Questions on Intrepid 4x5 Conversion kit -- retrofitting?

[f/Alex]

Hi,

TLDR, does anyone here have experience fitting Intrepid 4x5 conversion kits not into a graflox camera but onto a pre-existing enlarger? Or just general experience with Intrepid enlargers?

As I've mentioned in the past, I work at my university darkroom as a student technician. We are looking at having a class that seriously uses the darkroom in the coming months (it's been almost 3 years since the last one!), part of my work has been getting the enlargers in shape, we have 10 Omega Ds and an assortment of mostly broken Chromegas. Unfortunately, in our current state we only have 8 working omega Ds and one chromega (the rest are broken, or missing power supplies, 2nd hand they are insane, all our spare power supplies started emitting magic smoke). We've been talking about potentially buying beseler cadets, but that's limiting to 35mm, and we have a good number of really nice Mamiya medium format cameras, we've also talked about Besseler 23Cs, but those are too pricy. My idea of the day is to potentially fit our existing 4x5 Omega enlarger stands that are missing working heads with Intrepid 4x5 camera conversion kits, I found someone who did so with a Beseler 45mx with just a 3d printed part and some foam. The other disadvantage to purchasing replacement parts for our broken Omega Ds and/or Chromegas is the lack of working timers, we currently have zero surplus enlarger timers.
Reddit Link to Post about converted beseler 45mxt

Doing the math, this would be a cost effective way to use our prexisting lens collection, table mounts, and bellows with a modern and theoretically easy to use timing system, while continueing to provide full 35mm-4x5 compatability.

 

[blee1996]

You might want to check this thread: we were just discussing this week.

My experience with and reflections on the Intrepid 4x5 enlarger

This post is my reflections on, and semi-review of, the Intrepid 4x5 enlarger. I have no relation to Intrepid the company, other than that I recently gave them a lot of money. I've seen a lot of posts from people curious about it, but not so many from people who have actually used them...

www.photrio.com

 

[tcolgate]

Itt sounds like it'd take a bit of fabrication. The negative carrier for the intrepid light basically rests on the back of the camera. So you'll need something that you can attach the bellows to that will also fill that function.
There's also a small amount of felt light seal material around the inside of the LED head. I've heard complaints that that can shed fibres. I've not had that problem, but in an academic setting where they'd get heavy use, I expect that might need some maintenance over time (no big deal though).

 

[f/Alex]

The negative carrier for the intrepid light basically rests on the back of the camera. So you'll need something that you can attach the bellows to that will also fill that function.

yea, the above linked reddit post talks about a 3d printed part, I have basic cad experience and should be able to modify the existing file to clip onto an omega system.

There's also a small amount of felt light seal material around the inside of the LED head. I've heard complaints that that can shed fibres. I've not had that problem, but in an academic setting where they'd get heavy use, I expect that might need some maintenance over time (no big deal though).

A little more worried about this, but it should be ok? I'm sure our omegas once had felt on them.

I guess the real question here is, are the timers too confusing for use by students who may be new to darkroom printing? That's my main concern at this point.

 

[tcolgate]

I guess the real question here is, are the timers too confusing for use by students who may be new to darkroom printing? That's my main concern at this point.

The timer is very simple. Perhaps not /quite/ as simple as a plain clock, but simple enough. If you are in the black and white mode you just use the +/- to adjust time and the grey dial to adjust contrast. There's a single button to turn the red safe light on, and the Run button to actually run stuff.
You can switch it to colour with the Mode button, then the other three dials do stuff.
If you want to teach use of under lens filters rather than the in built grades you can turn the grade knob all the way to the right to get white light (the display changes to tell you). Then it's just plain white and you can use the filters as per normal.
(if you want to go wild you could try my alternative firmware )

 

[f/Alex]

(if you want to go wild you could try my alternative firmware )

I did see your firmware, it reminds me of the operation of catlabs timers we have with the fstop printing (something I should use more, I already think in stops with burning and such). I will most definitely give it a try if we end up going with this plan, but I cannot sell my supervisor and department on something based entirely on "well someone made a good firmware patch for it". Stock has to work well enough first, since we're looking for a solution that is "easy enough" to implement and can be serviced by both my and my supervisors successors.

