Troubles with developing Tri-X

[DsrtBill]

Hello everyone

I am relatively new to photography, and decided to give home developing a go. I chose the combination of Tri-X and Rodinal for 35mm. So far, every roll of Tri-X I have developed has come out underwhelming.

Basically, I am trying to develop Tri-X in Rodinal for future darkroom printing, and having issues with the learning curve. I developed 3 rolls of Tri-X rated at 400 with the dilution of 1:50 for 8 minutes, and had two different results. I thought I had figured it out with this dilution and time, but after having a different result, I decided to just ask for help. The first two rolls were in a 2-roll Paterson tank; the second roll was in an old Anscomatic tank. Below, I've included images and all the relevant information I could think of.

First Development

The first photo (no.1) is of the bottom of 2 rolls (the bottom looked better than the top).
1:50 (~15.5ml Rodinal and ~785ml Water) for 8 minutes at ~18c (more around ~18.6c, possibly hotter by the end of development from the sun) with the first minute of agitation, then the final 10 seconds of every minute after.
Ilford wash method
Ilford Rapidfix (Mixed Oct 11 2025, used 3 times) at 22c for 2 minutes.
When I first took the negatives out of the wetting agent, they looked extremely purple, but for the most part, that has faded. Still a purple-blue base, but not as extreme.

no.1

Second Development (Trying to solve the purple-blue color)
Pre-soaked while mixing the Rodinal; I did not do that with the first development.
The dilution was 1:50 (~10ml Rodinal + ~490ml Water) for 8 minutes, but at ~19-20c (the thermometer was flipping between 19.9c and 20c). Same agitation; first minute, then last 10 seconds of every minute.
I read online somewhere (Flickr, maybe) that double fixing would help with the purple, so I did that.
First fix was Ilford Rapidfix for 2 min ~23c (Same fix working mix as last time, Oct 11 2025, I poured some into a small glass and it appeared to be fine; however, did not do a leader test).
Then I filled the tank up with water and agitated for about a minute, then poured it out, repeated that 3 times.
The second fix was Ilford Rapidfix for 3 minutes at 22c (mixed Nov 5 2025/today), after that I set it to sit under a hose with water running for a bit before drying.

This photo (no.2) does not illustrate very well how thin this leader is.
no.2

The Kodak 400TX along the top is only really visible for the first few frames, and the frame markers just do not exist. The film appears to be underdeveloped, but since this dilution worked before, I am just confused about how and why of it being as such.

no.3

The camera's white balance is slightly off; the background was an off-white/old yellowed bedsheet.

I am in a rather rural area and have to use well and/or distilled water, and collect the used water for later disposal. Controlling the temperature is also nearly impossible. I keep the distilled water outside, so it is generally cooler when I go to use it, ~17-19c with the current weather. While the chemicals are stored in a plastic chest indoors, so are normally ~20-22c. I have no idea if this is the best method or even how to cool down the chemicals effectively. I tried using ice water in the past, but that is mainly a waste of water and time, and it did not help. All chemicals were mixed with distilled water and not well water.

I'd really appreciate any advice or guidance. I am looking for negatives that can be printed with an enlarger with relative ease, which I believe means contrast and an amount of grain with detail.

Thank you in advance for your time and knowledge.
- Bill

 

[MattKing]

Welcome to Photrio.
Thanks for sharing pics of the negatives themselves.
They do look under-developed to me.
Perhaps your Rodinal concentrate has problems.
But it also may be that 8 minutes is far too short for 1+49 dilution Rodinal.
I'm seeing recommendations of 13 minutes at 20C.
And by the way, the purple tint isn't very important. Yes you can take steps like using a washaid to help remove it, but it doesn't have an important affect.

