Split grade printing question

[Pieter12]

I have become addicted to split-grade printing. However some prints come out a bit flat and dingy. I assume the problem is the 00 exposure. My question (because I won't get back to the darkroom until the weekend) is when I reduce the 00 exposure, should I compensate by adding to the 5 exposure to keep the dmax? I will experiment this weekend but would like a head start in this matter.

 

[Pieter12]

(I posted this to the wrong forum, re-posting)

I have become addicted to split-grade printing. However some prints come out a bit flat and dingy. I assume the problem is the 00 exposure. My question (because I won't get back to the darkroom until the weekend) is when I reduce the 00 exposure, should I compensate by adding to the 5 exposure to keep the dmax? I will experiment this weekend but would like a head start in this matter.

 

[David Allen]

For me the 00 + 5 form of split-grade printing never delivers acceptable results. This is because all of the highlights, specular highlights and lighter greys all receive 00 exposure which makes them all go flat (or at least they loose their brilliance).

Sure 00 + 5 split-grade printing delivers a relatively high level of acceptable prints but I find that none of them are really great and all lack that particular ‘glow’ that I like. Generally, I make my prints at a fixed grade with some dodging and burning and this maintains the micro-contrast that I like in my prints. Where I do use a form of split-grade printing is when a fixed grade delivers a good print accept for a particular area that, even with burning, remains to 'bright' or contrasty. In this situation, I will burn in with a lower grade of contrast (or selectively pre-flash the area). This tames this particular area of the print without reducing the micro-contrast of the mid to dark shadow areas in the rest of the print.

Bests,

David.
www.dsallen.de

 

[Andrew Kleinfeld]

I've had good luck printing normally without the low contrast filter, and then giving a long exposure with the highest grade filter, to strengthen blacks without turning the highlights gray (unless my goal is to reduce contrast in the sky).

 

[Rudeofus]

Is there any fundamental difference between split grade printing or printing with properly selected multigrade filters (or a color head) ? In theory an equally timed exposure with grade 00 and grade 5 filters should be equal to grade 2.5.

 

[Frank53]

(I posted this to the wrong forum, re-posting)

I have become addicted to split-grade printing. However some prints come out a bit flat and dingy. I assume the problem is the 00 exposure. My question (because I won't get back to the darkroom until the weekend) is when I reduce the 00 exposure, should I compensate by adding to the 5 exposure to keep the dmax? I will experiment this weekend but would like a head start in this matter.

In split grade, 0 and 5 are two different things. Simplified, 0 is for highlights and 5 is for maximum black. So reducing one does not mean you have to compensate the other.
Regards,
Frank

 

[Frank53]

For me the 00 + 5 form of split-grade printing never delivers acceptable results. This is because all of the highlights, specular highlights and lighter greys all receive 00 exposure which makes them all go flat (or at least they loose their brilliance).

Sure 00 + 5 split-grade printing delivers a relatively high level of acceptable prints but I find that none of them are really great and all lack that particular ‘glow’ that I like. Generally, I make my prints at a fixed grade with some dodging and burning and this maintains the micro-contrast that I like in my prints. Where I do use a form of split-grade printing is when a fixed grade delivers a good print accept for a particular area that, even with burning, remains to 'bright' or contrasty. In this situation, I will burn in with a lower grade of contrast (or selectively pre-flash the area). This tames this particular area of the print without reducing the micro-contrast of the mid to dark shadow areas in the rest of the print.

Bests,

David.
www.dsallen.de

If you do not get acceptable results, you are doing something wrong. Of course there is always some burning and dodging to do.
Regards,
Frank

 

[elerion]

should I compensate by adding to the 5 exposure

Yes, you can and you probably should compensate for the shorter exposure, but bear in mind that this will change the final contrast you perceive.
Longer grade 5 exposure can lead to too-black blacks.
That depends on if everything is flat, or mainly highlights or shadows.
Also, keep in mind that grades 4 and up require more exposure than middle/low grades to achieve same densities.

You can do a test strip for different low/high contrast exposure times. They do not have to be 50% each. In fact, I see no point to it. I saw no difference between 50%/50%, and single grade printing, though I'd have to try again to give a more precise answer, as it's been almost two years now I don't do it.

If you don't want to dodge or burn, you can try to increase low contrast grade (0.5, 1, even 1.5), to increase highlight contrast, if that doesn't make any of your lights full white. If so, go back to grade 0 or 00.

You can also change the total exposure time. Remember.
Some test strips will help. I know no shorter way.

Maybe If you upload some images we can see, we could be more helpful.

