Orwo planning return to colour production

[Agulliver]

From what Ron Mowery commented about Metropolis, it seems like a regular C-41 film without the interlayer scavengers etc - which would make sense in terms of InovisCoat gradually building up to making a new colour neg film.

That would make a lot of sense. And it all suggests that InovisCoat will one day be capable of making a decent C41 film. I tend to agree with Henning that competing in terms of quality and price with Fujifilm and Kodak isn't likely, but another C41 option would be welcome nonetheless. And should either Fujifilm or Kodak disappear, another C41 film would be very important.

 

[Anaxagore]

Any other details or info you may have about Orwo colour film, print or transparency film, would be much appreciated.

Just a picture of an unopened box of the CNS 200 (hence Konica). I’m adding a BW film (Orwopan 25) to compare the writings on the boxes (change from Filmfabrik Wolfen to OrwoMedia, new German 5-digit zip code - meaning the Orwopan box was made before 7/1993 and the CNS afterwards; the Orwopan best before date was 11/97.)

 

[foc]

View attachment 267021 View attachment 267022 View attachment 267023 View attachment 267024
Just a picture of an unopened box of the CNS 200 (hence Konica). I’m adding a BW film (Orwopan 25) to compare the writings on the boxes (change from Filmfabrik Wolfen to OrwoMedia, new German 5-digit zip code - meaning the Orwopan box was made before 7/1993 and the CNS afterwards; the Orwopan best before date was 11/97.)

Thank you for sharing, it's much appreciated.

 

[cmacd123]

is not "Orwo Media"the film lab part of the old ORWO?

 

[AgX]

NO.

 

[Henning Serger]

is not "Orwo Media"the film lab part of the old ORWO?

The old ORWO company and factory does not exist anymore. After several attempts of downscaling, restructuring and changes in ownership the operations stopped more than 20 years ago.
And then quite a lot of profitable business units (or business units with at least a positive future forecast) were split up and continued independently, mostly with completely new names and ownership.
By this fortunately a significant part of film related products survived (until today, by the way), as for example film base production, raw chemical production, BW cine film and specialty film production, large volume lab and photofinishing.
The name ORWO survived as a brand name: FilmoTec has the right to use it for their films, and the big mass volume lab and photofinisher ORWONet for their business, too ( https://www.orwonet.de/de/ ).

Best regards,
Henning

 

[gorbas]

And then quite a lot of profitable business units (or business units with at least a positive future forecast) were split up and continued independently, mostly with completely new names and ownership.

Was the SPUR part of old ORWO? Thank you Henning in advance!

 

[Henning Serger]

Was the SPUR part of old ORWO? Thank you Henning in advance!

No, not all all. They are completely unrelated.
The founder of SPUR, which is located in the far western part of Germany near Aachen, has studied "Fotoingenieurwesen" (photo engineering) in Cologne. And during his studies he had put his focus on photo chemistry.
After his exam and some stops in photo companies he founded SPUR as an independent photo chemistry manufacturer. For more than 20 years now he is introducing new or improved photo chemistry products every year! He loves research, new experiments and new approaches and "out of the box thinking".

Best regards,
Henning

 

[Tom Kershaw]

After his exam and some stops in photo companies he founded SPUR as an independent photo chemistry manufacturer. For more than 20 years now he is introducing new or improved photo chemistry products every year! He loves research, new experiments and new approaches and "out of the box thinking".

Henning,

I'm not sure I've seen a good review of the SPUR developers in English, they seem like a rather "out there" product range compared to the usual options.

Tom

 

[cmacd123]

forgive me again to ask Henning, Calbe is the chemical plant that was associated with the old ORWO was it not.

I suspect that some of the ORWO brand film that folks are mentioning was made as private label for that ORWOnet firm.