 

[TomR55]

Several things to consider here:

(0) Presoaking: I never do this but others on this forum are quite well-versed and experienced with the technical considerations for those wishing to pre-soak.
(1) Temperature control of all solutions is critical for dependable and repeatable results. Invest in a good thermometer and ensure that your developer, stop bath, fixer, and subsequent solutions (such as HypoClearing Agent, wash water, and wetting agent solutions) are within 1 - 2 degrees C for uniform and repeatable results.
(2) I am unclear, based on your post, about how you are diluting and using your developer. Dilute developers are intended to be used once and tossed.
(3) “Purplish tint” is most likely anti-halation dye. Removing this dye will result in clear negatives (which is how TriX should appear).

In reverse order: I fix TriX in rapid Fixer (Claytons, but any good brand will do)—make sure that you periodically check the fix with a few drops of Hypo Check, or observing clearing times for film leaders. Many on this forum will provide details for testing developer and fixer solutions … .

I fix TriX for a good 4 to 5 minutes with intermittent agitation. This is followed by a 2 minute treatment in a Hypo Clearing agent—which speeds up the wash cycle and will remove most (if not all) of that anti-halation dye. I then use the Ilford wash cycle:

Fill and invert the tank five times; wait 4-5 minutes; pour out the water.
Fill and invert the tank ten times; wait 4-5 minutes; pour out the water; finally,
Fill and invert the tank 20 times; wait 4-5 minutes; pour out the water.

Optionally, treat the film for 30 seconds in an extremely dilute PhotoFlo (or equivalent) solution; hang to dry in a dust free environment.

I don’t use Rodinal so cannot comment on your times. I advise checking https://www.digitaltruth.com/ for starting points with this film/developer combination. Your negatives appear underdeveloped.

I don’t know what you mean by the camera’s “white balance,” in relation to exposing Panchromatic film? I have no such adjustment capacities on any of my film cameras. Perhaps others on this forum will have more to contribute on that account.

 

[MattKing]

This is what ADOX says about developing times using their version of Rodinal - at 20C:

 

[Alex Benjamin]

First Development

The first photo (no.1) is of the bottom of 2 rolls (the bottom looked better than the top).
1:50 (~15.5ml Rodinal and ~785ml Water) for 8 minutes at ~18c (more around ~18.6c, possibly hotter by the end of development from the sun) with the first minute of agitation, then the final 10 seconds of every minute after.
Ilford wash method
Ilford Rapidfix (Mixed Oct 11 2025, used 3 times) at 22c for 2 minutes.

Second Development (Trying to solve the purple-blue color)
Pre-soaked while mixing the Rodinal; I did not do that with the first development.
The dilution was 1:50 (~10ml Rodinal + ~490ml Water) for 8 minutes, but at ~19-20c (the thermometer was flipping between 19.9c and 20c). Same agitation; first minute, then last 10 seconds of every minute.
I read online somewhere (Flickr, maybe) that double fixing would help with the purple, so I did that.
First fix was Ilford Rapidfix for 2 min ~23c (Same fix working mix as last time, Oct 11 2025, I poured some into a small glass and it appeared to be fine; however, did not do a leader test).
Then I filled the tank up with water and agitated for about a minute, then poured it out, repeated that 3 times.
The second fix was Ilford Rapidfix for 3 minutes at 22c (mixed Nov 5 2025/today), after that I set it to sit under a hose with water running for a bit before drying.

Did you use a stop bath after the developer, or went straight to the fix? It's not mentioned in your description.

Your fix time is too short. Ilford suggests 3 minutes minimum. I usally do 4.

@MattKing is right. Your development time is too short. Agfa suggests 12 minutes at 20ºC at 400EI.

 

[MattKing]

That Agfa chart is quite old, and Tri-X is probably a bit different since then.
But it's a good place to start.

 

[thinkbrown]

My bottle of R09 lists a development time of 14 minutes for Tri-X in 1+50, so that adds some more credibility to underdevelopment

 

[Craig]

Did you use the 1+4 dilution for the fixer or 1+9? Either way, 2 min is too short. With 1+4 dilution (200 ml of concentrate in 800ml of water) to make 1L, I fix for 4 min, except for Tmax films that take longer to clear the magenta stain.

