Fed Up With JOBO!

[markbau]

I'm following this thread with interest because I've been thinking about picking up a Jobo 1500 or 2500 for inversion processing of B&W film.

I'm curious, if the plastic Jobo reels can be problematic, is there a reason more people don't use Hewes (for Jobo) steel reels in their Jobo tanks?

Steel reels take a lot of practice to be able to lead them successfully. The main reason I no longer use them is because if you should drop one the chances are that the reel will be bent, even if ever so slightly, and it will be all but impossible to load them.

 

[markbau]

Correct me if I’m wrong, but I thought those little ball bearings only helped with 135 film? They are designed to fit into the sprocket holes.

I have about 8 Patterson reels, all of them have had their ball bearings removed. The reels can be perfectly try but a tiny bit of moisture can still be on the ball bearing and loading will be a chore. Take the ball bearings out, you will thank me, they contribute nothing to the loading process.

 

[JerseyDoug]

The easiest to load of all the 120 reels I have tried is the plastic Samigon reel that fits the Paterson tank (and the Plastic Samigon tank.)

 

[Patrick Robert James]

You probably have residue on the reels. Every now and then I clean my reels and tanks with bleach. Toss some bleach in there then fill with water and let it soak. I've had my JOBO 1500 tanks and reels for close to 30 years now. The reels are still whitish even though I use staining developers. Film goes on like butter....

If the tank is leaking out the top then take a piece of fine sandpaper and go around the plastic where the lid attaches to knock down any burrs. That should solve the leaks. And you do know that after you put the lid on you push the center of the lid down, right?

 

[john_s]

I have found that 120 film can be difficult to load in the Jobo reel because of the strong curl tending to make it not slide well because the tip is exerting force on the inner side of the groove. So I straighten out the two leading corners so that they tend to exert force on neither the inner nor outer side of the groove.

Also humidity makes a huge difference. In the past when I've been frustrated by difficulties getting it to work I've become very hot and bothered and it becomes a viscous spiral getting hotter, sweatier and worse all the time. I have been known to put the film in a dark container and take some time to "cool off."

 

[MattKing]

The easiest to load of all the 120 reels I have tried is the plastic Samigon reel that fits the Paterson tank (and the Plastic Samigon tank.)

Also sold under a bunch of different names, including AP (the original manufacturer) and Arista Premium.
Be sure to use the version with the wide flanges.

 

[Craig]

I have some 2500 series reels and I have never been able to load a 120 on them either. I can load a Patterson in seconds, been using them for 35 years and it's so easy. My reels are clean and dry, the humidity is very low in my darkroom and I have tried it with fresh film that is well in date to minimize curl - nothing has worked.

Oddly, if I try to load a processed and dried B&W film it will load on a Jobo reel, but I have never been able to load an unprocessed film successfully without kinks and creases. In my opinion, the Jobo reel system is junk.

The expert drums are wonderful for sheet films, but for 120 and 35mm I've gone back to processing by hand in Patterson tanks; they work every time.

 

[AgX]

In my opinion, the Jobo reel system is junk.

The interesting thing in this context is that likely no manufacturer designed as many different reels for spooled film as Jobo.

 

[Sirius Glass]

I have some 2500 series reels and I have never been able to load a 120 on them either. I can load a Patterson in seconds, been using them for 35 years and it's so easy. My reels are clean and dry, the humidity is very low in my darkroom and I have tried it with fresh film that is well in date to minimize curl - nothing has worked.

Oddly, if I try to load a processed and dried B&W film it will load on a Jobo reel, but I have never been able to load an unprocessed film successfully without kinks and creases. In my opinion, the Jobo reel system is junk.

The expert drums are wonderful for sheet films, but for 120 and 35mm I've gone back to processing by hand in Patterson tanks; they work every time.

Sounds like an Operator Assisted Failure.

 

[projectbluebird]

I am sick and tired of my JOBO developing tanks!!

Years ago, I switch from my classic Nikor + Hewes system to a more modern system. I went with the JOBO 1500 system instead of the Paterson Super System 4 primarily based on two factors:

1. The ability to easily “double up” rolls of 120 film with the JOBO.
2. The reputation of the JOBO system as being relatively leakproof.

