What is "Fine Art"?

[Helge]

That can easily lead you to the notion of the "sublime", which was the ultimate art-experience coming out of medieval philosophy (almost always having to do with religious "uplifting"). The "sublime" is a concept that really pushes a rarefied notion of art (artistic/religious epiphany) and should be left in mouldering old books where it belongs.
"Fine" art is a valueless description. It is not really as a purposive object that art is ever appreciated as specifically art, so the limiting notion of a "fine" art adds nothing. That's why you can remove an object from its function and recontextualize it as an art piece. (Picasso's bicycle seat bull, for example - which is not art because it is a bicycle seat and handlebars but because of the reconfiguration of those objects into a sculpture.)

Thy know not of which thy speak.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sublime_(philosophy)

 

[Pieter12]

"fine" art does not need any purpose. It is made with the idea that its existence is worthwhile in itself, that it is something to be experienced to the exclusion of everything else.

Well, portraits and documentary photos, or in the painting and drawing world, religious and historical scenes, are among works that are considered fine art. And they can have the purposes of propaganda, vanity or inspiration. Even purely decorative art (that would be categorized as vulgar under your definition) can be considered fine art given its execution and appearance.

 

[Sirius Glass]

“Thy” is the possessive.

Nailed by the Grammar Police!

 

[Vaughn]

Then I suppose one could write this, if one likes using 'thy' a lot:

Thy knowledge is insufficient to support thy speech.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Then I suppose one could write this, if one likes using 'thy' a lot:

Thy knowledge is insufficient to support thy speech.

OR

He knowth not of which he speakth.

 

[Helge]

“Thy” is the possessive.

Was kind of the point. One kind of feeble pretentiousness against the other. But that is hard to prove now of course.

 

[Arthurwg]

Fine Art: Recently in New York, I saw a show of paintings by a living artist in his 80's at a top gallery. There were 10 large canvases, and all were sold at $10 million each. And yes, they were beautiful. And no, your school child could not make them.

 

[Vaughn]

OR He knowth not of which he speakth.

Which can be a good thing if he askth (?) an intelligent question.

 

[Don_ih]

Does it make it "finer" art because nobody had put the two together to look like that before?

There's no finer art. "Fine" is not a quantifiable descriptor in this sense. It doesn't mean good. It means "pure" (think of the word "refine").

And they can have the purposes of propaganda, vanity or inspiration.

I didn't say fine art can't have a purpose (lots originally did, lost it, or does now, didn't originally, or had one then it changed), I said it doesn't need one to be fine art. Vulgar art (craft, design, architecture, for example) is subjugated by purpose (pragmatic concern dictates much of the end aesthetic experience).

pretentiousness

This isn't pretentious. Level an argument against what I wrote, if you want.

 

[Helge]

This isn't pretentious. Level an argument against what I wrote, if you want.

The Wikipedia article does that job.
Your understanding of the art history concept of the sublime is tenuous at best.

 

[Arthurwg]

Which aspect made these pieces fine art versus art? The prices? The sizes of the canvases? That they were in a top gallery? The fact you found them beautiful? That a school child couldn’t make them (presumably implying a high degree of technical skill was involved)? Was it fine art, great art, very good art, superb art?

That's easy: An Artist.

 

[Don_ih]

The Wikipedia article does that job.
Your understanding of the art history concept of the sublime is tenuous at best.

Feel free to elaborate. I'm glad you have the Wikipedia article at your disposal, it really does a nice job substituting.

 

[Helge]

Feel free to elaborate. I'm glad you have the Wikipedia article at your disposal, it really does a nice job substituting.

Everybody does. That’s the point.

 

[Deleted member 88956]

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say it: fine art has to be fine, otherwise it isn't. Now I'm laughing at myself for not being able to refrain from commenting on this issue any more. Clearly therapy has not worked. Got to go holistic on this.

 

[Deleted member 88956]

I’ve had the same problem with this ridiculous, absolutely useless thread. Every now and then I feel compelled to comment.

Calling anything fine art or even art, is just marketing. Nothing more. And as I said before, when someone refers to his/her own stuff as fine art, you know right away…

We've learned so much here, to the point of learning nothing.

 

[Sirius Glass]

I’ve had the same problem with this ridiculous, absolutely useless thread. Every now and then I feel compelled to comment.

Calling anything fine art or even art, is just marketing. Nothing more. And as I said before, when someone refers to his/her own stuff as fine art, you know right away…

Calling the thread "ridiculous, absolutely useless" gives it much too much status.

