Is there a "Do it all" developer ?

[John Bragg]

I fully understand that this is a very subjective question, but is there anything close to a universal developer that satisfies most needs ? Mine would be HC-110 or lately Ilfotec HC for the sheer versatility that they offer. Pea soup economy coupled with high performance is a winning combination. Want a 3 stop push and it will do it. Vary dilutions and effects like stand development or semi stand are easily possible. It may be the swiss army knife of developers as someone said (Covington maybe).

 

[Milpool]

Essentially any properly formulated general purpose solvent developer can do most anything. D-76 for example.

 

[chuckroast]

I fully understand that this is a very subjective question, but is there anything close to a universal developer that satisfies most needs ? Mine would be HC-110 or lately Ilfotec HC for the sheer versatility that they offer. Pea soup economy coupled with high performance is a winning combination. Want a 3 stop push and it will do it. Vary dilutions and effects like stand development or semi stand are easily possible. It may be the swiss army knife of developers as someone said (Covington maybe).

D-23 leaps to mind. It's endlessly flexible in how it can be applied.

Pyrocat-HD is another for much the same reason.

 

[John Wiegerink]

On the other side of the pond, or channel for you John, Rodinal or its clone seem very popular. With the dilution, you can develop almost any film out there.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Does one shoe size fit everyone? Well, maybe if you force it to; but it might not be comfortable. Developers like D76 were marketed as a middle-of-the-road versatile option with good reason; but I haven't used that in decades because I prefer what more specialized developers can do with specific films.

 

[John Bragg]

Does one shoe size fit everyone? Well, maybe if you force it to; but it might not be comfortable. Developers like D76 were marketed as a middle-of-the-road versatile option with good reason; but I haven't used that in decades because I prefer what more specialized developers can do with specific films.

Indeed Drew. I liked ID-11 which is analogous to D76. However, cost ruled that out and I got similar results with HC-110. I always wanted to like Rodinal, but couldn't get on with it beyond certain films like the original Agfa APX 100.

 

[John Bragg]

On the other side of the pond, or channel for you John, Rodinal or its clone seem very popular. With the dilution, you can develop almost any film out there.

I wanted to like Rodinal but couldn't make it work for me.

 

[Paul Howell]

In the old day Polydal, currently a good middle of the road like D76, HC 110, Clayton F76+, there are many others.

 

[Milpool]

Rodinal is great - but you said do-it-all which is why I think a mild pH solvent developer is more versatile. A general purpose solvent developer suitably diluted can be as sharp or sharper than Rodinal, but Rodinal can’t do fine grain.

I wanted to like Rodinal but couldn't make it work for me.

 

[retina_restoration]

Rodinal is far too brutal for my needs. It may work for many, but not me. I hate the stuff. It is far too eager to assassinate highlights.

 

[Romanko]

I liked ID-11 which is analogous to D76. However, cost ruled that out

D-23 is similar to D-76. It is very cheap and can be replenished.

 

[pentaxuser]

D-23 is similar to D-76. It is very cheap and can be replenished.

True but John claíms that Ifotec can do a 3 stop push. Wouldn't D23 be hard pressed to manage a 3 stop push? Mind you having said that Ilford has a time for D3200 said to be a true 1000 film at 3200 so whose to know what D23 can manage at 3 stops

pentaxuser

 

[Romanko]

Wouldn't D23 be hard pressed to manage a 3 stop push?

It probably will. I somehow missed that requirement. I never tried pushing film with D23. The development time would be quite long even in stock solution. Probably a question for a different thread, I am sure someone has tried it.

 

[Ian Grant]

Rodinal is far too brutal for my needs. It may work for many, but not me. I hate the stuff. It is far too eager to assassinate highlights.

With Rodinal dilution is the key to controlling contrast not just development tome.

D-23 is similar to D-76. It is very cheap and can be replenished.

Similar but not close enough for push processing.

I wanted to like Rodinal but couldn't make it work for me.

Then you are not using it optimally.

D-23 leaps to mind. It's endlessly flexible in how it can be applied.

Pyrocat-HD is another for much the same reason.

There are other excellent developers.

Ian

 

[John Bragg]

With Rodinal dilution is the key to controlling contrast not just development tome.



Similar but not close enough for push processing.



Then you are not using it optimally.



There are other excellent developers.

Ian

Thanks for your observations Ian. My issues with Rodinal were that I liked its tonality, but not its tendency to coarse grain with my chosen film (which was Tri-X at the time). I have since switched to HP5+ so another test may be in order. I like grain, but was not enamoured with that combination aesthetically.

 

[GregY]

Rodinal is far too brutal for my needs. It may work for many, but not me. I hate the stuff. It is far too eager to assassinate highlights.

Yes. My daily developer Is Pyrocat HD.... used PMK for a long time and then switched to Pyrocat when it came out. Highlights love it!