Then it's just plain white and you can use the filters as per normal.

we have sheet filters that we stick in the condenser housing. Those wouldn't work correct? I think filters on the timers shouldn't be an issue.

 

[tcolgate]

Stock has to work well enough first, since we're looking for a solution that is "easy enough" to implement and can be serviced by both my and my supervisors successors.

COWARDS! One day I'll hoodwink someone into try in, and then my ingenius computer virus will infect their fridge, near by power stations, global nuclear weapons control systems, and my plan will be complete!

we have sheet filters that we stick in the condenser housing. Those wouldn't work correct? I think filters on the timers shouldn't be an issue.

Since you are effectively building your own negative carrier holder, I suppose you /could/ include some means of getting the filter between the negative holder and the light in a safe way. It feels a bit much though. Yeah, the native contrast grades work OK. I don't think they align /that/ well with the ilford grades, but I've not actually compared yet. It'd probably be something you'd want to mention if students were going to move printing of a given neg between Intrepid and non-intrepid enlargers.

 

[tcolgate]

If you're likely to want to buy more than one unit, it's probably worth reaching out to intrepid to see if they could offer a discount, especially since it's for an academic thing. You never know.

 

[f/Alex]

If you're likely to want to buy more than one unit, it's probably worth reaching out to intrepid to see if they could offer a discount, especially since it's for an academic thing. You never know.

I was thinking that, I may send them an email. Unfortunately, part of my worry would be about lead times, B&H has them listed, which doesn't look to be a special order, but instead in-stock, and we may be able to get a discount through them, but the way I see it, we'd likely buy one first to make sure everything works and we're satisfied with it. I'd love to be able to use one beforehand, and part of me has considered converting my personal beseler 45.

 

[tcolgate]

I would say that if you are doing colour, and would be doing so along side traditional colour enlargers, you might find the results disappointing. If you're focus is black & white and you don't need colour, or can do colour elsewhere (or just accept the compromises), then I reckon the intrepid should be a good solution.
You have the advantage in that you have the original stands and bellows.
Also, double check that you are looking at the 4x5 kit that includes the timer (they sell one that doesn't include it for folk that already have the medium format enlarger).
If you have access to 3d printing, you might also be able to skip buying the addtitional MF and 35mm negative carriers. I think there are 3d prints that are just as good, if not better.

 

[f/Alex]

I would say that if you are doing colour

Color has been gone for ages in universities over here, the only one I can think of who has a color darkroom is Bard, we don't even have C41 stuff. B&W only.

you might also be able to skip buying the addtitional MF and 35mm negative carriers

I would have to reach out to them for that correct? part of me is wondering if I could make my adapter so it could accommodate preexisting omega neg holders even.

 

[tcolgate]

I would have to reach out to them for that correct? part of me is wondering if I could make my adapter so it could accommodate preexisting omega neg holders even.

The kit (light + timer), only comes with the 4x5 holder. They sell a set of medium format holders separately, and an individual 35mm holder. The holders aren't particularly solid. They are two thick cut sheet of aluminiun held together with a few bits of a heavy duty fabric tape. They are OK for individual use, but I wouldnt expect them to survive long if they have a hard life. I've made myself a plate carrier out of a couple of bits of 2mm mat board. BitByBit Photography sells a neg carrier for the compact, and I've spoken to him before about 4x5, he doesn't have anything yet but has considered it. There are definitely 3d print designs for them out there too.
Using existing carriers sounds like a good approach to me, especially if you can keep the LED close enough to the neg so that you aren't getting too much fall off.
What formats are you using?