Autochrome Latex

Mustafa Umut Sarac

Member

Mar 30, 2011

#101

Shaz ,

I had been posted Kodak Research Lab and Eastman House index at APUG.

look at here there was a url link here which no longer exists)

6270-81-1
Chemical Name： ORTHOCHROME T
Synonyms： ORTHOCHROME T;quinolinium,1-ethyl-2-[(1-ethyl-6-methyl-4(1h)-quinolinylidene)methyl]-6-methy

Chem Art : 155479
Chemical Name : Orthochrome T
Common Name : Orthochrome T
CAS No. : 6270-81-1

Address Chemos GmbH
Werner-von-Siemens-Str. 3
D-93128 Regenstauf, Germany

Phone +49-9402-9336 0
Fax +49-9402-933 613

www.chemos-group.com

APPLICATION :

The Optical Sensitizing of Silver Halide Emulsions. I. The Adsorption of Orthochrome T to Silver Bromide
First PageHi-Res PDF[460 KB]S. E. Sheppard, H. Crouch
J. Phys. Chem., 1928, 32 (5), pp 751–762
DOI: 10.1021/j150287a007
Publication Date: January 1928

Part I. The Adsorption of Orthochrome T to Silver Bromide. BY S. E. SHEPPARD AND H. CROUCH. Communication So. 337 from the Kodak Research Laboratories

Umut

OP

shaz

Member

Mar 30, 2011

#102

Hello Umut,

Have you buy Orthochrome T ?
And have you buy "vert solide nouveau 3B" ?

Shaz

Photo Engineer

Subscriber

Mar 30, 2011

#103

holmburgers said:
PE, do you ever hunt eBay or lab closeouts for cheap(er) dyes that might be suitable for sensitizing? If you were to make a comprehensive list of useful & practical sensitizers, about how long would it be??

Shaz, I'd love to hear Mssr. Lumiere's method. What is Orthochrome T though? A dye?

The list is about 15 names long. Orthochrome T is probably not on it as it is NOT a very good sensitizing dye.

It seems to me that I posted the list of available Kodak dyes here on APUG back a while ago, upon just such requests. I'll repost it here for you all. The top set is best and the bottom set is quite marginal but they work. They are a lot less expensive.

PE

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holmburgers

Member

Mar 30, 2011

#104

Thanks PE, that's great, sorry to make you repost it.

OP

shaz

Member

Mar 30, 2011

#105

I am sorry for you PE, but Orthochrome T is on the list. Perhaps you want a scan from the Lavédrine Book.
In your list, i don't see the "vert solide nouveau 3B", it's in the list.
If you don't use the same dyes like Louis Lumière then it will be a PEpanchromatic emulsion and not the Louis Lumière panchromatic emulsion. . And Louis Lumière was one of the best in his time for the panchromatic emulsion.

Where can i see on the Eastman organic chemical website the page where you can buy Orthochrome T please ?
I don't find it.

Shaz

Last edited by a moderator: Mar 30, 2011

holmburgers

Member

Mar 30, 2011

#106

Acridine Orange: 350139860138, 140304815302
Congo Red: 230519851416
Eosin Y: 230519851517
Rhodamine: 280408148225

So these are just a handful of "quick & dirty" eBay searches. Careful searching, and going through the "Business, Office & Industrial > Medical/ Lab Equipment > Lab Supplies > Chemicals" chain of categories will, over time, yield results. I guarantee it!

I remember seeing a huge jar of congo red once. And the key with dyes is finding the colloquial name, or searching by title & description, or sometimes you might even have to go into the auction and look at a picture to identify it. Truth is, the sellers have no idea what they have or how to market it best.

edit: Shaz is right, it is on the list

Last edited by a moderator: Mar 30, 2011

Mustafa Umut Sarac

Member

Mar 30, 2011

#107

PE ,

If you want , I can send you subject book but I know you are busy on your projects. May be you print bw and look at the future . Only an offer .

Shaz ,

You dont need Kodak. They will never sell you small quantities. Look at chemos.de and there it is. No I did not buy anything film related chemical except film for last 10 years.

Umut

Mustafa Umut Sarac

Member

Mar 30, 2011

#108

Chris ,

If you have no CAS number , searching for dyes is a killer. Its not easy to communicate with Shaz. I saw the book , it is impossible to elect the correct chemical from book descritions. I think its weary to tell this to beginner. After banging his head to concrete for next 3 months , he will understand to look my post.

Umut

holmburgers

Member

Mar 30, 2011

#109

Go easy on Shaz, Umut...

Here is Orthochrome T for sale, but not for normal citizens I think. http://www.sigmaaldrich.com/catalog...O|BRAND_KEY&N4=323764|SIAL&N25=0&QS=ON&F=SPEC

Photo Engineer

Subscriber

Mar 30, 2011

#110

The dyes in the second list are very poor sensitizers and that is my only point. Eastman organics is now part of Tennessee Eastman and no longer list those dyes. That came from one of the last catalogs published.

PE

OP

shaz

Member

Mar 31, 2011

#111

Hello everybody ,

Thank you Holmburgers .

Sorry for the bad scan :

Dead Link Removed

But you can read Orthochrome T. There is 3 solutions to prepare the dye for the emulsion. All the products are describe. If we can't have Orthochrome T, we can't made a autochrome like Louis Lumière. Never mind, we can find a substitute if it is too much expensive or we can wait to win a lot of money.

Thank you for your link Holmburgers, i'll keep it preciously. Perhaps one day i will be rich and i will have the possibility to command 1kilo of this dye.

Holmburgers : if you want i can try to translate the best i can the way to do the emulsion and preparing the dyes. If you want i will send it in your mail box.