 

[Frank53]

Is there any fundamental difference between split grade printing or printing with properly selected multigrade filters (or a color head) ? In theory an equally timed exposure with grade 00 and grade 5 filters should be equal to grade 2.5.

Yes, there is. Printing with selected filters is like an equation with two unknowns, time and grade. You can only solve it by trial and error. Some people are very good at that. I’m not.
Split grade is like an equation with one unknown, time. Time to get maximum black (5) and time to get detail in the highlights (00).
After you found those two, you can change them to your own taste.
Another advantage of split grade is that you can dodge during one of the two exposures if you want.
Regards,
Frank

 

[Anon Ymous]

Is there any fundamental difference between split grade printing or printing with properly selected multigrade filters (or a color head) ? In theory an equally timed exposure with grade 00 and grade 5 filters should be equal to grade 2.5.

In theory, yes, but others have noticed in the past that some papers don't respond very well to the 00 filter. The characteristic curve when using the 00 filter alone can give a strange result with some papers that looks a bit like a very pronounced shoulder. There's an abrupt reduction of contrast in the denser tones. This however can be overcome by using the 0, or 0,5 filter as the soft filter. There aren't really any drawbacks doing so, unless a pure 00 filter print is what is needed. But that would be very unusual.

 

[Jim Blomfield]

I always print split grade, mostly 00 and 5, but also other combinations, e.g., 3 and 5, depending on how much contrast is needed. Others mention test strips. I use test grids, usually 2 second intervals, with 00 on one axis and 5 on the other. This gives a good starting point. Also, I often use grade 5 to burn in hilights, especially when more detail is needed but not as much gray texture. This helps keep the muddiness out of hilights.

 

[elerion]

In theory an equally timed exposure with grade 00 and grade 5 filters should be equal to grade 2.5.

Ilford states that this is not absolutely true, because the VC paper response to each filters are not exactly identical.

I usually started with a grade 2 test strip.
I selected the best overall exposure time. Then take 50%/50% starting point.
Then I did another test strip, using different time distributions (Jim's grid method looks even better for some situations) .
If I wanted more blacks or more shadow contrast, I increased grade 5 exposure, and shorten grade 0 by half that time.
If I wanted more exposure in my lights, I increased grade 0 exposure, and shorten grade 5 by double that time.
If it happended that good constrast lead to too gray lights or too dark shadows, then I just shorten total exposure, keeping the ratio between low and high constrast exposures.

 

[REAndy]

I use test grids, usually 2 second intervals, with 00 on one axis and 5 on the other. This gives a good starting point

OMG that's an awesome idea. Maybe other people knew this, but I didn't. I appreciate your mentioning of this!!

 

[elerion]

OMG that's an awesome idea. Maybe other people knew this, but I didn't.

I didn't either.
I'll definitely try that one.

Meanwhile, I just remembered another method which worked very well for me.
I liked it because it requires just two linear test strips (no less, but no more).

Instead of starting with an overall exposure using grade 2 or 2.5:
- Do a first test strip using grade 0, ONLY, develop, and choose the time it delivers best highlights.
- Expose the whole piece of paper using the time you decided from the prior test, then change to grade 5, and do a seconds test strip on top, develop, and choose the time it delivers best shadows.

Just print using the times you found in the previous tests.

Plenty of options to choose from.

 

[Alan9940]

Hmm...I’ve never had a print come out flat and dingy with split grade printing. That said, I never change the exposure for the opposite side, once I’ve determined the correct exposure for that filter. Also, there is no hard-n-fast rule that you have to stick with the 00 filter for the high value exposure. Many times I’ll use a 0 or, even, a 1; all depends on what the high values look like.

 

[MattKing]

I rarely use the lowest contrast available to me when I use split grade.
Instead, I am much more likely to have a main exposure using either a grade 1 or grade 1.5 plus additional grade 4 exposure in the parts of the image that call for it.
The grade 1 or 1.5 exposure usually involves some burn and dodge time as well.
And don't fall into the mistake of thinking that you can only use the low contrast filter to bring out highlight detail. Careful use of localized high contrast burns also brings out highlight detail.
One demonstration that I always find useful is the following: After you have made a good print using split grade printing, make two additional prints. The first is a print using just the low grade exposure you used in the good print. The second is a print using just the high grade exposure you used in the good print.
Most likely you will find that the contribution to the tones comes predominantly from the low grade print.
One final point - while I usually start by first determining with the low grade exposure and then determine the subsequent high grade exposure, that approach works best for average to high contrast images.
If you have a low contrast image, it is easier to first determine the high contrast exposure, and then follow up with tests for the low contrast exposure.
In both cases, the second set of tests is done after applying the first exposure, as determined by the first set of tests.

