Large developing tank for 120 film?

[xX_M@m!yaL0v3r_UXx]

Hi everyone!

I have a lot of film to develop (~100 rolls). I've been looking into getting deep tanks, but I can't find much information on them as it relates to processing medium format film. I saw one on Ebay recently that could process 24 rolls at once (great!). The only thing is that, ideally, I'd like to have 2 deep tanks for developer, 2 for stop, 2 for fix, ect, so I could process 48 rolls at once. I only have paterson tanks right now (AHH!), and it takes a ridiculous amount of time. The majority of deep tanks that I see are for 4x5/8x10 processing. Does anyone have experience with processing 120/35mm in deep tanks, or any solutions for processing lots of film at once? Thank you thank you!

 

[koraks]

Welcome to Photrio!

That's a lot of leftover film you've got there!

No experience here with such volumes, but bigger labs do this in dip & dunk lines with tanks that are high enough to accommodate an entire roll of film (6ft+ height) or continuous transport machines where all rolls are spliced together end to end into a very long roll that is then fed through the machine. Smaller labs typically run the film through a minilab. None of this is relevant for a home lab, obviously.

The most accessible compromise in my mind would be the Paterson tank that will hold 4x120 or 8x135. It'll take you some time to get through it all, but the alternative would be something kludged together with buckets where you dunk several rolls in and just swash them around with your hands by means of agitation, I guess. Some people who shoot 100ft of 16mm or so do it that way, I understand. But I'd be hesitant to actually recommend something like that for still photography.

Is this color or B&W, btw? Just curious.

 

[Kino]

If you snagged this pair of Arkay Nitrogen Burst racks with reels, you might be able to whip-up a homebrew system to process 36 reels at a time.

Vintage Arkay Corporation Rack And Film Developing Reels | eBay

<p dir="ltr" style="margin-top:0; margin-bottom:0;">This is for 1 Vintage Arkay Corporation Rack And Film Developing Reels. Selling as is. </p>

www.ebay.com

It would take a bit of work to make the tanks and you'd have to process in total darkness, but...

EDIT: Scroll down on this page to see how the original nitrogen burst sinks looked. This is for a long gone auction:

Vintage Darkroom Equipment Up For Auction

Updated with more descriptions of equipment! These are some of the pieces of equipment that were for sale. To recap, I went to...

magnumarts.blogspot.com

 

[GregY]

Welcome to Photrio!

That's a lot of leftover film you've got there!

No experience here with such volumes, but bigger labs do this in dip & dunk lines with tanks that are high enough to accommodate an entire roll of film (6ft+ height) or continuous transport machines where all rolls are spliced together end to end into a very long roll that is then fed through the machine. Smaller labs typically run the film through a minilab. None of this is relevant for a home lab, obviously.

The most accessible compromise in my mind would be the Paterson tank that will hold 4x120 or 8x135. It'll take you some time to get through it all, but the alternative would be something kludged together with buckets where you dunk several rolls in and just swash them around with your hands by means of agitation, I guess. Some people who shoot 100ft of 16mm or so do it that way, I understand. But I'd be hesitant to actually recommend something like that for still photography.

Is this color or B&W, btw? Just curious.

I've got a couple of these large Nikor tanks. I haven't used them in a while but i'm pretty sure i recall they'll hold 6 x120 reels. https://www.ebay.ca/itm/304195805360
pretty reasonable cost @ $39 USD. I always rolled mine on an old towel instead of trying to invert it. I got very even development.

 

[gordrob]

I think your best would be a rack like the Arkay mentioned above that would let you process 18 reels of 120 film at a time in 8x10 tanks that hold 3 1/2 gallons of chemicals. You can use a replenishment type developer that would keep the cost down. There are also Arkay racks that let you process fewer reels in a 2 gallon tank

 

[pentaxuser]

OP it might help us recommend the most appropriate method if we know what budgetary constraints you have to secure the equipment needed.

pentaxuser

 

[GregY]

I think your best would be a rack like the Arkay mentioned above that would let you process 18 reels of 120 film at a time in 8x10 tanks that hold 3 1/2 gallons of chemicals. You can use a replenishment type developer that would keep the cost down. There are also Arkay racks that let you process fewer reels in a 2 gallon tank

True....but 18 or more 120 (good quality) reels will set you back a bit $

 

[xX_M@m!yaL0v3r_UXx]

Thanks for the replies everybody!

