communicate when there's something to say. What we know from the past is that giving us little updates such as "We're moving this machine to our building" or "The government is restoring power next week" get people all excited....said people then squawk that *their* film isn't ready yet a few days later.

 

[faberryman]

I won't say anything until I am ready to announce that my new color film is available. I don't want to unnecessarily raise expectations.

 

[captain ZZM]

During 2018 IS DONE over 3 months, their website is still no news

 

[faberryman]

Yep...willing to wait...

As if you had any other choice.

 

[dutchsteammachine]

As if you had any other choice.

You seem to be quite down about it all. Perhaps you can give us some useful insights in how things can be changed for the better?

I would like more frequent updates, but perhaps there is just nothing substantial to say.

We need to remember the kind of open-ness Film Ferrania has shown is uncanny in the photography buisness, if any business at all. I think we should cherish the people for that. I am glad to have them on Apug.

I, quite frankly, have not been happy with my P30 results from the lab. I recently started to develop b/w myself and got some silvermax developer, has anybody gotten good results with this and P30?

 

[faberryman]

You seem to be quite down about it all. Perhaps you can give us some useful insights in how things can be changed for the better?

I am not down about it. I am amused by all the people who say they are willing to wait as if they had a choice. When P30 is readily available, I'll try it out. I am not interested in wasting a lot of time testing a beta product when you can only get five rolls every year or so.

 

[Harry Callahan]

I am not down about it. I am amused by all the people who say they are willing to wait as if they had a choice. When P30 is readily available, I'll try it out. I am not interested in wasting a lot of time testing a beta product when you can only get five rolls every year or so.

I get your statement about not having a choice but to wait, but there still are several ways of waiting. Keep rather silent and hope for the best or having "bad feelings about it" and post these endlessly. Not saying that you do, but you probably know what i mean.

 

[railwayman3]

I am not down about it. I am amused by all the people who say they are willing to wait as if they had a choice. When P30 is readily available, I'll try it out. I am not interested in wasting a lot of time testing a beta product when you can only get five rolls every year or so.

My view, too.

And it's one thing to accept a Beta B&W product, where there's scope to experiment with only the risk of wasting a few pence worth of chemicals and some time. Even a C41 film has some scope for latitude and correction, but an E6 film has to be a quality, considtent, product at the point of sale.

I'm not going to risk any "serious" photography on a Beta E6 film,,,,,if Kodak or Fuji is no longer available, I'll just use my digital camera.......

 

[Agulliver]

I'm also into analogue recording tape. Cassette tape almost died, but in the last few years no fewer than four companies announced the intention to make new cassettes. We waited over two years for anything to emerge. One company now has a finalised product on the market, one has a "work in progress" which some of us have been testing, two others are promising cassettes "soon".

The companies in question have NOT been as open on forums as Film Ferrania have. As such, the negativity has been less...but it's still there..."Where's the tape? I bet they've failed and given up. Where's MY TAPE?"

The lack of even basic knowledge as to how new products are brought to reality, and the clear lack of any intention to read what Dave Bias has written in these hallowed pages, still astonishes me.

I would rather wait than throw stones at Film Ferrania....because I want them to succeed. We need them to succeed in order to secure the long term future of our hobby/living. Does anyone really think that sniping at them from the safety of a keyboard will actually help?

So....yes...I am happy to wait rather than throw rumours or cast aspersions. I really like P30, and I hope they are able to get their E6 film going. I know they've had to overcome many unforeseen hurdles.

 

[blockend]

I'm also into analogue recording tape.

Me too. In the UK the same source of cheap film, Poundland, was the go-to for audio cassettes. Film bit the dust in 2017, nor sure about tape as I bought enough of both to last a while. The other people into magnetic recording media are a fraction my age and have more piercings than I've had birthdays. Video tape is also enjoying a renaissance.

 

[dutchsteammachine]

I'm also into analogue recording tape. Cassette tape almost died, but in the last few years no fewer than four companies announced the intention to make new cassettes. We waited over two years for anything to emerge. One company now has a finalised product on the market, one has a "work in progress" which some of us have been testing, two others are promising cassettes "soon".

The companies in question have NOT been as open on forums as Film Ferrania have. As such, the negativity has been less...but it's still there..."Where's the tape? I bet they've failed and given up. Where's MY TAPE?"

