ORWO NC500 - FIRST RESULTS & QUICK REVIEW

[relistan]

These orange masks are quite dense, I have seen D=1.0 in some C-41 film data sheets. It would not surprise me at all, that advanced scanners are optimized for this, i.e. more light sensitive in the blue channel, but at the same time less able to handle strong blue light.

The Vision3 films I've developed (in C-41, which may be the reason) have even denser masks.

 

[brbo]

The film does indeed lack an orange mask. But it has a dye filter layer.

Orwo NC500 "datasheet":

Maybe film lacks the orange mask, but the spec sheet does have it

 

[ludwighagelstein]

Orwo NC500 "datasheet":

View attachment 329610
Maybe film lacks the orange mask, but the spec sheet does have it

color separation, yes - a coupler mask, not necessarily.

 

[brbo]

color separation, yes - a coupler mask, not necessarily.

Can you give us an example? Which film had a distinct orange tint when developed but didn't have integrated coupler masking?

Secondly, your developed NC500 had RGB densities in line with the published datasheet?!

 

[dutchsteammachine]

These are scans of 16mm motion picture film in E-6. There is a slight orange cast but it can be easily corrected for in post, or perhaps with some 81 filter.



CR seems to think the emulsion is or is based on an Agfachrome stock.

Negative process for reference:

 

[halfaman]

These are scans of 16mm motion picture film in E-6. There is a slight orange cast but it can be easily corrected for in post, or perhaps with some 81 filter.



CR seems to think the emulsion is or is based on an Agfachrome stock.

Negative process for reference:

Really not looking good. If I need to give an assestment based on these videos, I would say Orwo is light years behind of what Kodak Vision 3 delivers or any color emulsion of the last 30 years. Grain is crazy big and instrusive for 16mm, even Kodak film in 8mm has a finer grain than this. In addition to weird colors and saturation makes this film just a curiosity for amateur cinema.

 

[koraks]

I would say Orwo is light years behind of what Kodak Vision 3 delivers or any color emulsion of the last 30 years.

Alright, but an assessment would have to depend on what criteria you apply. If you apply the criterion of technical excellence, you're certainly right. If another criterion, e.g. 'creative expression' or 'eccentricity' is applied, one might judge otherwise. It becomes a matter of taste.
That this product is technically light years behind those of the only technically excellent color cine stock producer - it doesn't surprise me, and I don't think it's a distance that will ever be covered. There's a massive R&D barrier to catch up with Kodak in this sense, and there's no economic rationale for anyone to bridge that gap. So at best, there will be Kodak and there may be some Lomo-like runners-up.

 

[Agulliver]

That 16mm sample is interesting. OK the contrast actually looks OK and the colours do too....and can certainly be tweaked in post if a digital file is what is desired (rather than projection). But the grain is pretty horrible.

If I were ORWO, I'd be working on reducing the grain. Because there *is* a market for more colour cine film, especially in 16mm and 8mm.

 

[halfaman]

So at best, there will be Kodak and there may be some Lomo-like runners-up.

That seems to be the sad reality in color. Kodak for film, Fuji for paper and pray...

 

[koraks]

That seems to be the sad reality in color. Kodak for film, Fuji for paper

This might just sum it up quite aptly.
I don't know about E6.

 

[dutchsteammachine]

If it works nicely as 400 E6 i think people will accept the grain, there is nothing else like that on the market and Ektachrome 100 does not like to be pushed.

But there are some issues with the stock.

1. Uneven/messy perforations.
2. Uneven/flashy density through feet of the roll.
3. Dirt on the film.

 

[adamlugi]

Hi,
I am one of the many people to whom purchased and paid videos have not arrived since July. From Orwo's side zero response.
It might be worth doing something about it.

 

[Hassasin]

Some interesting comments "horrible image structure" "waste of money" ? I wonder if same people were saying same thing about the Lomo crap color films out there.

I find color in these images having a promise and I don't believe this was ever going to be an attempt to emulate anything of known and universally praised pedigree. And I have more hopes in this becoming a success story, a lot more than I ever had in Lomo and similar "cool" stuff.

 

[tahomaphoto]

Here are a few takeaways from my test with the material. This will concern the NC 500 emulsion. The NC 400 emulsion will be discussed in another post at a later date.
The tests were conducted with material cut down from long rolls with BH 1866 perforation, not with 135-36 finished material.

I've been fortunate enough to have been able to (technically) test a few stages of the emulsion over the last months and must say, that they have come a long way. Making a color film from scratch is not an easy task - some would have called it impossible. Yet, Orwo and the engineers and emulsioneers at Innoviscoat managed to come up with a new color emulsion - in record time. I suggest to take a moment to appreciate this.

Many here and elsewhere have been very sceptical and sometimes even demeaning. If you have a problem with the brand, or those associated with it, please refrain from commenting - marketing and distribution of the product is not subject of my short review here. I want to talk about the emulsion.

Film Speed:

Even though the Film is called NC 500, the sensitometrically determined film speed of the emulsion, processed in a monitored ECN-2 process is close to 320. Under practical conditions, I suggest the film be exposed at E.I. 250.

Granularity:

Compared to 5219 and 5207, Orwo NC500 is noticeably grainier. This, however, isn't necessarily a bug, but more a feature. The film is not a Vision3 emulsion, and does not even come close. But it does not have to, in my opinion. Compared to any available modern emulsion, the NC 500 has a distinct grain structure / dye distribution pattern that resembles early chromogenic emulsions. Some will like the look, others will not. That's a matter of personal taste.