 

[pentaxuser]

I'm not sure I've seen a good review of the SPUR developers in English, they seem like a rather "out there" product range compared to the usual options.Tom

Tom have a look at the Online Darkroom where in the articles section it has a number of reviews of the Spur products. The site is run by
someone called Bruce Robbins in Dundee and it is worth a visit

pentaxuser

 

[baachitraka]

https://onlinedarkroom.blogspot.com/2014/06/spur-hrx-omar-first-impressions.html?m=1

 

[AgX]

Was the SPUR part of old ORWO? Thank you Henning in advance!

Spur was and is by no means related to Orwo.
It is one of two firms once focusing on high-resolution photography that emerged out out of an photo-engineering consultancy project.

 

[AgX]

Calbe is the chemical plant that was associated with the old ORWO was it not.

Calbe emerged out of the major of the two GDR manufacturers of photochemicals.

 

[AgX]

I suspect that some of the ORWO brand film that folks are mentioning was made as private label for that ORWOnet firm.

No, Orwo Net was never involved in selling films.

 

[cmacd123]

I did look at the "History" page of ORWO Net, and they actually do a fair job at giving some of the corporation changes. over the years, and the close downs and restarts.
ORWO net is in the computerized photo printing business, and owns the German chain store FotoQuelle (which they bought out of insolvency.

the path seems to have been
AGFA Wolfen
WWII
name changed to ORWO (1964)
Stock company ORWO AG in 1990
liquidation in 1994- end of film production
1996, ORWO films were put back on the market. However, they were no longer produced locally, merely assembled. (so any made after that are Not really "ORWO" films)
1999 Lintec Computer AG takes over PixelNet AG and ORWO Media GmbH (I believe I have seen some film marked Orwo Media.)
2002, PixelNet AG, and its subsidiary ORWO Media bankrupt.
2003 East German investor group headed by Dr. Gerhard Köhler took over the photo laboratory as ORWO Net
2009 acquired FotoQuelle
2018 aquired Photo Dose.

Main business is "white label" photofinishing.
https://www.orwonet.de/en/unternehmen/history

 

[AgX]

You still got it wrong... you mixed up firms and left out firms... As I repeated stated the demise of Orwo was a most complex one, though most stages are only of academic interest.



Foto Quelle was already a dead business.
Once a major photo retailer it went under with the mail-order department-store of which it was one department.

Photo Dose was one of the few german family-owned photo brick&mortar stores that had its roots still in the 19th centure and in their heydays even formed a huge chain. However, they moved their emphasis to picture making, which failed. Their online-business was taken over by Orwo net.

Thus in both cases basically brands were taken over.

 

[gorbas]

Calbe is the chemical plant that was associated with the old ORWO was it not.

Right! Calbe! Thank you Charles!

 

[Tom Kershaw]

https://onlinedarkroom.blogspot.com/2014/06/spur-hrx-omar-first-impressions.html?m=1

https://www.freestylephoto.biz/pdf/product_pdfs/spur/SpurHRXDataSheet.pdf

From reading the above it seems as though HRX-3 is a concentrate that is diluted to a similar extent as Ultrafin.

 

[Henning Serger]

Hello Charles,

forgive me again to ask Henning, Calbe is the chemical plant that was associated with the old ORWO was it not.

well, associated in the way that its forerunner company and former ORWO were since 1970 under the same organisational 'roof', the "VEB Fotochemisches Kombinat Wolfen".
Calbe Chemie was one of the very first spin-offs of this Kombinat in February 1991. They started with mainly photo chemistry, but diversified also into other business fields in the last 20 years.
https://www.calbe-chemie.de/de/

I suspect that some of the ORWO brand film that folks are mentioning was made as private label for that ORWOnet firm.

No, ORWONet (the mass volume lab and photofinishing company) has never been into the film rebranding business.

Best regards,
Henning

 

[Henning Serger]

Henning,
I'm not sure I've seen a good review of the SPUR developers in English, they seem like a rather "out there" product range compared to the usual options.
Tom

Hello Tom,
SPUR has also some information in English on their homepage:
https://spur-photo.com/some-information-in-english/
Full information in German:
https://spur-photo.com/

You can order directly from the company. Or you can order via German distributors like Fotoimpex.