The lack of even basic knowledge as to how new products are brought to reality, and the clear lack of any intention to read what Dave Bias has written in these hallowed pages, still astonishes me.

I would rather wait than throw stones at Film Ferrania....because I want them to succeed. We need them to succeed in order to secure the long term future of our hobby/living. Does anyone really think that sniping at them from the safety of a keyboard will actually help?

So....yes...I am happy to wait rather than throw rumours or cast aspersions. I really like P30, and I hope they are able to get their E6 film going. I know they've had to overcome many unforeseen hurdles.

Curious, do these companies make the tape themselves, or do they use tape from RTM, Capture or ATR?

Have any been thinking about bringing back chrome or metal tape? I heard the metals for those are no longer in production...
How does pro RTM, Capture and ATR tape in cassettes compare to chrome or metal cassette tape?

 

[Toasty]

I, quite frankly, have not been happy with my P30 results from the lab. I recently started to develop b/w myself and got some silvermax developer, has anybody gotten good results with this and P30?

The best results for me: ISO 25, HC-110 dil. B for 5 minutes.

 

[Agulliver]

@dutchsteammachine I am talking about RTM, NAC, ATR and Capture. I've been testing some of the above. NAC in particular communicated that they were developing a new cassette tape 2+ years ago and a lot of the talk has been "WAAAA where's my tape? Why is it taking soooooo long?" from people who know nothing about the hurdles they are jumping.

There's no chance of type IV cassette tape again, and type II is a pipe dream. Nobody is manufacturing the chemicals required, the few companies that did have dismantled their CrO2 reactors and cobalt doping production; To restart would mean investment of millions to build new such facilities which conform to current environmental regulations. Unfortunately the products requiring manufacture for type II and IV cassettes have no other uses so there's no market for them.

I am prepared to say what I've published elsewhere in public. The NAC tape sucks. It's awful. But I hope they continue to develop it and produce something better.
The RTM FOX tape is good. Not outstanding, but the best cassette tape currently in production. Somewhere between a classic TDK D and AD in most measurable respects though it's noise floor isn't anything to write home about. It's a thoroughly decent starting point. Again people are moaning at the price which is around 3 Euros or dollarpounds. But when you account for inflation that is exactly what a decent type I cost in the mid 80s.
​

 

[dutchsteammachine]

Problem with tape is that you can use it multiple times, unlike film. I haven't been following the market, but I don't think quality NOS tape has been exhausted?

And I could probably get around buying just NOS film from ebay, especially for films that are no longer around. But I want to support the current producers of film, and don't want to risk ruined photos due to a badly handled NOS roll.

 

[faberryman]

But I want to support the current producers of film, and don't want to risk ruined photos due to a badly handled NOS roll.

Sanity at last.

 

[Agulliver]

Problem with tape is that you can use it multiple times, unlike film. I haven't been following the market, but I don't think quality NOS tape has been exhausted?

And I could probably get around buying just NOS film from ebay, especially for films that are no longer around. But I want to support the current producers of film, and don't want to risk ruined photos due to a badly handled NOS roll.

There is NOS tape but it's becoming scarce....and the companies still duplicating cassettes for the pre-recorded tape market need a supply of decent quality pancakes. That supply has just dried up.

For the likes of me, I can buy the reasonable quality Maxell UR brand new or get NOS cassettes for my occasional recording at home. But the duplicators are dealing with a minor resurgence in cassette sales and NAC in particular are busier than ever in their 50 year history. Some albums are selling in hundreds of thousands worldwide and with the NOS pancakes of BASF or Maxell tape these companies were using having run out, and the Koreans and Chinese having just recently stopped making pancakes.....something new is needed.

A by-product of manufacturing pancakes mostly intended for tape duplicators is that individual cassettes can also be made.

The only real similarity is that companies which once produced tape (in the case of NAC it's a new thing for them to actually manufacture and coat tape) are facing similar hurdles to Film Ferrania - though without their government cutting off vital services. These companies are taking two years or more to begin to manufacture cassette tape having previously made reel to reel tape. Is it really any surprise that Film Ferrania are taking time?

I am sure all of us want a reliable supply of film for our cameras.