Back in June 2018, the Ferrania Folks hoped to be in continuous production by Fall

[Roger Cole]

I for one see a huge hole in the reversal film market. The question is, who will step up and fill it?

"What is that huge hole?" you ask. That huge hole is high speed color reversal film. I for one would like to see at least an ISO 400 reversal film. Fuji no longer makes it, and neither does Kodak. If I want slides, and I want to shoot handheld indoors, I have three options:

1. Use electronic flash, but this negates natural lighting
2. Underexpose and push, but not exactly practical if you want to shoot at EI 1600 or higher, and maybe not even practical at EI 800
3. Shoot color negative, then have slides made from that (but this is a hybrid process which many will not want to do), and this gets expensive at $2/pop, plus the cost of shooting the color negative film in the first place.

B&W reversal can be done at home if you're set up for that sort of thing, or use DR5's process. I can, and do, shoot HP5+ (an ISO 400 film) at EI 1600 and send it through DR5 Film Lab's process, and the resulting B&W slides are absolutely gorgeous. I think HP5+ pushes so well in this process because it's a low-contrast film to begin with, and we all know that pushing film boosts the contrast.

The question is, will Ferrania be able and willing to introduce an ISO 400 reversal film? There's already a plethora of B&W films out there to choose from, some of which reverse quite nicely, but what we really need is an ISO 400 color reversal film, and right now there are none!

Yes. I typed my message before I read all the way down and saw yours but obviously I concur completely.

 

[cmacd123]

The question is, will Ferrania be able and willing to introduce an ISO 400 reversal film? There's already a plethora of B&W films out there to choose from, some of which reverse quite nicely, but what we really need is an ISO 400 color reversal film, and right now there are none!

it was originally one of their "stretch goals" as Scotch chrome was made in both 400 and either 800 or 1000 until reasonably recently. they would have to get their production working well on both the 100 slide film, and perhaps bringing back P38 or P3 before they would be "safe" to make that of course.

 

[FILM Ferrania]

Disappearing the original thread is a huge loss. It spoke to the re-establishment of a film market and its participants in a seminal way; warts and all. A real shame; I don't care about the reasons.

It's ok - the thread was sprawling and becoming very difficult to follow. I'll start a new thread when the time is right.

 

[FILM Ferrania]

We have just published a short end-of-year update:
http://www.filmferrania.it/news-articles/2018/slow-and-steady-wins-the-race

 

[faberryman]

Not sure how that is an update. It sounds very ominous. Don't expect anything anytime soon was how it struck me.

 

[cmacd123]

We have just published a short end-of-year update:
http://www.filmferrania.it/news-articles/2018/slow-and-steady-wins-the-race

wonderful to hear from you! I did get the impression that the P30 sales profits were hampered by the production waste. We do love to know what is going on so please don't be a stranger. - in the meantime Happy Solstice related Holidays.

 

[cmacd123]

Not sure how that is an update. It sounds very ominous. Don't expect anything anytime soon was how it struck me.

I am hoping that he will give us some sort of running updates like 34 or 257 points on the plan are completed....

 

[twelvetone12]

From the update:

As such, you will not hear much from us until we have products ready to ship.

I would curb my enthusiasm. I wonder why they promised monthly updates in the first place.

 

[peter k.]

Not sure how that is an update. It sounds very ominous. Don't expect anything anytime soon was how it struck me.

Disagree, it doesn't sound ominous to me at all, sounds very realistic and shows there contentedness on their task before them. In fact, for me, it shows a very strong clarity, after overcoming all the countless pitfalls and spin around that they have gone through. Now they now have the focus point clear before them. Remarkable what they have accomplished!
Now, with most of the clutter that was obstructing them having been removed, they are forging forward to to that goal. It has taken more time then we, or they figured on, ... but time passes and where looking forward to using and developing their results when it arrives. .

 

[railwayman3]

Not sure how that is an update. It sounds very ominous. Don't expect anything anytime soon was how it struck me.