I’m developing black and white. Specifically, Kentmere 400 pulled to 200 in replenished Microdol-X, full strength (LegacyPro Mic-X). @gordrob , that’s what I was thinking, it’s just a matter of getting the appropriate tanks that will correspond to the racks and reels. Are you talking about the stainless steel tanks? I’m also thinking of the plastic 3.5 gal ones, which are much cheaper, but probably wouldn’t be compatible with the stainless steel racks and reels available..

Also, it would be nice to have a lid on it so I could transport the filled reels from my closet to my sink..

As for cost, I don’t want to spend a ton, hopefully i can find an equivalent solution as was linked above without breaking the bank!

 

[gordrob]

I was thinking of the Cescolite 8x10 Film Developing Tanks. They are a standard size so I would think the Arkay type racks would fit them. They have a floating lid as well as an overhanging cover that would allow you to move it daylight. It is unfortunate that you are so far away as I have a number of these tanks that I have for sale. Your next best bet would be the older Kodak 8x10 Tanks but they are heavy and have a floating lid but I have never seen one with a light tight lid.

​

 

[_T_]

I must strongly advise against developing 48 rolls of film for your first go round with a new system. Processing 48 rolls at once is definitely something you want to work up to.

 

[GregY]

I must strongly advise against developing 48 rolls of film for your first go round with a new system. Processing 48 rolls at once is definitely something you want to work up to.

Absolutely agree. If you value your images..... When i did lots of LF i got into the habit of processing sheet film one at a time. Now when i travel i process 120 film one roll at a time... haven't used my large developing tanks in a long time. When/if you gamble...have luck on your side....

 

[bdial]

Since you are also trying to stay within a limited budget, a full nitrogen burst system is probably out of the question. Manual agitation with those racks is done by lifting the rack out of the tank, draining it for a few seconds then putting it in, so a daylight tank isn’t very useful. The 8x10 tanks that hold those racks hold a couple of gallons of solution, it’s not a fill and dump procedure, you need 3 tanks plus whatever you would use for washing. I’ve never encountered a rig like that for plastic reels, the racks pictured are for stainless reels only.
Even though you won’t be able to do as much in a batch, the nikor deep tanks are probably a better solution. You would still want three, so as to move the film from one to the next instead of filling and dumping, they take too long to fill using a light trap lid. You can get deep Patterson tanks for plastic reels, I’m not sure how many rolls they can hold.

Back in the day, when I worked in a pro lab, I processed film in those Arkay racks daily, you get used to standing in the dark.

 

[MattKing]

I regularly develop four 120 rolls of B&W film in a 1 litre, two 120 roll Paterson tank.
Rotary agitation during the development stage is tricky though - the films tend to move around within the reel. They stay put though for all the rest of the steps when on the rotary agitator.
If you are ambidextrous, you can do 8 rolls at a time

 

[Dustin McAmera]

Is this somebody else's backlog of film you are bidding to clear? I hope you don't have to print or scan it too!

Unless you already have reels, the cost of those is a strong argument for buying a piece of second-hand kit that comes with reels, like the rack Kino pointed out in post #3.

If I were trying to clear my own backlog, I'd get a couple of those eight-reel tanks, and some beer, and some pizzas, and hire a friend to help, over a few evenings.

 

[Huub]

You can easely get two 120 rolls onto one Paterson spool. Using a tank that takes 3 or 4 spools would make it possible to do 6 or 8 films in one run. It will take a bit more time to do the 100 films, but the risk of screwing up is way less, compared to using a sysem that you ain't familiar with.

 

[Nitroplait]

but the risk of screwing up is way less, compared to using a sysem that you ain't familiar with.

+1
Processing 48 films of any importance (or even half) in one go and in a process new-to-me would scare the s**t out of me.

