Exeter Pan XX - what is it?

[Don_ih]

My money's on it being Orwo.

 

[Agulliver]

Here is what the actual film looks like. Not many clues, except it doesn't have the motion picture perforations.

 

[AgX]

Only 25ft ?

I remember "long" rolls shorter than 100ft and even bought them. But that was long ago that such short rolls were offered.

 

[Agulliver]

The seller offers it in 25, 50, 100 ft and sometimes longer rolls. I just went for the cheapest option as I'm curious as to what this is. Also scaling back my usage of Ilford HP5+ as my favourite jazz club is closing at the end of the year

 

[Donald Qualls]

Only 25ft ?

I remember "long" rolls shorter than 100ft and even bought them. But that was long ago that such short rolls were offered.

The photo of the can says it's rerolled from longer strips, so it might be something normally sold in 100 foot lengths being rerolled to 50 and 25. I agree, those don't look like cine perfs, but it's possible someone bought unperfed strips (say, from ORWO) and had a perforating machine that cut for 35 mm still. As far as the film itself, that could be almost any B&W stock -- Fomapan, Adox, Svema (though Svema wouldn't be "made in EU"), old old Agfa from stock found in a warehouse freezer, etc.

I'd presume there wasn't a core in the 25 foot roll?

 

[AgX]

There is no new Svema filmstock. Rebranded films aside.

 

[Agulliver]

@Donald Qualls You are correct, no core.

And yes, thus far it could be anything. I'll only know more when I shoot and process some. And then the biggest clue will be if there are any edge markings.

 

[Donald Qualls]

For whatever it's worth (not implying that this is Fomapan, though it's certainly possible), Fomapan 100 and 400, at least, sold for rebranding (at least under .EDU Ultra) has NO edge markings at all. Good luck figuring out what you did wrong if you get blank film, or whether it was 100 or 400 stock anyway.

 

[DREW WILEY]

I don't pretend to know what this is. But over the years I have encountered a fair amount of snake oil marketing of rebranded remnants of EU films. Juggling ASA labeling with a hefty dose of over-optimism is one of the tricks.

 

[pentaxuser]

I note that in the seller's details, he is based in Exeter which might explain why it's called EXETER Pan XX

If it is Foma 400 then the seller wants abut £11 more for it than a major U.K. retailer wants

If its ORWO then I have no idea what bulk roll sellers, assuming there are any other than ORWO itself, want for a 100ft bulk roll. The official ORWO site requires that you contact one person by e-mail if you want to order but I see no way to find out the price other than via e-mail so a lot of work,just to find out its price

I wish Agulliver well in his findings but the whole thing smacks of the famous buying a "pig in a poke" foray

pentaxuser

 

[Arcadia4]

I note that in the seller's details, he is based in Exeter which might explain why it's called EXETER Pan XX

If it is Foma 400 then the seller wants abut £11 more for it than a major U.K. retailer wants

If its ORWO then I have no idea what bulk roll sellers, assuming there are any other than ORWO itself, want for a 100ft bulk roll. The official ORWO site requires that you contact one person by e-mail if you want to order but I see no way to find out the price other than via e-mail so a lot of work,just to find out its price

I wish Agulliver well in his findings but the whole thing smacks of the famous buying a "pig in a poke" foray

pentaxuser

Frame24 sell orwo un54 for £50 for 100ft.

Orwo uk direct webprice was around £44 earlier this year, with a slight discount for longer rolls upto 1000ft. The pricing was on their website then, but that seems to have changed following the direct marketing of the films for consumer use. However im sure they'd respond with prices if asked.

 

[pentaxuser]

Arcadia, well EXETER Pan XX seems to be 400 speed film but all I could find was UN54 which seems to be a 100 speed film However unless Orwo's 400 film is a lot more expensive then once again the e-bay seller is charging a lot more with no way of the buyer knowing what the film actually is

pentaxuser

 

[AgX]

The price by Filmotec of their ISO 320 film was substantially higher than some of the Filmotec film prices stated here.
I already hinted at this above.

 

[Arcadia4]

Arcadia, well EXETER Pan XX seems to be 400 speed film but all I could find was UN54 which seems to be a 100 speed film However unless Orwo's 400 film is a lot more expensive then once again the e-bay seller is charging a lot more with no way of the buyer knowing what the film actually is

pentaxuser

Yes agreed, prices were by illustration, but thanks to wayback machine OrwoUK April 22 prices inc vat but ex postage were;

UN54
35mm 1000ft: £351.86
35mm 400ft: £142.55
35mm 100ft: £41.28

N75
35mm 1000ft: £473.75
35mm 400ft: £191.23
35mm 100ft: £53.35

so the n75 is about 30% dearer but still relatively good value for stills use - although id probably rather shoot ilford pan 400 if i was looking for something at a similar cost.

