I can't get the right color filtration.

[Flavia Daniele]

Flavia,
I expect that English might not be your first language, so I hope you don't mind if I tell you that this is a colloquialism that is very funny (in the circumstances).
The colour of the unstained part does look quite close to correct, so you should be feeling encouraged.
What procedure are you using to develop the paper?

ahah I'm trying to do my best to learn it xD

I'm using a thermo-drum and before to load the chemicals I always check the temperature.

 

[Mainecoonmaniac]

Yes finally I think I reached the right filtration but I think I have another problem right now... And I don't know if is about chemicals or other

Is it possible to start fresh. Also, it's important to keep the temperature the same. Variations in temperature will cause your color to shift.

 

[Vaughn]

I am concern about the size of your test strips. It helps tremendously to keep all variables as constant as possible...time and temperature to be sure, but also the square cm (area) of paper developed with the same ml (amount) of developer. That is why my example of a test 'strip' is a whole sheet of paper. The only thing changed between the test and my first print was the aperture and a slight tweak of a couple seconds.

 

[pentaxuser]

. He was accustomed to people asking him what kinds of color he used in his own residence. It was all bright red. Why? Because his wife was Peruvian. As he explained it, to a Peruvian, red is their equivalent of a neutral, and she was in charge of color choices.

Did he explain what it was that brought about the Peruvian belief that red was a neutral colour? If red is neutral I wonder what she would have said about grey or beige or what we'd term insipid colours?

To avoid creating the wrong impression at a job interview did she favour red suits for her husband as "loud colours" often create difficulties for the interviewee?

Thanks

pentaxuser

 

[DREW WILEY]

I have a number of South American Latinos nearby. They love bright festive colors. It's they're equivalent of off-white, I guess. One neighbor had a tall white New-England style shingle house, along with dichondra lawns that he manicured every single weekend. When he retired and sold the place, the new owners tore his whole lawn out even before the moving van was fully emptied and started planting all kinds of bright shrubbery, which now looks gorgeous, then repainted the house something bold. Just different tastes. Same thing happened with a heart surgeon in a more expensive part of town. One he married a Peruvian woman, everything indoors got repainted red.

 

[Flavia Daniele]

I am concern about the size of your test strips. It helps tremendously to keep all variables as constant as possible...time and temperature to be sure, but also the square cm (area) of paper developed with the same ml (amount) of developer. That is why my example of a test 'strip' is a whole sheet of paper. The only thing changed between the test and my first print was the aperture and a slight tweak of a couple seconds.

So maybe it's because it's too small! I didn't thought about that

 

[DREW WILEY]

The size of the test piece has nothing to do with it. A significant shift in chem temp or freshness might, or inadequate volume, depending. But it looks more like a gross filter error.

 

[pentaxuser]

. Same thing happened with a heart surgeon in a more expensive part of town. One he married a Peruvian woman, everything indoors got repainted red.

Thanks. I take it that he complained to his wife that when he came home after a day of heart surgery and looked at the rooms' colour it was like being back at work

pentaxuser

 

[Vaughn]

It will be difficult to determine a working color balance if variations in developing produce different results.

This is why we encouraged our students to use full-sized test 'strips'. It helps to plan ones test to get the most information possible out of it. The exposure test I do with the 4 different apertures also gives me an idea of any correction needed from my standard starting filter pack with that film and paper. A second test can be made if the color is way off by using the determined aperture and exposure times, and changing filtration in each of the 4 test exposure on the sheet of paper.

And changing your filter pack...especially magenta will change your over-all exposure a little, too.

 

[koraks]

Looks like a problem that has to do with coverage of the chemistry, possibly with another factor involved as well (e.g. light fogging after incomplete processing).

I'm going to suggest something that may raise some eyebrows, but try developing in trays (instead of drums) at room temperature. Timing is not very critical; take a development time of 2 minutes for starters. Blix time 1-2 minutes; again not critical assuming the blix is fresh or adequately replenished. You'll find temperature is not extremely critical - if it causes visible shifts, they will be the equivalent of around 1cc or 2cc filter pack change (if that, even). All in the dark, of course. Agitate continuously; doesn't have to be very wild, just keep the developer moving across the paper. Use a stop bath of acetic acid (1-2% is fine) between developer and blix.
This would resolve most problems with uneven development. If this works, see if you can get it to work with drums as well.

I get the strong impression that drums tend to create more problems than they solve, at least for some people. But it may just be my preference for the simplicity of trays talking here

 

[Flavia Daniele]

Looks like a problem that has to do with coverage of the chemistry, possibly with another factor involved as well (e.g. light fogging after incomplete processing).

I'm going to suggest something that may raise some eyebrows, but try developing in trays (instead of drums) at room temperature. Timing is not very critical; take a development time of 2 minutes for starters. Blix time 1-2 minutes; again not critical assuming the blix is fresh or adequately replenished. You'll find temperature is not extremely critical - if it causes visible shifts, they will be the equivalent of around 1cc or 2cc filter pack change (if that, even). All in the dark, of course. Agitate continuously; doesn't have to be very wild, just keep the developer moving across the paper. Use a stop bath of acetic acid (1-2% is fine) between developer and blix.
This would resolve most problems with uneven development. If this works, see if you can get it to work with drums as well.