Agreed, the update says virtually nothing. Sadly, my own belief is that the project will, before long, now have to be admitted to have failed. I would defend entirely
that it was a great and bold project, honestly presented, worked at conscientiously. but which met difficulties and misfortunes that could never have been foreseen and which may now prove impossible to overcome.
The supporters of Ferrania in this and earlier thread have, quite rightly, criticised detractors by pointing out that all Kickstarter projects and possible rewards carry no guarantees, we contribute because we believe in an idea and want to give support, not to buy rewards or as an investment. But some projects can and do fail and, while I hope I'm wrong, it may be the time that realists must accept this possibility.

 

[Agulliver]

I'm not exactly getting positive vibes from the latest news but I hope that the people at Film Ferrania are beavering away as and when they can towards their new goal of constant production of B&W film in-house. At least the web shop still says it will reopen in early 2019. I wholly understand the reluctance to make predictions as so many unexpected hurdles have been encountered.

 

[Harry Callahan]

Nice to hear from you again Dave, hope you and your team are doing fine.

Not sure how that is an update. It sounds very ominous. Don't expect anything anytime soon was how it struck me.

I think this update also is a result of all the previous bashing. To me it says: "We´re still on it but we wont tell anything which isn´t a 101% certain to avoid further disappointment and all what goes along with that."
If they have to wait until everything is up for continuous production it should take a little longer, but that also indicates they still have funds to wait a little longer. Therefore it doesn´t sound really ominous to me.

 

[Sal Santamaura]

Best punny phrase from the update:

"...our honest intentions at transparency..."​

 

[removedacct1]

It’s fascinating to witness how updates from Ferrania have the ability to sort this crowd into “glass half full” and “glass half empty” piles.

Best of luck to the Ferrania folks, and continued support for their Herculean efforts. I think it’s awe inspiring to see these folks push towards their goals in spite of the unforeseen river of hurdles that threatens to erode their work. More power to you, Ferrania.

 

[Diapositivo]

I see nothing negative in the news. Actually I find extraordinary that Ferrania chose to "reimburse" those who want their Kickstarter money in the future. Ferrania doesn't have any legal, nor any moral obligation to do so. The fact that they chose to do so seems quite remarkable to me, and it also seems to me a sign of an improving financial health.

As far as the lack of speculations about future milestones, I think this is the right thing to do. There are too many uncertainties and too much energy is devoted to trying to explain why things did not turn out as expected. Just don't create expectations, and it will work better.

Some people critical of Ferrania in the other thread actually praised Kodak for the comparative lack of speculation about productive goals and milestones. They should be now happier

The general lines of development of the firm seem to be sensible: first things first, and the rest later. It seems to me they are laying a robust basement for the future "building". "And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and beat on that house, but it did not fall, because it had been founded on the rock." (Matthew 7,25)

 

[mshchem]

I see nothing negative in the news. Actually I find extraordinary that Ferrania chose to "reimburse" those who want their Kickstarter money in the future. Ferrania doesn't have any legal, nor any moral obligation to do so. The fact that they chose to do so seems quite remarkable to me, and it also seems to me a sign of an improving financial health.

As far as the lack of speculations about future milestones, I think this is the right thing to do. There are too many uncertainties and too much energy is devoted to trying to explain why things did not turn out as expected. Just don't create expectations, and it will work better.

Some people critical of Ferrania in the other thread actually praised Kodak for the comparative lack of speculation about productive goals and milestones. They should be now happier

The general lines of development of the firm seem to be sensible: first things first, and the rest later. It seems to me they are laying a robust basement for the future "building". "And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and beat on that house, but it did not fall, because it had been founded on the rock." (Matthew 7,25)

Well said. No group of people have ever tried to do something like this. The equipment was a treasure, however once you start changing things, you end up spending a lot of money and time meeting modern codes and standards.
I am hopeful that everything will work out.

 

[Berri]

It seems like a reasnoreas time to me, I would be more than happy to have ektachrome 120 at the end of the year.

 

[FILM Ferrania]

Thanks for the kind words posted here since the last update. Here are a couple of very short reactions:

To Charles MacDonald - when something is newsworthy, we will share it of course.

To Peter K. - you pretty much nailed it. Our short-term goal is more specific and clear than it has ever been, even if the path to that goal remains extremely complex and hard to report to the general public.

To Agulliver - I really like the phrase "beavering away"! That is exactly what is happening.