The founder and chief chemist Heribert Schain is a kind of "chemical wizard" . He is very innovative and is going also new ways. R&D and experimentation is a real passion for him.
Besides a full line of multi-purpose developers, SPUR has also a lot of special developers to maximise performance for certain special applications.

From reading the above it seems as though HRX-3 is a concentrate that is diluted to a similar extent as Ultrafin.

HRX-3 (which was replaced by new HRX some years ago) has nothing to do with Ultrafin. Completely different formulas.
Tetenal Ultrafin (liquid) is a standard / universal developer quite similar in results to D-76 / ID-11.
HRX (and all its forerunners) is an Isoascorbate based (with additional developing substances) developer optimized for finest grain and best sharpness, resulting in highest resolution. But with the compromise in speed.

Best regards,
Henning

 

[Tom Kershaw]

HRX-3 (which was replaced by new HRX some years ago) has nothing to do with Ultrafin. Completely different formulas.
Tetenal Ultrafin (liquid) is a standard / universal developer quite similar in results to D-76 / ID-11.
HRX (and all its forerunners) is an Isoascorbate based (with additional developing substances) developer optimized for finest grain and best sharpness, resulting in highest resolution. But with the compromise in speed.

Presumably new HRX is one of the few concentrate Isoascorbate developers on the market? I just started using DS-10 and DS-2(12) which also work well, but I understand that not everyone wants to mix their own developers from scratch. https://web.archive.org/web/2007072...ilvergrain_formulae#DS-12_Accutance_developer

 

[Henning Serger]

Hello Tom,

Presumably new HRX is one of the few concentrate Isoascorbate developers on the market?

SPUR HRX (and all of its forerunner variants) are based on Isoascorbate as main (but not the only) developing substance. As liquid developer the handling is extremely easy.
I am using the HRX-line for about 15 years now (in addition to several other developers). HRX is my standard test developer for all of my BW negative film detail rendition comparison tests (test of fineness of grain, sharpness and resolution).

Best regards,
Henning

 

[cmacd123]

You still got it wrong... you mixed up firms and left out firms..

easy their , I was sumarizing the history page from ORWOnet. there are quite a few other spin-off firms - like chemicals, like filomtec that are not mentioned by ORWOnet. WE can't just say that the entire AGFA-Wolfen enterprise was totally blown away. without understanding what parts of it ended up "inspiring" current companies. for someone not in germany the entire DDR was a strange far off exotic land, that somehow magically sent young photographers will a limited budget Prackticas and Exactas. and occasionaly ORWO film in a box with the name of the local variety store. (although I understand that in parts of western europe, they ORWO reversal films were actively marketed) the exports we saw from the DDR was often low priced as the goods were traded for hard currencies and the labeling often played down that they were from EAST germany. meanwile other eastern brands like Foma and Forte only ever showed here in North America after the iron curtain came down.

Photoquell is only of interest to me as they were one of the firms that sold their own branded SLR cameras which sometimes turn up on the online auction sites and folks have to guess "what camera is that REALLY"

 

[AgX]

Well, "inspiring" is not best term. For the most, people were just using their expertise and facility they acquired to go on with some production/service of late Orwo. It was the first major photochemical plant to go with others to follow and leaving a lot of bare grounds.

On the other hand, the demise of Orwo and Pentacon had been preceeded by the demise of the opto-mechanical part of west-german photoindustry. And there even were personal bands between both developments. As you indicated, most of this is not known outside Germany.

Anyway, both Pentacon and Orwo nearly literally from one day to the other were facing a situation were no longer was a marketplace for them. Much of this is to blame on the GDR people of post-november themselves, though whether there was a political feasible alternative is questionable in hindsight.