Modified 6x6 TLR to 6x3

[Cholentpot]

Converting a 6x9 folder is a good idea, since it only needs to mask a small portion of top and bottom (3.75x9) to make 2.39:1 anamorphic ratio. And it is compact enough to bring along trip. There are high quality lens choices out there, together with red window. But the focal length will be limited to 90-105mm.

Mamiya C3 is good since you can get 55mm and 65mm lens to get wider angle view. And I see you already made it working for you.

Another high quality TLR with red window is Ikoflex with Tessar. They are quite inexpensive nowadays, and quite compact.

I tried 35mm panorama in Pentax 6x7 with 45mm lens, and it is seriously high quality. I can imagine it matches XPan. And you get all kind of lens options, and WSIWYG. But it is big, heavy and bulky.

My current "cheaper" and "light" panoramic camera for travel is Belair 6x12 with Belairgon 114/8 glass lens. Unfortunately the lens is not easy to source nowadays. And I plan to hack a Holga 120 Pan camera to use a tiny 90mm large format lens.

Which Ikoflex to look for?

And won't a 6x9 folder have the film traveling horizontally instead of vertical? Might as well just run 35mm through it. Part of the goal is getting more shots out of a roll. Than again...maybe I should mask the 6x9 roll holder that I use on my 2x3...

 

[MattKing]

Is there a 6x4.5 camera that would get you 2/3 of the way there?

 

[Dan Daniel]

Well, you could use a 2x3 press camera with a 6x7 roll film back. Use the cut-out dark slide area to get two shots on one frame. So now you have 20 shots per roll and a large panorama.

With a press camera, you can use a 47mm Angulon which gets you close to the X-pan.

 

[Cholentpot]

Well, you could use a 2x3 press camera with a 6x7 roll film back. Use the cut-out dark slide area to get two shots on one frame. So now you have 20 shots per roll and a large panorama.

With a press camera, you can use a 47mm Angulon which gets you close to the X-pan.

View attachment 340345

Those dark slides though, kind of hard to find or they're readily available?

 

[markjwyatt]

Interesting idea, but I would have thought you would want to get 2x the shots out of a roll of 120. Since you are not, why not just crop your viewfinder (maybe just lines instead of full blocking), shoot the full 6x6, then crop after scanning or when enlarging?

 

[Dan Daniel]

Those dark slides though, kind of hard to find or they're readily available?

4x5 slides are easy to find. Cut them down to fit 120 roll film holders.

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BUt actually, the 47mm has some basic wide angle distortion in the corners an across the frame, so cutting the lower half or upper half will give differing perspectives. Probably hard to get a handle on shifting perspectives.

 

[Cholentpot]

Interesting idea, but I would have thought you would want to get 2x the shots out of a roll of 120. Since you are not, why not just crop your viewfinder (maybe just lines instead of full blocking), shoot the full 6x6, then crop after scanning or when enlarging?

I am getting 24 shots out of a roll.

Cropping a 6x6 is more logical but it's not nearly as much fun.

 

[xya]

There is an Agfa Isolette L which has a genuine 3x6 mask and even a mask for the finder https://www.120folder.com/agfa_isolette_l.htm. That's not a TLR camera, but it works well. With Ilford backing paper there are 3 circles preceeding the number. The first, tiniest is exactly at 3 cm. Maybe this helps...

 

[Cholentpot]

There is an Agfa Isolette L which has a genuine 3x6 mask and even a mask for the finder https://www.120folder.com/agfa_isolette_l.htm. That's not a TLR camera, but it works well. With Ilford backing paper there are 3 circles preceeding the number. The first, tiniest is exactly at 3 cm. Maybe this helps...

I measured and in fact I've been using the smallest first dot as my halfway point. Interesting camera.

 

[Donald Qualls]

a 2x3 press camera with a 6x7 roll film back. Use the cut-out dark slide area to get two shots on one frame.

Or same thing with a 6x9 back and get 16 half frames on a roll, at nominally 3x9. Would a 47 Angulon cover the corners of 6x9?

 

[markjwyatt]

I am getting 24 shots out of a roll.

Cropping a 6x6 is more logical but it's not nearly as much fun.

Very cool then. The picture of the negatives looked like there was pretty big spacing between shots...

 

[grahamp]

For the Mamiya C, you should be able to put the finder mask into the recess in the base of the waist level finder - it is intended for masks and exposure adjustment plates.

 

[Cholentpot]

Very cool then. The picture of the negatives looked like there was pretty big spacing between shots...

Yes. I adjusted the baffles for my latest roll. I should give me a slightly bigger exposure.

For the Mamiya C, you should be able to put the finder mask into the recess in the base of the waist level finder - it is intended for masks and exposure adjustment plates.

I took off the entire hood and put the paper under it. Can you clarify how I would go about doing it your way?

 

[xya]

Or same thing with a 6x9 back and get 16 half frames on a roll, at nominally 3x9. Would a 47 Angulon cover the corners of 6x9?

Is there a 47mm Angulon? A 47mm Super Angulon would even cover 6x12, including the corners.