 

[alentine]

From: darkroom Dave:

• In simple terms, the grade 0 low contrast exposure gives you control of the light grey areas in your print. To add more detail in these ‘highlights’ increase the grade 0 exposure time. To increase the overall print contrast increase the grade to 0.5, 1, 1.5 or 2. Be careful to avoid having white patches with no detail in your print. If this happens reduce the contrast again. Obviously if your print looks dull and without any bright areas (assuming it should have bright areas!) then decrease the exposure times until you see some.
• The high contrast exposure gives you control of the blacks and shadows. Increase this time until you see good blacks or decrease it until you can see some details in the shadows without completely losing your blacks. Be careful not to reduce your blacks to dark grey or your print will look low contrast! I always use grade 5 for the high contrast exposure.

The text is from: Darkroom Dave
Click the Text above, or this link:
http://www.darkroomdave.com/tutorial/split-grade-printing/

 

[alentine]

Plus this 2 pages thread:
https://www.photrio.com/forum/threads/split-printing-for-the-first-time.159794/page-2

 

[alentine]

From: darkroom Dave:

• In simple terms, the grade 0 low contrast exposure gives you control of the light grey areas in your print. To add more detail in these ‘highlights’ increase the grade 0 exposure time. To increase the overall print contrast increase the grade to 0.5, 1, 1.5 or 2. Be careful to avoid having white patches with no detail in your print. If this happens reduce the contrast again. Obviously if your print looks dull and without any bright areas (assuming it should have bright areas!) then decrease the exposure times until you see some.
• The high contrast exposure gives you control of the blacks and shadows. Increase this time until you see good blacks or decrease it until you can see some details in the shadows without completely losing your blacks. Be careful not to reduce your blacks to dark grey or your print will look low contrast! I always use grade 5 for the high contrast exposure.

The text is from: Darkroom Dave
Click the Text above, or this link:
http://www.darkroomdave.com/tutorial/split-grade-printing/

My number 100 post

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

I always do a test strip with the soft filter to determine exposure for the high values. Make a print. Then make another soft print, switch to high contrast filter, and make a test strip over top. Sometimes adjustments to for the soft filter exposure need to be made. I use large, blue, and green Roscoe filters above the negative for large format. I sometimes split grade with my VCL4500 head. Split grade is such an easy and effective way to print.

 

[Lachlan Young]

Split-grade has always struck me as a fairly pointless endeavour, especially when you've got multiple grades available, not to mention pre & post-flash, potassium ferricyanide etc, all of which will get you to a better result faster & less painfully. The less doctrinaire you are about your printing approach, the better.

 

[pentaxuser]

Mods. the OP transferred this thread but the former was not "killed" so we now have the same thread with diverging replies from different members. Please combine

pentaxuser

 

[adelorenzo]

Split-grade has always struck me as a fairly pointless endeavour, especially when you've got multiple grades available, not to mention pre & post-flash, potassium ferricyanide etc, all of which will get you to a better result faster & less painfully. The less doctrinaire you are about your printing approach, the better.

Printing, and especially dodging and burning, using different filter grades seems to me to be a way easier solution than flashing paper or bleaching. Switching filters takes only a second or two.

I rarely do true split filter printing but I am almost always incorporating different grades into my prints. For example I may do a basic exposure at grade 3, but then use a low contrast filter to burn in skies or other highlight areas to blend them in better, or burn areas in at high contrast to improve shadows. Why not take full advantage of the properties of multigrade paper?

 

[adelorenzo]

(I posted this to the wrong forum, re-posting)

I have become addicted to split-grade printing. However some prints come out a bit flat and dingy. I assume the problem is the 00 exposure. My question (because I won't get back to the darkroom until the weekend) is when I reduce the 00 exposure, should I compensate by adding to the 5 exposure to keep the dmax? I will experiment this weekend but would like a head start in this matter.

There is a lot of good (and valuable) discussion on this thread but the simple answer to your question is to try changing the 00 filter to a 0 or 1. This will boost the overall contrast of the print.

 

[Lachlan Young]

Printing, and especially dodging and burning, using different filter grades seems to me to be a way easier solution than flashing paper or bleaching. Switching filters takes only a second or two.

I rarely do true split filter printing but I am almost always incorporating different grades into my prints. For example I may do a basic exposure at grade 3, but then use a low contrast filter to burn in skies or other highlight areas to blend them in better, or burn areas in at high contrast to improve shadows. Why not take full advantage of the properties of multigrade paper?

Because some day you will hit the limits of what merely changing grades can do. And if you can avoid making a registered mask or need to make an 'impossible' burn they are life & material savers. Or maybe you want to finesse highlights to make the print feel right.