Sharpness:

Sharpness and especially acutance could be improved upon, but again, in this regard as well the film is distinctly not a Vision3 film.

Antihalation:

Since the film has no remjet backing, one might assume halations could be an issue. However, I am pleased to say that the integral anti halation layer present in the emulsion works very well in surpressing both reflection and diffusion halations.

Color Reproduction:

Color Saturation is overall on the lower end of the spectrum. Especially the yellow dye forming layer fails to form sufficient dye density, which results in muted blues, especially apparent in a blue sky. Overall color reproduction is acceptable.


Conclusion

Someone who only shoots on 5203 / 50D will probably not enjoy NC 500. If you like to try a new look that is distinctly not as clean as Vision3, or any other Kodak / Fuji Stock for that matter, but more in line of color negative films found in the late 1960s and early 1970s, this might be a good way to explore that route.



Here are a few example shots taken last weekend in the mountains:

Ohh, very nice! Is this what FFP recently advertised as a coming atttaction?

 

[brbo]

Some interesting comments "horrible image structure" "waste of money" ? I wonder if same people were saying same thing about the Lomo crap color films out there.

?! Lomo has exactly two "crap" colour films (Lomochrome Turquoise and Purple) and one in the "Orwo" category (LomoChrome Metropolis) out there. Ironically, all of the crap colour films are coated in the same factory as Orwo's new colour films.

The rest are light years ahead of current Orwo colour films (even Redscale which is just normal film put into the cassette the wrong way so that it gets exposed through the base).

 

[Hassasin]

?! Lomo has exactly two "crap" colour films (Lomochrome Turquoise and Purple) and one in the "Orwo" category (LomoChrome Metropolis) out there. Ironically, all of the crap colour films are coated in the same factory as Orwo's new colour films.

The rest are light years ahead of current Orwo colour films (even Redscale which is just normal film put into the cassette the wrong way so that it gets exposed through the base).

Well, ironically, Lomo bullshit will live forever, ORWO may not. But ORWO is surely trying to get something new on the market. I only brought up Lomo, because of some comments made on this ORWO intro. I think they deserve a bit of benefit of a doubt at this stage. And, I do not equal what I've seen here to anything sold under Lomo brand.

Lomo has always been in the spin business: make anything (read: however it comes out), then spin as unique and sell it to the masses as boutique product (and get some celebrities on board to reason the need for following). Not far from this tree falls "New Polaroid", or the Impossible Project, which remains ... impossible, as it turns out. Surely, not everyone would agree.

 

[koraks]

@Hassasin please, no foul language. It's unnecessary and in fact undesirable on this forum. Thanks.

 

[Hassasin]

@Hassasin please, no foul language. It's unnecessary and in fact undesirable on this forum. Thanks.

you mean f.. words are fine? have seen quite a few over last few days. I assume you mean my b.. word is offensive?

 

[koraks]

Yes, the b.. and the c.. words. F..words are also undesirable.

 

[brbo]

Lomo has always been in the spin business: make anything (read: however it comes out), then spin as unique and sell it to the masses as boutique product (and get some celebrities on board to reason the need for following). Not far from this tree falls "New Polaroid", or the Impossible Project, which remains ... impossible, as it turns out. Surely, not everyone would agree.

But, that's exactly what Orwo is doing with NC500. It brings absolutely nothing that could come remotely close to current cine films. Even the price is much higher. So, as we already said, Orwo NC500's only thing is that it's... unique. Technically inferior, more expensive, creative marketing - that's Lomography for you.

Don't get me wrong. I wish them all the success. I even bought NC500 on the very first day of pre-orders.

 

[Hassasin]

Yes, the b.. and the c.. words. F..words are also undesirable.

Should not be a problem to have banned words automatically eradicated.

I suppose BS is also not allowed? it's really laughable, but that's OK.

I never considered B word on same level as F word anyways, but people get offended by invisible matters these anyways, so be it.

 

[Hassasin]

But, that's exactly what Orwo is doing with NC500. It brings absolutely nothing that could come remotely close to current cine films. Even the price is much higher. So, as we already said, Orwo NC500's only thing is that it's... unique. Technically inferior, more expensive, creative marketing - that's Lomography for you.

Don't get me wrong. I wish them all the success. I even bought NC500 on the very first day of pre-orders.

To be frank I am not following colour film much and made the Lomo reference only for reasons stated. Maybe what they have on NC500 is indeed just repackaged one of the Lomo offerings for all I know. In that case shame on their marketing language.

 

[Huss]

I like the Lomo ‘crap’ films. They do exactly what they say they do.

Do you buy chocolate ice cream and then complain that it is crap because it doesn’t taste like vanilla ice cream?

 

[MattKing]

Should not be a problem to have banned words automatically eradicated.

I suppose BS is also not allowed? it's really laughable, but that's OK.

I never considered B word on same level as F word anyways, but people get offended by invisible matters these anyways, so be it.

We are an international community, with a wide variety of backgrounds and abilities with English. As ignorant and crude language and vulgarity is not appreciated by many, and as any valid point can be made without employing that type of language, we do not permit it here - please refrain.
And if members see such language, please report it.