Both of these ended up being false!

I just developed two rolls of 120 film in my JOBO 1520 and it tool me almost an hour to load both rolls onto the plastic reel! Almost 60 minutes of cursing and swearing as I try to nudge the very thin, very wide roll of 120 film on to the JOBO reel and constantly having to back off and try again. I’m no novice either! I’ve been loading reels in changing bags since 2014 … nearly 8 years.

And then when developing the film, the damn JOBO 1520 leaks all over the place!! Now I got fixer all over my kitchen!

I don’t understand all the love the JOBO gets here on the forums. Yes, the quality of the German craftsmanship that goes into manufacturing the tanks & reels is high. But that doesn’t matter because the design of the system is fundamentally flawed.

Unless you’re already invested in one of their color processors, you’re better off going with literally any other brand.

</rant>

I have recently returned to developing film, after over a decade of not shooting at all - and my experience has been the opposite of yours!

Previously, I used nikkor steel tanks and hewes reels, for both 135 and 120. I managed to find my old tanks and reels while getting supplies ready, and I found them to leak badly. I sprang for a Jobo 1500 tank and the only time it has leaked was due to user error (I failed to ensure the lid was on correctly). Otherwise, it has worked like a charm, as advertised.

The steel reels, on the other hand, have been somewhat of a disappointment. Some brands of film have been fine, but with others I’ve managed to lose two rolls; one that i could *not* get to load correctly, and another that ‘jumped’ the spiral, and did not develop correctly where it was touching itself.

I have switched to the jobo plastic reel for my 120 films, and I am very pleased with the ease of loading. I have not lost a single roll since - the tip to trim the corners before loading was very helpful.

 

[Sirius Glass]

I have recently returned to developing film, after over a decade of not shooting at all - and my experience has been the opposite of yours!

Previously, I used nikkor steel tanks and hewes reels, for both 135 and 120. I managed to find my old tanks and reels while getting supplies ready, and I found them to leak badly. I sprang for a Jobo 1500 tank and the only time it has leaked was due to user error (I failed to ensure the lid was on correctly). Otherwise, it has worked like a charm, as advertised.

The steel reels, on the other hand, have been somewhat of a disappointment. Some brands of film have been fine, but with others I’ve managed to lose two rolls; one that i could *not* get to load correctly, and another that ‘jumped’ the spiral, and did not develop correctly where it was touching itself.

I have switched to the jobo plastic reel for my 120 films, and I am very pleased with the ease of loading. I have not lost a single roll since - the tip to trim the corners befo re loading was very helpful.

I had the the same experience. Hewes reels need the corners of the film cut and so to Jobo reels need the film corners cut. Both types of reels need daylight practice first.

Both steel tanks and Jobo tanks may drip a little.

Both systems work will, but I prefer the Jobo because there is less processing variation plus I have temperature control with Jobo that steel tanks do not easily have.

 

[pentaxuser]

In his opening post waffles simply made a statement about Jobo reels, namely he was fed up with them - end of story

I am not convinced on re-reading this thread that he was actually asking for help to solve his dislike of Jobo reels

As long as he "got it off his chest" as we say in the U.K. the opening post achieved that objective

pentaxuser

 

[freecitizen]

I use Jobo and Paterson tanks. Before I load film into the reel I give the reel a good blast with a hair dryer set to hot. It dries and warms the reel. It also seems to make the plastic of the reel more " slippy ". Moisture is the enemy here, and it builds up pretty fast in a changing bag.

 

[Melvin J Bramley]

The Paterson reel is not brain surgery!
Simply run a graphite/lead pencil around the groves from both sides and the film will load easily; even 120!!
I find it easier to load a Paterson reel with a roll of 120 than a 36 exposure of 35mm.
The graphite takes a while to wash off and gives extra life to old reels.

TB

 

[mshchem]

I have found it a little easier to load the Jobo reels with 120 by rounding the corners of the film with a cutter used by scrapbookers. But Paterson reels are still easier to load because they have a little ball bearing that pulls the film along as you rotate the reel sides. Just make sure the ball bearing is not stuck before you load the reel. The Jobo lid won't leak if properly closed--sometimes a pain--but the Jobo tank is much easier and faster to fill and empty than Paterson. Neither system is ideal in my mind, I end up using both.