To Harry Callahan - correct on both points.

To Paul Barden - it is quite fascinating. As a past student of social psychology, I find it endlessly entertaining, if occasionally frustrating.

To mshchem - modern codes and standards have been a real pain in our ass, for sure. The "powers that be" have been inconsistent in their policing of those codes and standards - and they have often ignored the reality on the ground in their bureaucratic processes, even when the facts are well-known to them. Over the years, this has meant a variety of unwanted and/or ill-timed and/or completely unreasonable surprises, many many weeks of waiting for the bureaucracy to make a move of some sort, many more weeks of replying to such moves in the appropriate way, and on and on. At times, it has been thoroughly exhausting and incredibly discouraging. But as someone else has pointed out, our new investor has allowed us some space to deal with these things directly without the pressure of needing to sell.

To Berri - I don't know what "reasnoreas" means, but I would love some Ektachrome 120 as well!

 

[Craig75]

I have italian camera, italian tripod, italian enlarger. It will be a pleasant treat to be able to put italian film through it too. Good luck - the whole thing looks mindbendingly complicated but a very eventful ride.

 

[Nzoomed]

Thanks for the kind words posted here since the last update. Here are a couple of very short reactions:

To Charles MacDonald - when something is newsworthy, we will share it of course.

To Peter K. - you pretty much nailed it. Our short-term goal is more specific and clear than it has ever been, even if the path to that goal remains extremely complex and hard to report to the general public.

To Agulliver - I really like the phrase "beavering away"! That is exactly what is happening.

To Harry Callahan - correct on both points.

To Paul Barden - it is quite fascinating. As a past student of social psychology, I find it endlessly entertaining, if occasionally frustrating.

To mshchem - modern codes and standards have been a real pain in our ass, for sure. The "powers that be" have been inconsistent in their policing of those codes and standards - and they have often ignored the reality on the ground in their bureaucratic processes, even when the facts are well-known to them. Over the years, this has meant a variety of unwanted and/or ill-timed and/or completely unreasonable surprises, many many weeks of waiting for the bureaucracy to make a move of some sort, many more weeks of replying to such moves in the appropriate way, and on and on. At times, it has been thoroughly exhausting and incredibly discouraging. But as someone else has pointed out, our new investor has allowed us some space to deal with these things directly without the pressure of needing to sell.

To Berri - I don't know what "reasnoreas" means, but I would love some Ektachrome 120 as well!

Yes all very good points.
I look forward to your next update, and im still happy to hold on to my kickstarter awards as i await the release of your colour film!
I have plenty of old stock ektachrome and provia to get rid of in my freezer anyway, so by the time its gone, i expect you will be ready with the colour film

 

[Harry Callahan]

Hi Dave, glad to hear that you`re not having too much pressure of needing to sell.
Regarding transparency i just want to say that the previous years have been an exiting journey providing a lot of interesting insights into analog film production which might be unique - as i assume that no other manufacturer has been that transparent and open as you have been.
Though the new year allready is 4 days old i still wish a happy and good new year to you and your team!

 

[Agulliver]

Hmm...I have an Italian Durst enlarger and two Italian 127 cameras (Bencini and Ferrania)....it would be lovely to get hold of some Ferrania 127 film when they are able to produce it.

 

[alanrockwood]

A hopelessly impractical thought, but wouldn't it be fun if the old Kodachrome-similar Dynachrome process were to be resurrected? As a practical matter, it will be nice if they ultimately succeed in bringing out an E6 film.

 

[jrhilton]

Ferrania had priced one S8-cartridge of "Ferraniachrome" at 50$ at their Kickstartercampaign..."

Wow, is there a market at that price bigger than a few people, certainly not a general public price point surely? We are talking about a cohort of old cameras and S8 quality, not a good quality S16. Back in 2007 it was about £14 for a cartridge in the UK and it didn't sell much then. One of those situations where it doesn't pass the common sense test if you ask me! I loved S8 but wouldn't pay £50+ for a cartridge.

 

[perkeleellinen]

One of those situations where it doesn't pass the common sense test if you ask me! I loved S8 but wouldn't pay £50+ for a cartridge.

Sad to say that's the Ektachrome 100 price too