The 8 roll Paterson approach would be fairly economical and 100 rolls could easily be completed in a day if one had two sets of reels and a way to dry them between batches. (A helper with a hair dryer?).

It would also require being comfortable winding two 120 rolls onto one Paterson reel - which would be a no-go in my book, but others seems to be okay with that.

Investing in a solution for very large batches would only make sense if processing such volumes is expected to be a regular occurrence, IMO.

 

[Lachlan Young]

Hi everyone!

I have a lot of film to develop (~100 rolls). I've been looking into getting deep tanks, but I can't find much information on them as it relates to processing medium format film. I saw one on Ebay recently that could process 24 rolls at once (great!). The only thing is that, ideally, I'd like to have 2 deep tanks for developer, 2 for stop, 2 for fix, ect, so I could process 48 rolls at once. I only have paterson tanks right now (AHH!), and it takes a ridiculous amount of time. The majority of deep tanks that I see are for 4x5/8x10 processing. Does anyone have experience with processing 120/35mm in deep tanks, or any solutions for processing lots of film at once? Thank you thank you!

You just need the right deep tank cages for the reels (yes, there were/ are cages for Paterson reels as well as stainless reels). For the amount of film you are wanting to run, it'd take about an hour or so of reasonably focused effort (depending on how many reels/ cages you have, drier capacity etc, etc) if you were running full loads - this was all very standard stuff not that long ago for many moderate scale/ custom labs. Page 3 of the Ilford Powder Developers datasheet has a description/ illustration of the basic techniques you need to know.

Rather than trying to overthink how many deep tank lines you can run, keep it simple and be consistent & you'll be fine. On the other hand, once you've costed it up, you might find that taking everything to a dip/dunk lab will be cheaper and just as fast. Good lab process controls (which are really very simple) are worth far more than paranoid protectiveness about excessive control over processing your own film.

 

[GregY]

You just need the right deep tank cages for the reels (yes, there were/ are cages for Paterson reels as well as stainless reels). For the amount of film you are wanting to run, it'd take about an hour or so of reasonably focused effort (depending on how many reels/ cages you have, drier capacity etc, etc) if you were running full loads - this was all very standard stuff not that long ago for many moderate scale/ custom labs. Page 3 of the Ilford Powder Developers datasheet has a description/ illustration of the basic techniques you need to know.

Rather than trying to overthink how many deep tank lines you can run, keep it simple and be consistent & you'll be fine. On the other hand, once you've costed it up, you might find that taking everything to a dip/dunk lab will be cheaper and just as fast. Good lab process controls (which are really very simple) are worth far more than paranoid protectiveness about excessive control over processing your own film.

In Canada, it will cost you roughly $1500 to process 100 rolls of 120.... doing it yourself will cost a fraction of that. It will just take time. I don't have room to hang more than 10 rolls of film, or for that matter the weighed clips. I'd easily schedule a week to ten days if it were my own film.....

 

[Lachlan Young]

In Canada, it will cost you roughly $1500 to process 100 rolls of 120.... doing it yourself will cost a fraction of that. It will just take time. I don't have room to hang more than 10 rolls of film, or for that matter the weighed clips. I'd easily schedule a week to ten days if it were my own film.....

Quick back of envelope calculations say that buying from reputable secondhand dealers, rather than hoping for a job-lot from the back of someone's garage, will run you 6-800 eurodollarpounds for 4x 3.5 U.S. gallon tanks (you want one for wash), 2 cages, 48 decent quality reels (e.g. Hewes), and that's excluding a drying cabinet (which will make your life much easier when dealing with that many rolls). Throw in the amount of chemistry you'll need & it rapidly becomes a much finer balance. And most labs will give a discount if you hand over that amount of film, as that's what most dip-dunk machines were really intended for quantity-wise.

On the other hand, with a few 5-reel Paterson tanks (they'll do 6-up for 120) & a pile of reels, you can easily run 2 simultaneously - so that's 12 rolls every 15-20 mins (+ wash time). Limitation here is that you need to get the reels bone dry before reloading.