Another possibility for ‘exeter pan’ that is eu manufactured other than foma or orwo would be the agfa aerial films sold by rollei e.g aviphot pan 400/retro 400S, which i believe have std perfs.

 

[Don_ih]

agfa aerial films sold by rollei e.g aviphot pan 400/retro 400S, which i believe have std perfs.

Looking at the pictures supplied by @Agulliver, that is not Agfa aviphot. Looks like Kentmere to me.

 

[Agulliver]

Loaded 8 exposures into a cassette and took some pics of my kittens. I developed at 20C in Ilford Microphen, usual inversion method for 8 minutes. Negs look nice if a little dense. Fomapan 400 needs 8:30 and I doubt it would look this dense with less development time but there's nothing in the way of edge markings, nothing in the rebate area at all. So Fomapan remains one possibility.

I am assuming that repurposed Kodak XX would have some edge markings. ALso the app I use on my phone suggests 9:15 in Microphen for Kodak Double X (either version) at 400ASA. What about repurposed Agfa film? Might it have no edge markings?

What I can report is that I was able to put a core/spindle in and load the film into a bulk loader without any issues. The film went through the camera and through the development process trouble free. Not that I was expecting any trouble, but it's good to know that I can actually use what I've bought.

 

[AnselMortensen]

What color was the used developer when you poured it out?
Foma/Arista EDU 400 usually makes for a pretty 'teal' color.

 

[koraks]

Foma/Arista EDU 400 usually makes for a pretty 'teal' color.

Not in 35mm. Only 120 and sheet film.

The way it halates and the longitudinal bend it seems to take does remind me of fomapan though. At what EI was this metered?

 

[Agulliver]

No colour change in the used developer, but as @koraks says that's to be expected with 35mm Fomapan. Metered at 400, using the camera's internal meter on one of my Praktica BX20S bodies with a CZJ 35-70 lens.

I'll scan the negs shortly and see if that produces any more clues. I've shot Fomapan 400 and the negs are not usually this dense, especially as I'd usually add another 30 seconds for Fomapan 400. But who knows, there are always imponderables. Not sure I've got anything happening soon that would suit 400ASA film.

It still could be almost anything as far as I'm concerned. But at least it works. What I can say is that I've never had anything known to be manufactured by Harman that had no edge markings. Nor Kodak.

 

[Agulliver]

These are scans...so not strictly analogue but might help people decide what this film is and if they'd like to try it.

I'm not wholly convinced it's Fomapan 400. I found it more grainy in 135, than whatever this is. But I am not ruling it out. These were just shots I rattled off this afternoon without great care.

 

[MattKing]

What I can say is that I've never had anything known to be manufactured by Harman that had no edge markings. Nor Kodak.

If either entity manufactured the film, but it was finished/confectioned by someone else, the edge marking would come from that latter party.

 

[pentaxuser]

Well whatever the film is, Agulliver ,the cats are clearly genuine high contrast b&w cats and excellent cats to boot

pentaxuser - a fellow cat lover

 

[Agulliver]

Well whatever the film is, Agulliver ,the cats are clearly genuine high contrast b&w cats and excellent cats to boot

pentaxuser - a fellow cat lover

Thank you. Given to me by an ex-girlfriend as her cat gave birth to them and my wife and I were the only people happy to take both brother and sister.

I don't think I've ever had that kind of contrast from Fomapan 400....but then I don't think I've developed Fomapan 400 in Microphen before - I was using ID-11 in the past.

 

[koraks]

I agree that the relatively unobtrusive grain and decent shadow detail don't immediately remind me of fomapan 400, but if these frames happened to have received sufficient exposure I still couldn't rule out this possibility.

In any case, if it works, is an attractive offers and remains on the market long enough to get some decent use out of it (it's no use having to switch from one film to another every few months because supply dries up), it doesn't matter all that much where it came from, does it?

 

[pentaxuser]

In any case, if it works, is an attractive offers and remains on the market long enough to get some decent use out of it (it's no use having to switch from one film to another every few months because supply dries up),

Yes that seems to be the problem these days. Nearly everything the e-bay seller in question in this thread sells is "new" film as in the definition "acquired film from sources that are not Kodak, Fuji or Ilford. It's great for YouTubers that make a living out of making videos of "testing" new films.

All sorts of stuff has now hit the markets from what may be limited sources but people will try it as it is different. If it vanishes in a couple of years or less then as long as there is something different every few months then the new film buying market doesn't seem care. In fact the demand may depend on there being new films every few months.

pentaxuser