The pretty close to definitive guide to how you screwed up

Mid Day Matinée

A
Mid Day Matinée

  • 0
  • 0
  • 20
Cumberland Falls-7

A
Cumberland Falls-7

  • 1
  • 0
  • 77
Winter

A
Winter

  • 2
  • 0
  • 181
Pig Iron elevations.jpg

A
Pig Iron elevations.jpg

  • 1
  • 0
  • 247
Cumberland Falls-6

A
Cumberland Falls-6

  • 0
  • 0
  • 193

Recent Classifieds

Forum statistics

Threads
181,941
Messages
2,517,803
Members
95,456
Latest member
jrhii
Recent bookmarks
0

Donald Qualls

Subscriber
Joined
Jan 19, 2005
Messages
10,451
Location
North Carolina
Shooter
Multi Format
I have never encountered a problem with over fixing.

Rapid fixers are very weak bleaches (of the dissolve-the-image-silver variety). It is possible to overfix with them, though with most films and papers you'd never notice unless you left the medium to soak for days or weeks. Where you might actually see some effect from overfixing is if you're shooting microfilm stock -- as for instance in a submini camera to get grain that doesn't look like golf balls in an 8x10 print, or with microfilm-derived stocks like Tech Pan or CMS20. With silver grains as small as those films produce (or with some papers, especially warm tone) you may see some loss of density if you leave the film in the fixer for much longer than the short time needed to actually fix.
 

Donald Qualls

Subscriber
Joined
Jan 19, 2005
Messages
10,451
Location
North Carolina
Shooter
Multi Format
How would I scan and post a negative here to show what it looks like?

Hold it up in front of a diffuse bright surface (that will be out of focus, ideally) and photograph it with a smart phone or digital camera, scan it with either a reflective scanner (once again, backed with something light like white paper), or scan without inversion on a film scanner. All these methods have their up and down sidees.
 
Joined
Aug 29, 2017
Messages
5,993
Location
New Jersey formerly NYC
Shooter
Multi Format
Clipboard01a.jpg
Here are (3) 4x5 negatives placed against the monitor screen and shot with my cellphone. Tmax 100
Clipboard01.jpg
 

Donald Qualls

Subscriber
Joined
Jan 19, 2005
Messages
10,451
Location
North Carolina
Shooter
Multi Format
I see detail in the deepest shadows you've included in the "shady" negative, so they aren't any lower than about Zone VII. I wouldn't call that underexposed, that's about right. Depending on visualization, you could even have given one stop less exposure.
 

Radost

Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2021
Messages
598
Location
USA from Ukraine
Shooter
Multi Format
Just refixed. Trix Negs look clearer. Waiting to dry. Would be interested to compare before and after scans
 
Joined
Aug 29, 2017
Messages
5,993
Location
New Jersey formerly NYC
Shooter
Multi Format
I see detail in the deepest shadows you've included in the "shady" negative, so they aren't any lower than about Zone VII. I wouldn't call that underexposed, that's about right. Depending on visualization, you could even have given one stop less exposure.
It didn;t seem right as if it was too light. But it did seem to adjust ok in Lightroom. Thnaks.
 

esearing

Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2004
Messages
364
Location
North GA
Shooter
4x5 Format
Surprisingly I only had a couple of the items from Ilford's list. My latest goof comes from taking the camera out on a humid morning and forgetting to check the lens for fog just before capture. What was a low contrast image to start with is even more so, but still has some sharpness to it, not quite sure how. Seems to affect the darker tones more than the lighter tones.
 

snusmumriken

Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2021
Messages
770
Location
Salisbury, UK
Shooter
35mm
I guess those are just the most common errors. There was a more comprehensive catalogue in the old Ilford Manual of Photography.

(Most of that book is still relevant and worthy of study if you can find a copy. I got mine as a school prize in about 1970, and it was in its umpteenth edition by then.)
 

snusmumriken

Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2021
Messages
770
Location
Salisbury, UK
Shooter
35mm
How should I guesstimate the time for refixing?

For hypo fixers, I pop the film leader into the top of the developing tank, under the cap, and check it between tank inversions. When it is clear, note the time and give the film the same time again.

I'm pretty sure I read in an Ilford data sheet that rapid fixers don't follow this rule, so I follow Ilford recommendations on those.
 