Shaz

holmburgers

Member

Mar 31, 2011

#112

Good morning Shaz! It's a beautiful document and I'd would be honored to know what it says.

If one cannot obtain Orthochrome T, then one must do as Mssr. Lumiere would have done in our shoes!

I'm off to bed . . .

OP

shaz

Member

Mar 31, 2011

#113

I don't understand : "I'm off to bed", but if that mean that you're gone sleep, then i say to you : Have a good night and make sweet dreams of Autochrome .

I prepare you the translation.

Just a link for you, perhaps you know it ...it is Bertrand Lavédrine :

http://www.cnrs.fr/cw/dossiers/dosart/decouv/video/intw_lav.html

Shaz

Ray Rogers

Member

Mar 31, 2011

#114

Maybe 10 years ago I was in a discussion with a "Scott" who claimed to have bought a kg. of Orthochrome T.

I doubted his sincerity and questioned him about it. He subsequently said he was working on something that would be released in about a year... I waited and waited but he soon dissappeared and no such new product was ever found to surface.... it is all on the internet...on the alt photo forum based in Saz. Canada (attached to some Univ.), if anyone cares to hunt it up -

If he actually was telling the truth, he may some for sale!

Mustafa Umut Sarac

Member

Mar 31, 2011

#115

Shaz ,

How much ortochrome t do you need ?

Look for alt photo list , one old , one replaced the old new. Try to join two of them.

I will ask your question to the alt photo list , ı hope scott is there .

Thanks Ray ,

Best ,

Umut

OP

shaz

Member

Mar 31, 2011

#116

I don't understand what is "alt photo list"'.
Me, i don't need any Orthochrome T, like i've said, i know someone that can surely give me panchromatic emulsion.
For dying the patatoe starch i don't need Orthochrome T.
Now if you read the recipe, you need 1.5 grams. But if you read all the recipe you can learn that after the preparation Louis Lumière make some tries on a plate ( He take pictures). If it's not good, he add Orthochrome T or Erythrosine or Violet, it depend of the dominant characteristic. It is certainly the result of the process...tpt°C, time .....
Then , i think that 10 grams for the experimentation will be enough....but i don't have the money.

Shaz

Last edited by a moderator: Mar 31, 2011

Mustafa Umut Sarac

Member

Mar 31, 2011

#117

Shaz ,

Register here ;

http://lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo/alt-photo-process-list

Can you tell me ,

which page of your book printed filtre etoffe ?

I will send the scan of this page to some experts at France !

I asked SCOTT , I will try to reach him.

Is your friends emulsion have Ortochrome T ? It is really very expensive.

Umut

Ray Rogers

Member

Mar 31, 2011

#118

Well one never knows...

but I think you missed my hint...
I suspect he was feeling around for information...
I think he wanted to see who really knew their stuff and
who were just sounded intelligent by virtue of cut and paste.

I think I have his last name if needed.

OP

shaz

Member

Mar 31, 2011

#119

It is page 350, the last sentence = On filtre dans deux filtres étoffes.....

I phone to millipore in France and they don't know what it is. They say to me that a filter made in nylon could resist to ethyle acétate.....but what aperture i have to take...i don't know for the moment.

Thank you for the link.

Shaz

Mustafa Umut Sarac

Member

Mar 31, 2011

#120

Ray ,

I think your problem is depression. Use Prozac !

Umut

OP

shaz

Member

Mar 31, 2011

#121

Please, is it possible to not pollute the post !
We are between intelligent men ! no ?

We speak about Autochrome first. The subject was at the beginning about the latex.

Shaz

holmburgers

Member

Mar 31, 2011

#122

shaz said:
Please, is it possible to not pollute the post !
We are between intelligent men ! no ?

We speak about Autochrome first. The subject was at the beginning about the latex.

Shaz

Good point.

OP

shaz

Member

Apr 1, 2011

#123

Hello everybody,

I don't know if someone have already put this video on the forum...i will be surprised that it's "no"....but i put it if it's no.
Preparation of a autochrome by Bertrand Lavedrine :

[video]http://www.cnrs.fr/cw/dossiers/dosart/decouv/video/montage_fab.html[/video]

If you never seen it, you will have a good moment.

I received my rubber cement today...it's looks good. I will see if the mix Heptane/ toluène will be good.

Shaz

holmburgers

Member

Apr 2, 2011

#124

Hmm, I can't download the necessary plug-in for some reason. I'd really like to see it though!

Excited to hear about your results with rubber cement. How exactly will you use it, pray tell?

Cheers!

Ray Rogers

Member

Apr 2, 2011

#125

Carressing the quaint white ceramic tiles on the laboratory benchtop...

holmburgers said:
Hmm, I can't download the necessary plug-in for some reason. I'd really like to see it though!

Excited to hear about your results with rubber cement. How exactly will you use it, pray tell?

Cheers!

I saw it several months ago...
until you fix your problem I can give you the HAIKU version:

Mixed starch into water in a big (ca. 3000 - 5000ml) beaker.
Filter (under suction)
Dry in lab autoclave
Mix portions with dyes
Mix dyed portions

Coat glass plate:
pour on and spread a thin, colorless clear liquid (presumably a tacky varnish)

Brush tacky surface with pigments
Top off with a brushing of carbon black
Insert plate into very nice microscope

Be amazed at the beautiful colors (the dyed starch granules)
displayed on the monitor

The entire show was qualitative... nothing was measured.
(Everything was done with two or three scoops.)

There is no narration for this show.
There is however another version with narration, IIRC.

oh, not haiku but...
Carressing the quaint white ceramic tiles on the laboratory benchtop,
an invitingly warm sunlight Springs into Summer before Falling hopelessly into Winter.

Last edited by a moderator: Apr 2, 2011

Autochrome Latex

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