I do the same, and I use IR goggles. CORNER ROUNDER SMALLEST SIZE AVAILABLE

 

[mshchem]

Also, BUY a NEW reel

 

[waffles]

You probably have residue on the reels. Every now and then I clean my reels and tanks with bleach. Toss some bleach in there then fill with water and let it soak. I've had my JOBO 1500 tanks and reels for close to 30 years now. The reels are still whitish even though I use staining developers. Film goes on like butter....

If the tank is leaking out the top then take a piece of fine sandpaper and go around the plastic where the lid attaches to knock down any burrs. That should solve the leaks. And you do know that after you put the lid on you push the center of the lid down, right?

Do you know what grit of sand paper you would use? I wondered about doing something like that myself.

 

[AgX]

I would use 1500, if at all.

 

[Patrick Robert James]

Do you know what grit of sand paper you would use? I wondered about doing something like that myself.

You want something really fine. 800 or more. Can't remember what I used. Go lightly. You are only trying to get the burrs off.

 

[Don_ih]

The problem is after that. I try to gently load the film onto the reel, and it will move smoothly for 2-3 inches. But then it will jam. And I have to back it off an inch, and try again. And the further on the reel the film advances, the more difficult it becomes to load! To the point when, if I’m trying to load two rolls, the first roll becomes almost impossible unless I “force” it. And yes, this is with a bone-dry reel.

That is almost certainly due to a corner getting caught against the plastic structure (as opposed to any part of the track) of the reel. Rounding or clipping off the corners helps but it still happens a bit. I find the most irritating part of loading 120 to be how any curl makes the film not want to span the reel, so I crease the leading edge 1/4 inch in from the end to get that to be flat. Every now and then, it will take me a long time to get 120 on one of those reels. I don't ever put two on a reel. Frankly, I wish they'd loosened the spiral a bit, since I think it coils 120 film too tightly, increasing the risk of the film touching itself (which has happened to me more than once and there seems to be nothing to do about it).

 

[Don_ih]

Do you know what grit of sand paper you would use?

I'd use a file or 120 grit flat on a board. Any sandpaper with 400 grit or higher is not appropriate for deburring.

 

[Nitroplait]

…
I can't load 120 on to steel reels - period.

Fascinating!
I can’t load 120 on to plastic reels. Impossible!
Hewes and LPL 120 stainless reels are super easy.
I found that instead of securing the film-end in whatever lock the reel provides, that it is much easier for me just holding the film-end with my thumb for the first turn and wind the spool from there.

I originally learned to do 35mm on Paterson reels and although I now prefer Hewes (and LPL) I still think that Paterson is the most economical and easy way to start. (Just make sure the reels are clean and dry).

 

[AgX]

Jobo statement about their Series 1000 and 2000 (old) reels:

"Loading of reels without problem, even with spiral being moist."

 

[Sirius Glass]

Fascinating!
I can’t load 120 on to plastic reels. Impossible!
Hewes and LPL 120 stainless reels are super easy.
I found that instead of securing the film-end in whatever lock the reel provides, that it is much easier for me just holding the film-end with my thumb for the first turn and wind the spool from there.

I originally learned to do 35mm on Paterson reels and although I now prefer Hewes (and LPL) I still think that Paterson is the most economical and easy way to start. (Just make sure the reels are clean and dry).

Hewes stainless steel reels for Jobo tanks are very expensive. I use the plastic ones, clip the corners and use a pencil as many have described on this thread.

 

[DREW WILEY]

I've been using Jobo hand-inversion drums and reels for 120 film for a long time. I use a similar trick as Don. Stubborn curl is somewhat related to humidity as well as the specific film. I bend the insertion end of the film to an inch or so of straight section, and clip the sharp insertion corners just a little so they don't hang up. Working with 35mm film is similar. After inserting the film into the entry position of the reel and sliding it in a few inches, you kinda ratchet the reel back and forth with gentle finger pressure on the film until it's all taken up. It's important not to use too much pressure. Helps to practice in daylight with an expendable roll of film until you gain confidence.