 

[reddesert]

Couple of remarks: The cut down dark slide idea is something that people use to shoot two 4x10" panoramics on one sheet of 8x10" film. I think usually they cut half of the DS entirely off rather than making a window. You need an unmodified dark slide as well to remove the holder from the camera, of course. I have not done this myself.

Trying to modify or replace the darkslide of a Mamiya RB67 or Press film holder, you will find that the RB67 and Press darkslides are made of very thin sheet steel. A 4x5 darkslide is thicker and won't fit. I believe the 4x5 darkslide is also thicker than the Graflex RH slide (I have tried). Best bet would be to get a thin sheet of stainless steel and make a new darkslide. The challenge is keeping it flat while/after cutting, and finishing the edges so it doesn't tear up the light trap. You can cut the outer shape with a guillotine style sheet metal cutter, but cutting the internal edges of the "window" neatly will be hard, unless you have access to a milling machine or a Dremel and a steady mount.

Trivia: Even with the Mamiya C330 cameras with auto shutter cocking, you can also cock the lens manually (just a bit awkward), so it could work.

 

[Cholentpot]

Couple of remarks: The cut down dark slide idea is something that people use to shoot two 4x10" panoramics on one sheet of 8x10" film. I think usually they cut half of the DS entirely off rather than making a window. You need an unmodified dark slide as well to remove the holder from the camera, of course. I have not done this myself.

Trying to modify or replace the darkslide of a Mamiya RB67 or Press film holder, you will find that the RB67 and Press darkslides are made of very thin sheet steel. A 4x5 darkslide is thicker and won't fit. I believe the 4x5 darkslide is also thicker than the Graflex RH slide (I have tried). Best bet would be to get a thin sheet of stainless steel and make a new darkslide. The challenge is keeping it flat while/after cutting, and finishing the edges so it doesn't tear up the light trap. You can cut the outer shape with a guillotine style sheet metal cutter, but cutting the internal edges of the "window" neatly will be hard, unless you have access to a milling machine or a Dremel and a steady mount.

Trivia: Even with the Mamiya C330 cameras with auto shutter cocking, you can also cock the lens manually (just a bit awkward), so it could work.

Confirming that you can do with with the C33. My C3 is a bit of a beater so I figured I'd mess around with the one that has already been messed with.

 

[MattKing]

I'm wondering if one can accomplish this with a Mamiya C330 by combining the multi-exposure switch and advancing the crank 1/2 turn for each frame?
One would need to manually cock the shutter every second frame (at least) and it may mean that only 23 frames would be available.
The C330 (and C220) have the advantage of always requiring the same turn of the crank for each frame advance. Other Mamiya C series cameras may be the same - I don't know.

 

[henryvk]

There is an Agfa Isolette L which has a genuine 3x6 mask and even a mask for the finder https://www.120folder.com/agfa_isolette_l.htm. That's not a TLR camera, but it works well. With Ilford backing paper there are 3 circles preceeding the number. The first, tiniest is exactly at 3 cm. Maybe this helps...

How cool, I never heard of this model. I assume the small lever on the left side of the top plate toggles the viewfinder mask.

Very interesting!

 

[ic-racer]

I always found it easier to mask the negative in the enlarger, after exposure. The masks on my 6x7cm carrier will almost meet in the middle. That allows the option of any aspect ratio.

 

[xya]

How cool, I never heard of this model. I assume the small lever on the left side of the top plate toggles the viewfinder mask.

Very interesting!

Yes, it does.

 

[Donald Qualls]

I always found it easier to mask the negative in the enlarger, after exposure.

That, however, doesn't let you get 24 frames on a roll of 120.

 

[xya]

Some suggestions for TLR cameras with a red window: a folding TLR, the Welta Perfecta https://www.120folder.com/welta_perfekta.htm they sometimes show up for ~$300, good lenses and shutters, the Voigtländer Focussing Brillant S, good lenses and shutters, ~$200, not to be confused with the ordinary Brillant, Voigtländer Superb, ~§300 if not with the Heliar lens which is very expensive, good lenses and shutters, or a Lubitel 166 non-Olympic, good lens, but no slow shutter speeds. All visible here https://www.oddcameras.com/tlr.htm

 

[Cholentpot]

Some suggestions for TLR cameras with a red window: a folding TLR, the Welta Perfecta https://www.120folder.com/welta_perfekta.htm they sometimes show up for ~$300, good lenses and shutters, the Voigtländer Focussing Brillant S, good lenses and shutters, ~$200, not to be confused with the ordinary Brillant, Voigtländer Superb, ~§300 if not with the Heliar lens which is very expensive, good lenses and shutters, or a Lubitel 166 non-Olympic, good lens, but no slow shutter speeds. All visible here https://www.oddcameras.com/tlr.htm

Problem with the folders is the film moves horizontally. Which is fine if you turn the camera into portrait mode. You might as well roll 35mm through them for more or less the same effect as messing around with a TLR.

 

[xya]

Problem with the folders is the film moves horizontally. Which is fine if you turn the camera into portrait mode. You might as well roll 35mm through them for more or less the same effect as messing around with a TLR.

The Welta is built like an ordinary TLR. Film moves vertically. It's a beauty.

 

[Cholentpot]

The Welta is built like an ordinary TLR. Film moves vertically. It's a beauty.

That is an interesting design.