Your negatives look both under developed and under fixed.

 

[Alex Benjamin]

My bottle of R09 lists a development time of 14 minutes for Tri-X in 1+50, so that adds some more credibility to underdevelopment

Your negatives look both under developed and under fixed.

Agreed. There are two obvious problems with the negs, under-development and under-fixing. If a stop bath wasn't used, then that makes three problems.

I read online somewhere (Flickr, maybe) that double fixing would help with the purple, so I did that.

Bit of advice: do not ever, ever, ever, ever follow advice regarding film development from social media such as Facebook or Flickr. The amount of ignorance and stupidity I see every day on Facebook pages that are supposed to be dedicated to black and white film development is absolutely staggering.

I am looking for negatives that can be printed with an enlarger with relative ease, which I believe means contrast and an amount of grain with detail.

Black and white film development is an extremely simple 5-step process that goes (1) developer, (2) stop, (3) fix, (4) wash, and (5) hang to dry. Each step comes with a few basic guidelines that, as a beginner, if you follow them you will always come out of there with printable negatives.

1. Developer: always follow the development times, associated temperature (use a temperature adjustment chart if you can't have 20ºC), and, when provided, agitation patterns suggested by the manufacturer either of the film or of the developer. Do not use the Massive Dev Chart or times and temps you may have "read online somewhere".
2. Stop bath: always follow the minimum time suggested by the manufacturer. For safety measure, you can add time with no consequence. Always use for the amount of films suggested by the manufacturer
3. Fix: Same as Stop bath
4. Wash: Use either Ilford wash sequence or wash in sink according to manufacturer's suggested time
5. Hang to dry: pick a spot without dust

A bit of Photo-Flo after the wash is a good thing, but you can live without it.

Apart from that, that's it. Follow this, you'll get printable negs. Whether or not they are printable "with ease," relative or not, is another matter, but they will be printable in a satisfactory manner.

That Agfa chart is quite old

So am I. What are you implying?

Kidding aside, I haven't tested the Tri-X time, but the T-Max time (ISO 64 at 1+50) works for me. I have both charts, but I found the times of the one you posted too long for my taste. I also like the fact that the ISO is given in the older one.

 

[DsrtBill]

Thanks, Matt, Tom, and Alex!

Perhaps your Rodinal concentrate has problems.

I don't think it is the Rodinal. I have developed other films, such as "CatLABS X FILM 320 Pro BW Negative", and as far as I can tell, they look acceptable.

This is what ADOX says about developing times using their version of Rodinal - at 20C:
View attachment 410738

@MattKing is right. Your development time is too short. Agfa suggests 12 minutes at 20ºC at 400EI.

I'll give the 1:50/1+49 for 14 min a try and post the results.

(2) I am unclear, based on your post, about how you are diluting and using your developer. Dilute developers are intended to be used once and tossed.

I am measuring out the distilled water in a 1000ml beaker, then measuring out the Rodinal concentrate in a 10ml or 50ml beaker, and then pouring the Rodinal into the water and briefly stirring before pouring it into the tank. After developing for the amount of time, it is poured into a collection jug for disposal.
This might not be the best way to do things, but it is what I have.

Did you use a stop bath after the developer, or went straight to the fix? It's not mentioned in your description.

Yes, I used a water stop bath.
With the 1st development, I used the Ilford Wash Method, with inversions.
However, with the 2nd development, I used an Anscomatic tank, so I washed by filling it up, agitating for about a minute, and pouring out, repeating it 3 times. I did this before fixing and after the first fix.
I plan to just run it under well water for some undetermined amount of time next time I use that tank.

Fill and invert the tank five times; wait 4-5 minutes; pour out the water.
Fill and invert the tank ten times; wait 4-5 minutes; pour out the water; finally,
Fill and invert the tank 20 times; wait 4-5 minutes; pour out the water.

I haven't heard of letting it sit. Is it better to let it sit for 4-5 minutes instead of just doing the inversions?

Your fix time is too short. Ilford suggests 3 minutes minimum. I usally do 4.