I get the strong impression that drums tend to create more problems than they solve, at least for some people. But it may just be my preference for the simplicity of trays talking here

I want to try this too but I'm a bit dobious about how maintain the temperature with trays I dont' have a lot of space so I chose the thermo-drum. Anyway could it be a contamination between the developer and the bleach/fix ?

 

[gdavis]

thermo-drum looks very similar to the dev-tec setup I use which works very well for me. I put the loaded drum in and let it dry-warm while I measure out the chemicals (60ml each of dev and blix for 8x10 one-shot). Dev for 50 sec @102 F, blix for 50 sec, then two water rinses (200 ml) about 30 sec each before removing the print and giving a final rinse under running water. Give the drum a quick wipe with a paper towel and it's ready to go by the time I'm set up for the next print. I get very even and consistent results.

 

[Flavia Daniele]

thermo-drum looks very similar to the dev-tec setup I use which works very well for me. I put the loaded drum in and let it dry-warm while I measure out the chemicals (60ml each of dev and blix for 8x10 one-shot). Dev for 50 sec @102 F, blix for 50 sec, then two water rinses (200 ml) about 30 sec each before removing the print and giving a final rinse under running water. Give the drum a quick wipe with a paper towel and it's ready to go by the time I'm set up for the next print. I get very even and consistent results.

Do you use a stabilizer after the bleach?

 

[DREW WILEY]

I always do a brief plain water rinse between the stop and blix steps, using a larger volume of water in the drum, just in case a bit of dev is still in there somewhere, or perhaps even attached to the funnel. And I use multiple plain water final rinse, typically 5 or 6 of 2 min each, rather than stabilizer. Nor do I ever replenish or re-use anything. All of this helps.

 

[Mainecoonmaniac]

Do you use a stabilizer after the bleach?

I don’t think it’s needed. It’s bad for your health because some stabilizers contain formaldehyde.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Stabilizer is needed in high-volume roller transport processing simply because wash time is insufficient. Everything is fed straight into the dryer. Even if you happen to use an automated roller-transport machine yourself, you have the option to manually wash the prints for a longer time in completely fresh water.

 

[Flavia Daniele]

Stabilizer is needed in high-volume roller transport processing simply because wash time is insufficient. Everything is fed straight into the dryer. Even if you happen to use an automated roller-transport machine yourself, you have the option to manually wash the prints for a longer time in completely fresh water.

Oh perfect! So finally I can avoid to use it. The temperature of water is indifferent?

 

[gdavis]

Do you use a stabilizer after the bleach?

The kit I'm using (Arista RA-4 from Freestyle https://www.freestylephoto.biz/11814-Arista-RA-4-Color-Print-Processing-Kit-4-Liters) doesn't include a separate stabilizer. I think I read that a modern stabilizer (that replaces formaldehyde) is incorporated into the blix or paper.

I keep the proper temp for developer and blix, after that I don't really worry about it but I do warm the first rinse at least a little to reduce any shock. Remaining rinse is straight out of the tap.

 

[DREW WILEY]

No. The stabilizer is still sold separately. Most of the big labs have direct accounts. But people who buy from Freestyle are low-volume users, even those of use who tend to make big prints. The Arista and Silver Pixel kits they sell seem identical, even interchangeable, in performance to the Kodak RA/Rt starter kits. Fuji has its own RA4 chem, which is also functionally the same.

 

[Flavia Daniele]

So even if I have Bellini RA-4 stab you suggest to develop,bleach and then just wash the prints with fresh water? Right?

 

[DREW WILEY]

Yes. But I recommend, prewash (plain water), dev, stop bath, briefly rinse again, blix, final rinse, then final extended washing of the print outside the processor. Initial rinse and developing temps are critical. All following steps should be reasonably close, and the final wash water within reason too, but need not be as hot. I standardize on 2 min each 30C for dev and bleach steps.

 

[Flavia Daniele]

Yes. But I recommend, prewash (plain water), dev, stop bath, briefly rinse again, blix, final rinse, then final extended washing of the print outside the processor.

Stop bath for how long? And the final rinse 2 minutes, right?

 

[DREW WILEY]

Stop can be anywhere from 30 sec to up to 2 min. Final rinse in drums for me is 5 or 6 changes of water at 2 min each, so around 10 to 12 min total. That might sound like a lot, but it seems to improve the lifespan of the prints versus the commercial standard of only 2 min cumulatively. It can be done in either the drum itself or continuously in a big tray with an automatic tray siphon and constant fresh water.

 

[koraks]

I want to try this too but I'm a bit dobious about how maintain the temperature with trays

You don't need to when working at room temperature.

 

[brbo]

Flavia, are you sure you are loading the paper into the drum correctly? With drums, the paper must be curved along the drum walls (emulsion facing inwards) and stay like that for the whole duration of the processing. You seem to be using quite small pieces of paper for your test prints and I doubt those can even be fitted properly let alone stay in proper position inside the drum with all the pouring in/out of chemicals and drum rotation that is happening (if Paterson Thermo Drum processor is anything like the Jobo that I'm using).

Anyway, if you have space for tray developing that might be the most sensible route to eliminate the uneven processing. As said before, room temperature will be just fine if you extend the time of developing and blixing.