 

[tokam]

I think you guys need to get out and shoot more film! Oops, I forgot, in the northern hemisphere you now have that boring, grey, flat December light.... Plus it's bloody cold. Best stay inside and quibble over higher ethereal issues. Perhaps with a glass of your favourite tipple in hand. (8 hours of daylight, if you are lucky can be a downer. I last experienced that in UK in 2013 - not in a hurry to repeat.)

Downunder here in Australia photography outside the 'Golden' hour means an insane scene brightness range. Still doesn't help with creating fine art...

/tongue in cheek

 

[Sirius Glass]

I think you guys need to get out and shoot more film! Oops, I forgot, in the northern hemisphere you now have that boring, grey, flat December light.... Plus it's bloody cold. Best stay inside and quibble over higher ethereal issues. Perhaps with a glass of your favourite tipple in hand. (8 hours of daylight, if you are lucky can be a downer. I last experienced that in UK in 2013 - not in a hurry to repeat.)

Downunder here in Australia photography outside the 'Golden' hour means an insane scene brightness range. Still doesn't help with creating fine art...

/tongue in cheek

Hmmm ... I will drink to that.

 

[Vaughn]

That's easy: An Artist.

It really is that simple.

But we live in a world of armchair artists...people who are not artists telling artists they are doing it all wrong...

 

[Vaughn]

And of course you decide who is and is not an artist.

No -- actually here in particular, it is often self-declared, one way or the other.

 

[FotoD]

It's only been 104 years since Marcel Duchamp showed that art is whatever someone calls art. Keep this thread going for another 100 years and Photrio just might accept that too.

Even if it was the most important work of art from the 20th century, I'm a bit unsure if his urinal is considered "Fine Art".

Wikipedia:
"Bottle Rack (1914), a bottle-drying rack signed by Duchamp, is considered to be the first "pure" readymade. In Advance of the Broken Arm (1915), a snow shovel, also called Prelude to a Broken Arm, followed soon after. His Fountain, a urinal signed with the pseudonym "R. Mutt", shocked the art world in 1917.[31] Fountain was selected in 2004 as "the most influential artwork of the 20th century" by 500 renowned artists and historians.[8]"

 

[VinceInMT]

As I mentioned on a previous thread, I am i credit away from a BFA (a retirement project). I had a choice between the standard Bachelor of Art (in Art), a Bachelor of Art (in Art Education), and the Bachelor of Fine Arts. Having retired from teaching (high school: technology), I wasn’t interesting the education option. The difference between the BA and the BFA requirements was with the latter, the 4 semesters of a foreign language was replaced with more art history and more studio art classes. Not looking forward to the memorization entailed in the languages (that’s harder at my age) I opted for the BFA which also required a portfolio review, artist statement, and an essay. So, according to the university, “Fine” means less language more art.

I will say that while I won’t get into the meaning of “fine” when applied to art, although I suspect it is a marketing term, through the process of acquiring the BFA I certainly know more about art, the various movements over time, the major players than I did before, all which should enrich my trip to Italy next May and has informed by own art making. Aside from that, I’ve been exposed to and acquired a wide range in skills in media I’d never worked in before such as ceramics, sculpture, printmaking, new media, and painting. Photography and drawing remain my preferred methods of image making and where I have improved in those is an better approach, conceptually, to what I produce.

BTW, here in Montana, Vietnam Era vets and those over 65, two boxes I’ve been able to check during this return to college, receive full tuition waivers so it’s been a pretty inexpensive endeavor.

 

[Arthurwg]

It's only been 104 years since Marcel Duchamp showed that art is whatever someone calls art.
if it was the most important work of art from the 20th century, I'm a bit unsure if his urinal is considered "Fine Art".
[8]"

You don't find a Duchamp around every corner. And the urinal is rather shapely you must admit. Note it is not sitting as it would on a wall. The new position takes it out of context and transforms it. But in the end it's the"idea" that is the art. If you have a good idea and the sensibility to go with it, you might just be an artist.

 

[FotoD]

You don't find a Duchamp around every corner. And the urinal is rather shapely you must admit. Note it is not sitting as it would on a wall. The new position takes it out of context and transforms it. But in the end it's the"idea" that is the art. If you have a good idea and the sensibility to go with it, you might just be an artist.

Oh, you're absolutely right it's brilliant! I didn't mean to take the piss out of him.

 

[Sirius Glass]

When I want to sell the same matted frame print for more money, I call it fine art.