Got it, I'll fix it for the 5 minutes next time, and I'll also drop the two fixes.

I don’t know what you mean by the camera’s “white balance,” in relation to exposing Panchromatic film? I have no such adjustment capacities on any of my film cameras. Perhaps others on this forum will have more to contribute on that account.

Apologies for the confusion, I meant the digital camera I was using to take the photos of the negatives. The digital JPG images came out more yellow than I was expecting.

And by the way, the purple tint isn't very important. Yes you can take steps like using a washaid to help remove it, but it doesn't have an important affect.

(3) “Purplish tint” is most likely anti-halation dye. Removing this dye will result in clear negatives (which is how TriX should appear).

Should I worry about the dye being visible? Does it have any effect on printing? From what I've looked at, Tri-X should be clear, like what Tom mentioned, hence why I tried the double fix. For all intents and purposes, the negatives were clear- just too clear!

I still have some questions.

Why did the negatives have such a drastic change between developments?
In no.1, the frame on the right (Ignore frame 0; it was likely taken with the lens cap on) and the rest of the roll look fine to me; there are images, and you can tell what they are.
But with no.2/,3 the images are just barely there, if at all?
Could this have to do with the amount of Rodinal and the sizes of the tanks?

Thanks again,
- Bill

 

[reddesert]

In addition to things other people have said, I think your temperature control could be rethought. You can develop B&W film anywhere between say 68-77 F (20-25 C) with good results as long as you read the right time off a time/temperature chart. (You could probably go warmer but there is no benefit). However, as you go below 68 F/20 C, the activity of the developer drops and you have to extend development. So in your first try, the time was too short _and_ the developer was of order 1.5-2 C too cold, which isn't a lot but it demands a 10-15% increase in developing time.

So, just get the developer to somewhere at 20 C or slightly higher and read a time-temp chart to understand how to compensate. You don't need to worry about small variations like a half degree C or 1 deg F variation over the course of developing. If it does warm up or cool down by ~0.5-1 C over time, you can adjust the developing time slightly to compensate. Because you are diluting to make the working solution, it should be simple to get the developer somewhere between 20-25 C by adding cool or warm water as needed.

For the fixer, the exact temp doesn't matter. Just get it somewhere between 20-25 C and fix for longer. Nobody ever died from fixing 50% more than the absolute minimum time.

The purple or blue tint typically comes out in some combination of fixer, wash aid, and wash, especially in the wash aid (like Perma Wash).

I thought Tri-X in Rodinal in 35mm was perhaps grainy, but I haven't used that combo for a long time.

 

[DsrtBill]

Did you use the 1+4 dilution for the fixer or 1+9? Either way, 2 min is too short. With 1+4 dilution (200 ml of concentrate in 800ml of water) to make 1L, I fix for 4 min, except for Tmax films that take longer to clear the magenta stain.

Your negatives look both under developed and under fixed.

I've been using 1+4, but in a 600ml working mix, so 120ml Rapid Fix + 480ml Water. I'll mix up a full litre next time to meet your recommendation. 1:9 is for prints, right?

Black and white film development is an extremely simple 5-step process that goes (1) developer, (2) stop, (3) fix, (4) wash, and (5) hang to dry. Each step comes with a few basic guidelines that, as a beginner, if you follow them you will always come out of there with printable negatives.

1. Developer: always follow the development times, associated temperature (use a temperature adjustment chart if you can't have 20ºC), and, when provided, agitation patterns suggested by the manufacturer either of the film or of the developer. Do not use the Massive Dev Chart or times and temps you may have "read online somewhere".
2. Stop bath: always follow the minimum time suggested by the manufacturer. For safety measure, you can add time with no consequence. Always use for the amount of films suggested by the manufacturer
3. Fix: Same as Stop bath
4. Wash: Use either Ilford wash sequence or wash in sink according to manufacturer's suggested time
5. Hang to dry: pick a spot without dust

A bit of Photo-Flo after the wash is a good thing, but you can live without it.

