DISCONTINUED KODAK (Chemistry products)

[hacked - sepiareverb]

Why support a discontinued product? This only kills the next one. Switch to a different developer now!

Perceptol here I come. Ilford likes us silver photographers, and our small change.

 

[Tim Gray]

I think Kodak likes us too. In the past couple years they've sent me 19 rolls of free film. All different types. Plus several rebates.

At first I was sad about the Kodak sepia toners going, because I want to try my hand at sepia toning. Then I realized I wanted to try thiocarbamide toners anyway, and the Kodak ones aren't that. It still stinks, but I'm guessing Champion wasn't make enough money on some of these products to continue to make them.

 

[Photo Engineer]

Because of the risks involved with the hydroxide PE?

Two reasons:

1. Thiourea is probably the most powerful fogging agent you may ever use in your lab aside from the Kodak fogging agent used in E-6 chemistry. So, you can get the dust on equipment and fog film.

2. Some people class thiourea as a carcinogen and/or a mutagen but this has not been clearly proven. Some states ban its use and therefore it is sold as "thiocarbamide" which is an alternate name.

PE

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Not sure, Ralph. I like how the highlights look with partial bleach back and thiocarbamide. Then there's an option of washing and using selenium as a second toner for added effect in midtones and shadows.

I like split toning, if it's done subtly and in moderation. Especially the highlights really come alive.

Thomas

You have that option. I frequently split tone, using direct polysulfide toners followed by selenium toning.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Perceptol here I come. Ilford likes us silver photographers, and our small change.

Exactly right!

 

[Tom Kershaw]

Two reasons:

1. Thiourea is probably the most powerful fogging agent you may ever use in your lab aside from the Kodak fogging agent used in E-6 chemistry. So, you can get the dust on equipment and fog film.

PE

My Agfa E6 kit fogging bath is based on Tin Chloride, is this the same as the Kodak product?

Tom

 

[Photo Engineer]

Stannous Chloride is used in E6 by all producers of the chemistry. This is different than E4.

PE

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

Perceptol here I come. Ilford likes us silver photographers, and our small change.

Perceptol is a fine product. If Delta 400 came in sheet sizes, I'd use Delta 400 at EI 200 in Perceptol all the time.

 

[hacked - sepiareverb]

Perceptol is a fine product. If Delta 400 came in sheet sizes, I'd use Delta 400 at EI 200 in Perceptol all the time.

Those were the days. I used to shoot the 810 Delta 400.

Microdol-X has been my go-to for pulling HP5+ to 50 for years. A few tests and Perceptol should cover my needs. Better name too.

 

[Christiaan Phleger]

Nah, anything with X in the name is A-OK in my book. I'm stocking up.

 

[Hal Reiser]

I'm not familiar with Sistan but have been looking for a preservative that does not involve toning. Can anyone give me information as to sources of supply?
Thanks
Hal

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

I've bought Sistan off the shelf at B&H. Freestyle may have it as well.

It is mainly designed for film and RC prints (Ctein recommended it strongly for the latter purpose). I wouldn't use it on FB prints, because of the surfactant, which I think may leave an undesirable film on fiber based prints.

 

[Ian Grant]

Something that's missed in all the posts is that many of the products are for B&W print processing/finishing and Kodak stopped manufacturing B&W papers some time ago now, so it makes no real sense for them as a company to keep making a full range of products when there are plenty of equivalents for nearly all the products.

Microdol-X wouldn't be a high volume developer in terms of sales and Xtol has largely replace D76 for a a developer for replenishment. These scale downs & discontinuances aren't new. You only need to see trade catalogues from Ilford & Kodak from the early 60's to realise the volumes have declined enormously over the last 50 years (approx). Iflford ID-11 (D76) was available in powder packaging to make from 300ml up to 5 gallons (UK Imp - 22.73 litres) with a wide range of sizes in between.

In practice there has never been such a wide variety of photo chemistry so easily available both in the UK, EU and US.

Ian

 

[RalphLambrecht]

I'm not familiar with Sistan but have been looking for a preservative that does not involve toning. Can anyone give me information as to sources of supply?
Thanks
Hal

Hal

Sistan is not a replacement for toning!