 

[John Wiegerink]

Ian is right about using Rodinal at different dilutions, different agitation rates and times. It is very agile, but not my main developer. Pyrocat-HDC and Adox XT-3 are it for me, but I do have Rodinal on my shelf. It works great with Fuji Acros and Ilford PanF+

 

[DREW WILEY]

Staining developers are really in their own category. I use a lot of PMK, but not for every kind of film. I like it better than Pyrocat, although they are similar. They are based on different kinds of "pyro" (pyrocatechol versus pyrogallol). The image stain color comes out a little different.

I did notice a dicey statement in relation to how far film can be "pushed" in different kinds of developers. That's a loaded question, first, because different films differ in that respect, sometimes greatly; and second, because the terminology of pushing itself is less than ideal, is frequently ambiguous, and can mean different things to different people. A third factor is how the degree of developer dilution or not factors into this. A developer like HC-110 can be made to work over a remarkably long range of dilutions, depending on what kind of curve structure you're after, while some other developers have a rather restricted range of usable dilution.

HC-110 was developed mainly for sake of big pro labs; but the poor man's (or budget-oriented lab's) substitute was DK-50. One advantage of traditional syrup style HC-110 was the tremendous useable lifespan of the undiluted concentrate itself.

The disadvantage of D76 is that you either need to standardize on it freshly mixed, or allow about a week for it to pH stabilize after mixing, because there is an initial shift.

 

[Alex Benjamin]

It probably will. I somehow missed that requirement. I never tried pushing film with D23. The development time would be quite long even in stock solution. Probably a question for a different thread, I am sure someone has tried it.

I've often developed FP4+ @ 200 in D23, but I'll admit that's not much of a push.

 

[Nicholas Lindan]

If it is a do it all developer then it also has to do paper:

M-Q Universal
DK93
DK50
Versatol

Of course, nothing says you can't use Dektol for film. Or, for that matter, use Microdol for paper - takes about 15 minutes, and the blacks aren't anything to write home about.

* * *​

For a film-only developer I concur with several other posters - D-76 is as good a 'universal' developer as you will find.

 

[Alex Benjamin]

With Rodinal dilution is the key to controlling contrast not just development tome.

I agree. 1:25, 1:50, 1:75 and 1:100 will all give different results with different films, as will different agitation patterns for each.

The problem with Rodinal isn't that you can't get fantastic results with just about any film, it's the time it takes to find them.

 

[NedL]

If it is a do it all developer then it also has to do paper:

M-Q Universal
DK93
DK50
Versatol

Of course, nothing says you can't use Dektol for film. Or, for that matter, use Microdol for paper - takes about 15 minutes, and the blacks aren't anything to write home about.

* * *​

For a film-only developer I concur with several other posters - D-76 is as good a 'universal' developer as you will find.

You can develop paper in HC-110 too. I've done it in a pinch, and it worked very well, but would be expensive to use all the time....

 

[John Bragg]

Some very erudite responses here to (as Drew Wiley pointed out) what was a slightly loaded question on my part. There is a wealth of useful knowledge amongst the members of this forum. I can remember a long time ago there was a guy called DF Cardwell who had some interesting ways with Rodinal. I have never tried staining developers but like the look many here get with them. I am currently getting to know Ilfotec HC and finding the info here on Jason Brunner's 1:49 metric dilution (HC-110) is just what I need. Dilution H has always been my go to, but I love the results at 1:49 and the ability to develop 2 films at a time in 500ml. Also it seems that once dialled in properly it is very kind to mid tones and high values like caucasian skin tones.

 

[koraks]

Of course, nothing says you can't use Dektol for film.

35mm Fomapan 100, ID62 paper developer; scan from negative.

I could have developed a print from this negative in the same developer, since I developed this strip of film during a printing session by sloshing it around in the print developer tray for a couple of minutes. Well, if not for the fact the film had to dry first and it's unlikely I'd spend time printing an image like this one.

 

[albireo]

I tried a few options over the past years, and while I wasn't able to decide on a "do it all" developer, I think I can come close: I have three (actually two) that cover pretty much everything I like to do:

• Adox Rodinal 1:50 or 1:75 regularly inverted for low or medium speed 120 film
• D76 1:1 one-shot or D23 1:1 one-shot for all 35mm (regardless of speed) and high speed medium format.

Occasionally, I'll use Rodinal even for 400 ISO medium format film. It really is wonderful with correctly exposed, and correctly developed Foma 400 in 6x9, for instance. Grain is neglectable, tonality is excellent.

I'm puzzled by these comments on Rodinal producing grainy or 'harsh' results. I wonder if it comes from people who use it primarily with 35mm film printed really big, for example people who use to overdevelop underexposed 400 iso 35mm film ('pushing').

Grain/frame size ratio is a critical variable when assessing impact of grain, I've found. Grain from Rodinal-developed medium format (or larger) negatives assessed via print or scan at normal viewing distance are beautifully fine grained, and have an extended highlight tonality that I haven't been able to replicate with other developers tried so far.