This is pretty much the workflow I have, though I use a water stop-bath.
I also run the negative through a large glass with Photo-Flo before hanging to dry.
Where do I find a temperature adjustment chart? I have never heard of one before

Apart from that, that's it. Follow this, you'll get printable negs. Whether or not they are printable "with ease," relative or not, is another matter, but they will be printable in a satisfactory manner.

That is a fair point!

I think your temperature control could be rethought. You can develop B&W film anywhere between say 68-77 F (20-25 C) with good results as long as you read the right time off a time/temperature chart. (You could probably go warmer but there is no benefit). However, as you go below 68 F/20 C, the activity of the developer drops and you have to extend development. So in your first try, the time was too short _and_ the developer was of order 1.5-2 C too cold, which isn't a lot but it demands a 10-15% increase in developing time.

So, just get the developer to somewhere at 20 C or slightly higher and read a time-temp chart to understand how to compensate. You don't need to worry about small variations like a half degree C or 1 deg F variation over the course of developing. If it does warm up or cool down by ~0.5-1 C over time, you can adjust the developing time slightly to compensate. Because you are diluting to make the working solution, it should be simple to get the developer somewhere between 20-25 C by adding cool or warm water as needed.

Alright, thanks. I'll try to avoid going under 20c in the future. Do you recommend checking the temperature every minute?

For the fixer, the exact temp doesn't matter. Just get it somewhere between 20-25 C and fix for longer. Nobody ever died from fixing 50% more than the absolute minimum time.

I was slightly worried about the fixer being too warm, and the developer, for that matter, erring on the side of cooler. That being said, I was wrong, so forgetting about that.
If the fixer is within the 20-25c range, do I need to worry about fixing more than 4 minutes?

- Bill

 

[MattKing]

One trick for using highly concentrated solutions like Rodinal:
- Put enough dilutant water into your target working solution container to get the volume to approximately half your total desired volume.
- Fill the smaller graduate to the desired volume of concentrate, and then pour that into the working solution container.
- Use the balance of your dilutant water to rinse the smaller graduate several times, and pour the resultant rinse into the working solution container - you want all of that concentrate into the working solution container.
- top up the working solution container with dilutant water, until the total desired volume is in it.

 

[Alex Benjamin]

I haven't heard of letting it sit.

Neither have I. Here's the Ilford instructions :

I've been doing this method for years. I don't see the point in letting the tank sit for 15 minutes when the whole idea behing the method, as Ilford states, is to make the wash faster. Also, having the film sit in water which still has some fix in it seems rather counterproductive.

@TomR55 : where did you get the sitting part from ?

Naked Photographer did a test of the effectiveness of the Ilford three step method in one of his videos, BTW:

 

[Craig]

This video from Ilford might help you visualize the process, although I would not have used the squeegee at the end. There is too much risk of scratching the film, I just hang my film to dry.

 

[Alex Benjamin]

Where do I find a temperature adjustment chart?

https://www.ilfordphoto.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/Temperature-compensation-chart.pdf

 

[MattKing]

I've been using 1+4, but in a 600ml working mix, so 120ml Rapid Fix + 480ml Water. I'll mix up a full litre next time to meet your recommendation.

There is no problem with using a total volume of 600 ml, as long as that is enough to cover the film in the tank. The smaller volume will affect the calculation though of how many times you can reuse that fixer to fix more films.

 

[Craig]

I've been doing this method for years. I don't see the point in letting the tank sit for 15 minutes when the whole idea behing the method, as Ilford states, is to make the wash faster.

Agree, the whole point of washing to remove the fixer from the film. The best way to do that is to have the difference in concentration between fix and clean wash water as great as possible. That means continuously moving clean water will remove the fix the fastest and with the least amount of water.

The agitation and continuous movement of the water is important for a wash.