 

[GregY]

Quick back of envelope calculations say that buying from reputable secondhand dealers, rather than hoping for a job-lot from the back of someone's garage, will run you 6-800 eurodollarpounds for 4x 3.5 U.S. gallon tanks (you want one for wash), 2 cages, 48 decent quality reels (e.g. Hewes), and that's excluding a drying cabinet (which will make your life much easier when dealing with that many rolls). Throw in the amount of chemistry you'll need & it rapidly becomes a much finer balance. And most labs will give a discount if you hand over that amount of film, as that's what most dip-dunk machines were really intended for quantity-wise.

On the other hand, with a few 5-reel Paterson tanks (they'll do 6-up for 120) & a pile of reels, you can easily run 2 simultaneously - so that's 12 rolls every 15-20 mins (+ wash time). Limitation here is that you need to get the reels bone dry before reloading.

I think i'd slit my wrists before waiting for Paterson pastic reels to dry..... stainless man stainless. I enjoy processing my own film, but i don't let 100 rolls pile up. We've never had an answer from the OP as to if he's doing someone a favour or going commercial. I wouldn't buy deep tanks for one occasion..... & i don't love processing enough to do it for others. Besides, I think you'd go broke waiting for the next 100 rolls here in Western Canada. I've got one of these standing in a corner gathering dust....

Vintage Rare - Nikor 22" Stainless Steel Developing Tank w/ 35mm 120 Reels Rod | eBay

Includes: Nikor 22" Stainless Steel Developing Tank, 4 120 Film Reels, 2 35mm Reels, & Rod. See pics for details.

www.ebay.com

 

[Paul Howell]

I made deep tanks, used oversized PCP pipe with a cap on one end with a plastic square glued on to provide stability. Mine were tall enough to take 10 120 patterson or unicolor reels. I did have T rods made from S.S to lower, lift and agitate. I made 6, developer, stop, fix, clearing agent and wash. for the wash tank I drilled a hole near the bottom and small holes up and down the thank, last Photoflo then unwound and dry. At the time I had a long sink, my darkroom was light tight. I made mine in 1988, not sure what todays cost would be. I used Clayton F76+ that I discarded, I had lids also made from PCP caps for the other chemistry. Downside is the sheer amount of chemistry, about a gallon as I recall, storage, my sink was an S.S that I bought at an industrial salvage company, It was deep enough that I would keep the tanks in the back of the sink when printing. And I had to use a step stool to stand over the tanks while pulling the reels up and down during agitation. For replenished developer you would need to cut down an end cap with a handle of some sort for a floating lid. I only used these deep tanks for 3 or 4 years before we moved to a town house with a very small double sink bath for a dark room.

 

[Sirius Glass]

I have developed eight 120 rolls at one time in a Jobo processor, but 48 at a time is way beyond my equipment's capability. Small batches mean that any damage from a mistake is minimized.

 

[E76]

Hewes Products is another source for deep tanks and reel cages. Up to 15 liters is standard. They can ship direct if you don’t have a distributor near you that carries them.

 

[GregY]

Hewes Products is another source for deep tanks and reel cages. Up to 15 liters is standard. They can ship direct if you don’t have a distributor near you that carries them.

I'm sure custom deep tanks from Hewes will cost the "King's ransom".......

 

[xX_M@m!yaL0v3r_UXx]

Thanks for the replies everyone! The rolls are mine: I'm currently working on projects, and accumulated 100 rolls pretty fast. Currently I'm using 3 of the 3 reel paterson tanks, and 2 of the 2 reel ones, so 13 total rolls. It's just drying the plastic reels, and It would be nice to do more at once. It also takes so long, more thank you think. I also have 2 Arkay CD80's (or at least the school at work at does haha). Of course if I could send it all out to a lab, I would. But that would cost a fortune, and using Microdol X with replenishment, each roll costs cents to process. I'd be curious about finding a tank and rack that's compatible with the plastic paterson reels, just because that's what I have. Otherwise, hopefully I can stumble upon some arkay/nikor deep tanks with racks and reels for not too much $$...