Last edited:

Radost

Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2021
Messages
598
Location
USA from Ukraine
Shooter
Multi Format
I started adding 50% of recomended time to fix. Small time price to pay to make sure it is fixed right.
 

zeta3

Member
Joined
Dec 31, 2007
Messages
34
Location
Switzerland
Shooter
Multi Format
I have a new mistake to add.
Wearing an Apple watch while using a changing bag ... I of course never saw the lights come on inside the bag, but the sheet of film did :sad:
 

momus

Subscriber
Joined
Jun 14, 2009
Messages
5,507
Location
gone
Shooter
Medium Format
After re reading The Elements of Style, I've edited this a wee bit: everyone needs to know the basics, but we should figure out our own way of working, and sometimes it's good to experiment.
 
Last edited:

Radost

Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2021
Messages
598
Location
USA from Ukraine
Shooter
Multi Format
Just tried ilford rapid fix.
6 minutes of fixing has the same results of under fixing.
My developer is Kodak Xtol.
Any idea what makes the fixers not work as well?
I am using kodak stop bath in between.
 

snusmumriken

Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2021
Messages
770
Location
Salisbury, UK
Shooter
35mm
In my experience, that product is very reliable, and stable under reasonable storage conditions, so I feel sure something must be wrong at your end.

What exactly are you seeing? Has the film failed to clear? I can't think what other signs of under-fixing you could see without chemical tests. Any residual pink base colour in e.g. T-Max should wash out after fixing.

You say 'just tried': does that mean this is your first use of the product? Was it a previously unopened bottle of concentrate, and not very old stock? Are you certain you diluted it 1+4? Did you dilute it for this film? Otherwise, how long ago was it mixed, and how many films has it processed?

Also - may seem a stupid question - but what film? I mean, if you had loaded a colour film by mistake ... I know, I know, but mistakes do happen.

Good news is that you can almost certainly re-fix in a fresh solution without penalty, even if you have washed and dried the film - but 3 min fixing in a fresh solution should be ample. I think I've read that serious over-fixing can lead to nasty things happening to the emulsion, but I've never done that so I have no experience.
 

momus

Subscriber
Joined
Jun 14, 2009
Messages
5,507
Location
gone
Shooter
Medium Format
Radost, I know of no better teacher than experience when it comes to knowing when the film is fully developed. Keeping notes and learning from things is a huge part of analog photography. Or, screw up enough and you become an expert. There really is no replacement for experience.

I keep my chemicals in mason jars w/ the lids on them in the water bath. The lids have FIXER and DEVELOPER written in black marker on their tops. That ended my experiments w/ developing film w/ fixer......for now. I'm sure one day I'll get them mixed up again. Probably should just keep the fix on the counter, the developer in the water bath, I doubt that room temps will affect the film if it's developed at the right temps.
 

Radost

Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2021
Messages
598
Location
USA from Ukraine
Shooter
Multi Format
In my experience, that product is very reliable, and stable under reasonable storage conditions, so I feel sure something must be wrong at your end.

What exactly are you seeing? Has the film failed to clear? I can't think what other signs of under-fixing you could see without chemical tests. Any residual pink base colour in e.g. T-Max should wash out after fixing.

You say 'just tried': does that mean this is your first use of the product? Was it a previously unopened bottle of concentrate, and not very old stock? Are you certain you diluted it 1+4? Did you dilute it for this film? Otherwise, how long ago was it mixed, and how many films has it processed?

Also - may seem a stupid question - but what film? I mean, if you had loaded a colour film by mistake ... I know, I know, but mistakes do happen.

Good news is that you can almost certainly re-fix in a fresh solution without penalty, even if you have washed and dried the film - but 3 min fixing in a fresh solution should be ample. I think I've read that serious over-fixing can lead to nasty things happening to the emulsion, but I've never done that so I have no experience.

The film is CInestill BWXX.
So let me try Kodak TriX tonight and see if it makes a difference.
 

Sirius Glass

Subscriber
Joined
Jan 18, 2007
Messages
43,837
Location
Southern California
Shooter
Multi Format
Just tried ilford rapid fix.
6 minutes of fixing has the same results of under fixing.
My developer is Kodak Xtol.
Any idea what makes the fixers not work as well?
I am using kodak stop bath in between.

As fixer gets older extend the time. Fix for 10 minutes. After that is fixing is not complete mix new fixer.
 
Photrio.com contains affiliate links to products. We may receive a commission for purchases made through these links.
To read our full affiliate disclosure statement please click Here.

PHOTRIO PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Ilford ADOX Freestyle Photographic Stearman Press Weldon Color Lab Blue Moon Camera & Machine
Top Bottom