Sistan a silver-image stabilizer product. It contains potassium thiocyanate, which provides protection, in addition to toning, in two ways. First, it converts residual silver halides to inert silver complexes, and while remaining in the emulsion, it converts mobile silver ions, created by pollutants attacking the silver image, to stable silver thiocyanate during the print’s life. The resulting silver compounds are transparent, light insensitive and chemically resistant, thus protecting the image beyond toning.

Silver image stabilizers are applied in a brief bath after archival washing. After this treatment, the print is not to be washed again. The stabilizer solution remains in the emulsion ready to react with any oxidized silver to prevent discoloration. Silver image stabilizers are not a replacement for toning, but offer additional image protection.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

I've bought Sistan off the shelf at B&H. Freestyle may have it as well.

It is mainly designed for film and RC prints (Ctein recommended it strongly for the latter purpose). I wouldn't use it on FB prints, because of the surfactant, which I think may leave an undesirable film on fiber based prints.

David

Sistan is most useful with RC papers, but it also works perfectly fine with FB papers. See my other post on Sistan benefits. They apply to FB papers as well. There is no undesirable film left behind. It is totally absorbed by the emulsion, and it has a very useful side effect by making spotting so much easer, because it keeps the surface from repelling the spotting dye.

Nevertheless, it has to be squeegeed off the print, since puddles left behind can cause staining.

 

[Tim Gray]

No, from the list, XTOL 50L and 1L are discontinued in favor of the 5L package. And the 1L has been gone for years.

 

[clayne]

No, from the list, XTOL 50L and 1L are discontinued in favor of the 5L package. And the 1L has been gone for years.

Sigh. Thanks Tim. Ignore my specific ranting about XTOL and D-76 sizes. I, like others, simply read the chart wrong and went knee-jerk.

 

[JBrunner]

This just in:

http://www.photoformulary.com/images/Kodak discontinues chemistry-linked.pdf

 

[clayne]

This just in:

http://www.photoformulary.com/images/Kodak discontinues chemistry-linked.pdf

That's cool - but at the same time it kind of spreads misinformation in a way. Can't say I'm a fan of the presentation format - feels opportunistic.

 

[Photo Engineer]

I cannot see how this is "disinformation" Clayne. I also cannot see how it is opportunistic. Sounds smart to me. I'll bet most of you didn't know the range of their products. I didn't even know they did many of those.

Your reaction seems "knee jerk" to me.

PE

 

[clayne]

I cannot see how this is "disinformation" Clayne. I also cannot see how it is opportunistic. Sounds smart to me. I'll bet most of you didn't know the range of their products. I didn't even know they did many of those.

Your reaction seems "knee jerk" to me.

PE

Kodak is not discontinuing HCA or Indicator Stop-Bath - just specific sizes. The wording of the PF offer did not indicate sizes and instead makes it sound like one can't buy stop-bath from Kodak a few months from now - which isn't the case.

 

[Photo Engineer]

The main page gives the DR5 referenced PDF which has all of that information in it. It itself is linked to APUG directly so that an informed APUG user or a person entering the Formulary web page can go to the actual PDF and get the correct information. The Formulary is just listing (AFAIK) comparable or compatible products.

If you compare that to information content in this thread, wow. If you read this thread, Photo Flo 200 is being discontinued.

So, I give the Formulary a "pass" on this. They put all of the information out there, and then summarized it in the AD.

PE

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Jason

I watched some of your videos. They are very good!

 

[cowanw]

Good on the formulary for seeing opportunity where others see doom and gloom!
Now if only Kodak would discontinue their platinum/palladium products

 

[mgb74]

Sending out an email promoting their product when Kodak is discontinuing product/sizes is opportunistic. I hope every company offering b/w chemicals is equally opportunistic. Without that, analog photography will soon die. So I think that aspect is fine.

That said, the notice was a bit misleading. PF starts out with:

In an announcement sure to cause consternation among photographers fond of the smell of a “wet” darkroom, Kodak announced today that because of shrinking demand Kodak will no longer produce much of their black and white chemistry.

and then lists a number of chemicals. But click on the link (provided by PF) to Kodak's announcement and you find that the majority of these chemicals are not being discontinued, only discontinued in specific sizes. So I think they could have been more accurate in their announcement.