 

[MattKing]

I believe that the logic behind the sitting times relates to the fact that the actual physical mechanism involved when washing fixer out of the gelatin on the film is a diffusion mechanism. That is the reason that, above a certain quite low flow rate, it makes little difference to the total washing time if you speed up the water flow.
But yes, the water does its work best and fastest if it moves.

 

[Pieter12]

From the first post: “The camera’s white balance was off…”

??????

 

[MattKing]

From the first post: “The camera’s white balance was off…”

??????

That was referenced earlier - it refers to the digital camera that took the photo of the negatives - important to the question about the colour of those negatives.

 

[reddesert]

Where do I find a temperature adjustment chart? I have never heard of one before

Alright, thanks. I'll try to avoid going under 20c in the future. Do you recommend checking the temperature every minute?


I was slightly worried about the fixer being too warm, and the developer, for that matter, erring on the side of cooler. That being said, I was wrong, so forgetting about that.
If the fixer is within the 20-25c range, do I need to worry about fixing more than 4 minutes?

So, hopefully this comment comes across as firm rather than harsh, but I think you need a critical piece of equipment, which is a book. A good introductory book on the basics of B&W photography and darkroom work. There are a number of good ones (eg Horenstein "B&W Basic Manual," Schaeffer's "Ansel Adams Basic Techniques", David Vestal's "Craft of Photography," and so on) and we have a few threads about recommendations. But it is IMO better to read a book about how to do this stuff, than to learn it all from the internet, forums and Youtube videos, because the internet doesn't do a good job of separating the important from the trivial.

For example, time - temperature compensation for developers didn't come up until posts #9 and #11. The people who posted advice before that know about it, but it's such a basic concept that they did not know that you didn't know about it. The Kodak Darkroom Dataguide has a little calculator wheel to compute the compensation. This is an excellent source of information even though the specific films/papers/chemicals are out of date.

You really do not need to take the temperature of the developer every minute, especially for B&W. I just take it at the beginning and figure that I am working close enough to room temp that it probably won't change by more than a degree by the end. The only time that is critical to not overdo, is the developing time.

It's possible to overfix a film, but I think you would have to try pretty hard. If the clearing time for a fully exposed film is (for example) 2 minutes in rapid fixer at 20 C to get a clear piece of film in daylight, then you should fix for 4 minutes (double the clearing time). But if you leave the film in for 8 minutes, it is very unlikely that you would notice any effect of overfixing.

My routine is more or less: get the developer to somewhere in ~68-75 F (it is often hot where I am, and I may add an ice cube when diluting the developer). I have hard water, and use distilled water for the developer and Photo-flo but tap water for the other solutions. Develop for the recommended time-temp with agitation every 30 seconds. The temp of the remaining solutions can be anywhere in ~ 65-80 F: stop for 30sec to 1 minute; fixer for recommended time from the bottle (say 4 min for rapid fixer); wash aid for recommended time; wash by your favorite method; Photo-flo in distilled water for 30 sec without agitation; no squeegee, hang to dry.

 

[TomR55]

Neither have I. Here's the Ilford instructions :

View attachment 410744

I've been doing this method for years. I don't see the point in letting the tank sit for 15 minutes when the whole idea behing the method, as Ilford states, is to make the wash faster. Also, having the film sit in water which still has some fix in it seems rather counterproductive.

@TomR55 : where did you get the sitting part from ?

Naked Photographer did a test of the effectiveness of the Ilford three step method in one of his videos, BTW:

IIRC I got that information from an old post on this forum? If I will try to find the thread and follow-up. That said, I had been using the sequence exactly as you indicated (from Ilford) with no bad results (of course, lacking sophisticated test equipment/procedures, I might not ever really know … given my age). Thank you for the inquiry, though. Saving an extra fifteen minutes is a good thing. I wonder if the Ilford procedure works as well for T-Grain films?

 

[npl]

Discussion about the Ilford wash method : https://www.photrio.com/forum/threads/ilford-wash-method.45680/

Edit : and the sticky thread : https://www.photrio.com/forum/threads/washing-film-best-environmentally-friendly-way-to-do-it.43248/