Kodak Photo-Flo 200 Dilution?

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by RalphLambrecht, Mar 7, 2011.

  1. I avoid all these problems by using Edwal LFN; one drop per 16oz distilled water. At this rate of consumption it'll outlast me.
    https://www.adorama.com/chelfn.html

    All it has to do is break the surface tension on the water droplets (as a surfactant).
     
  2. bvy

    bvy Subscriber

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    I had the same problem with Edwal LFN and distilled water. It's hard to use less than a drop (more water, yes, but I buy the water too). I went back to PhotoFlo.
     
  3. bernard_L

    bernard_L Member

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    Late at the party, but... On my bottle of Photo-Flo (that will outlive me too) the directions say dilute 1 part in 600.
    The label also states: CAT 503 8286 Made in France by Kodak Pathé (back then there was this large Eastman Kodak facility at Châlons sur Saône, birthplace of Nicéphore Niepce).
    I conform to that dilution using an eyedropper that I have calibrated, and use distilled(?) water for final rinse. Never wipe film. Never a water mark, never a dust speck.
     
  4. Sirius Glass

    Sirius Glass Subscriber

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    There is 1:200 bottles of PhotoFlo and there is 1:600 bottles of PhotoFlo. Read the bottle and follow the instructions.
     
  5. Vaughn

    Vaughn Subscriber

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    Be aware that the Photo-Flo 600 uses slightly different chemicals and is actually toxic, while Photo-Flo 200 is not. I bought a gallon of Photo-Flo 2100 for the university darkroom (it is the non-toxic formulation) and they'll still be using that bottle (if they did not already toss it out) for decades.

    If I remember correctly, I used 7 oz of the Photo-Flo 2100 to make a gallon of stock solution. The stock solution was then used at one oz per gallon to make a working solution.
     
  6. That defies an explanation which I can't provide, unless it's something to do with the fact that I'm strictly a sheet film guy and if you're using roll film, then the droplets of fluid on the film have a far longer path to leave the film when hung to dry. Also I assume you stir the working solution adequately.
     
  7. bvy

    bvy Subscriber

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    Yes, roll film. 35mm HP5+ shown here, contrast-enhanced to show the drying marks I got with Edwal LFN. This was more extreme than anything I had gotten with Photo Flo, so I went back to Photo Flo. But I still have issues occasionally.

    upload_2017-3-30_16-37-2.png
     
  8. Andrew O'Neill

    Andrew O'Neill Subscriber

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    Fuji Drywell. That is all that I have ever used. I always pick up a bottle when I'm in Japan. Just picked one up there last week even though I still have half a bottle from two years ago. The stuff is dirt cheap!
     

  9. A shame to spoil such a nice smile like that. You know, you could devise a method to tether the bottom of the films so they hang off-vertical enough to allow the fluid to quickly go to the edge of the film (like sheet film hung by a corner), then runs down the edge and off. Sounds like a kludge but I think not too difficult, and if it works …
     
  10. bvy

    bvy Subscriber

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    Eh, it's just a backstage snapshot from a show I was in. And I could probably still get a decent print from it. Anyway, I've considered hanging the film different ways. I've also considered letting it drip/dry partially on the reel (on its side), and then hanging it as usual.
     
  11. dynachrome

    dynachrome Member

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    1/2 capful of the old small bottle per 8 oz in distilled water.
     
  12. RattyMouse

    RattyMouse Member

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    My bottle of Photoflo contains no defoamer. If I put 2-3 mls of photoflo in water and agitate mildly, there will be prodigious amounts of foam. I mean a LOT. If there is a defoamer, it is not doing anything.
     
  13. RattyMouse

    RattyMouse Member

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    The final dilution is supposed to be 1:200. You are not supposed to further dilute that down even more. 4-5 drops of a 1:200 dilution into 600mls is virtually nothing.

    1:200 is only 50 parts per million. Taking a few drops of that into 600 mls means you have Photoflo only in the parts per BILLION level. Absolutely useless.
     
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  15. bvy

    bvy Subscriber

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    I'm getting drying marks at 1+200, and I'm going to cut back, probably in half.
     
  16. Wayne

    Wayne Subscriber

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    I may have already replied, but I use as little as I can get the cap to dispense, whether its going into a 120 roll tank or a tray. A few drops is always plenty.
     
  17. ruilourosa

    ruilourosa Member

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    tetenal mirasol adds anti bacterial and anti fungical properties...

    does someone adds a diy formula??? knoppow once said that triton x 100 could be used with some isopropanol... i once added a drop to 50ml isopropanol to 1liter of water and it worked very well but i got worried about permanence and got back to comercial products...
     
  18. Helinophoto

    Helinophoto Subscriber

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    Then why does it foam like crazy?

    My procedure is 3 drops in an empty tank, fill to 600ml, stir gently and dunk the tank when the film is submerged, wait until foam has dissipated, lift out gently, empty tank.

    It removes water-spouts for me.
    When I don't use it, i get dried droplets everywhere.

    So yeah, 3 drops of the 1:200 seems to do exactly as designed, in my tanks at least.
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2017
  19. RattyMouse

    RattyMouse Member

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    I'll try this next time I soup up a few rolls. I find it very hard to believe that such a super diluted solution would foam, but I could be wrong. I've studied foams in water for 25 years in my day job and am super sensitive to the creation of foam.
     
  20. Helinophoto

    Helinophoto Subscriber

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  21. Wayne

    Wayne Subscriber

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    It'll foam. Maybe you should stop putting your film in soup; the oils could be affecting your wash and dry cycle.
     
  22. MattKing

    MattKing Subscriber

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    I make an intermediate stock solution with isopropyl alcohol (keeps well for a long time) and then dilute from that.
    But even when I just used a drop or two of the Photo-flo concentrate, I used the following procedure:
    1) mix up the working solution while the film was being fixed (or earlier);
    2) use a separate container;
    3) half fill the container with near room temperature water, add the drop(s), gently add the rest of the room temperature water, stir gently;
    4) allow to come to room temperature.
     
  23. Sirius Glass

    Sirius Glass Subscriber

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    If you would just add 0.5ml and fill to the liter line, then you would be following directions and would avoid having to post threads on what went wrong with your film. That would be a win for everyone. :wink:
     
  24. canuhead

    canuhead Member

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    do tell Andrew...what makes it different from the usual suspects ? I've got Photo Flo 200 and 600
     
  25. bvy

    bvy Subscriber

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    The point that you keep missing is that strict adherence to the directions is not working for everyone under all circumstances.
     
  26. Wayne

    Wayne Subscriber

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    I've never had a problem with drying my film. Ever. We've been down this road before.
     
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