Beginner looking at simple large format cameras. (Box? Fixed lens?)

Lacock Abbey detail

A
Lacock Abbey detail

  • 0
  • 1
  • 21
Tyndall Bruce

A
Tyndall Bruce

  • 0
  • 0
  • 39
TEXTURES

A
TEXTURES

  • 4
  • 0
  • 65
Small Craft Club

A
Small Craft Club

  • 2
  • 0
  • 60
RED FILTER

A
RED FILTER

  • 1
  • 0
  • 51

Recent Classifieds

Forum statistics

Threads
198,905
Messages
2,782,826
Members
99,743
Latest member
HypnoRospo
Recent bookmarks
0

Donald Qualls

Subscriber
Joined
Jan 19, 2005
Messages
12,301
Location
North Carolina
Format
Multi Format
Large Format forum has specification charts for lenses. It has the image circle for each lens as well for comparison. That might help you.
https://www.largeformatphotography.info/lenses/

I didn't find an Angulon of any focal length shorter than 120 mm on that chart, nor on the linked one for "older lenses" -- but every other reference I've seen makes it appear the 90 mm f/6.8 Angulon covers 4x5 with no margin, but must be stopped down well to compensate for field curvature.
 
OP
OP

Candlejack

Member
Joined
Sep 2, 2021
Messages
228
Location
Louisiana
Format
Med. Format Pan
Are there ways to used certain cameras on a 4x5 to get vignetting and ye ol timey effects? Im guessing those would be ones without complete coverage.

Do the old brass latern lens fits the lens boards on graflex?
 

BrianShaw

Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2005
Messages
16,533
Location
La-la-land
Format
Multi Format
I didn't find an Angulon of any focal length shorter than 120 mm on that chart, nor on the linked one for "older lenses" -- but every other reference I've seen makes it appear the 90 mm f/6.8 Angulon covers 4x5 with no margin, but must be stopped down well to compensate for field curvature.
This is clipped from a 1937 Schneider brochure for their Angulon lens:
Angulon 1937.PNG
 

grat

Member
Joined
May 8, 2020
Messages
2,044
Location
Gainesville, FL
Format
Multi Format
According to the Schneider wayback, the f/6.8 90mm angulon covers 154mm @ f/16.

So just a hair short of the 162mm required for 4x5.
 

grat

Member
Joined
May 8, 2020
Messages
2,044
Location
Gainesville, FL
Format
Multi Format
Are there ways to used certain cameras on a 4x5 to get vignetting and ye ol timey effects? Im guessing those would be ones without complete coverage.

Do the old brass latern lens fits the lens boards on graflex?

Sort of-- which is to say, they can be mounted on a board that will fit on a graflex (usually). The problem is the shutter-- or the lack of one.

Speed Graphics have a focal plane shutter that makes older barrel lenses easier to use.
 

Donald Qualls

Subscriber
Joined
Jan 19, 2005
Messages
12,301
Location
North Carolina
Format
Multi Format
@BrianShaw Okay, so 7 1/6 inch is about 179.4 mm -- which is almost half an inch bigger than the 4x5 diagonal.
 

Donald Qualls

Subscriber
Joined
Jan 19, 2005
Messages
12,301
Location
North Carolina
Format
Multi Format
According to the Schneider wayback, the f/6.8 90mm angulon covers 154mm @ f/16.

Typical -- even Schneider can't decide what the coverage is.
 

Dan Fromm

Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2005
Messages
6,823
Format
Multi Format
Are there ways to used certain cameras on a 4x5 to get vignetting and ye ol timey effects? Im guessing those would be ones without complete coverage.

Do the old brass latern lens fits the lens boards on graflex?

Vignetting? Practice lens abuse, use a lens that won't cover the format.

"ye ol timey effects?" Futz around with film and processing, try aging b/w prints artificially. Old lenses won't do.

"graflex?" Graflex Inc.'s, also predecessors' and successors', nomenclature confuses everyone. To avoid passing the confusion on, please say "Graphic" when you mean a press camera made by Graflex and say "Graflex" when you mean a SLR mabe by Graflex.

With enough money and effort, nearly any plausible lens can be mounted on a Graphic lens board. Putting any old lens on a Graflex isn't always possible. Too short a focal length and the lens won't clear the mirror, too long a focal length can't be focused to infinity.
 

BrianShaw

Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2005
Messages
16,533
Location
La-la-land
Format
Multi Format
Vignetting? Practice lens abuse, use a lens that won't cover the format.

"ye ol timey effects?" Futz around with film and processing, try aging b/w prints artificially. Old lenses won't do.

"graflex?" Graflex Inc.'s, also predecessors' and successors', nomenclature confuses everyone. To avoid passing the confusion on, please say "Graphic" when you mean a press camera made by Graflex and say "Graflex" when you mean a SLR mabe by Graflex.

With enough money and effort, nearly any plausible lens can be mounted on a Graphic lens board. Putting any old lens on a Graflex isn't always possible. Too short a focal length and the lens won't clear the mirror, too long a focal length can't be focused to infinity.
Since you've been blocked (ignored, I suppose he/she meant) by the OP, Dan, I'll quote you since this is all great advise that really needs to be readed and heeded!
 

Donald Qualls

Subscriber
Joined
Jan 19, 2005
Messages
12,301
Location
North Carolina
Format
Multi Format
I think I see what's happening -- there are significant differences in the coverage, build quality, and image quality of the 90/6.8 Angulon over its production run of 35+ years, from pre-War to the 1970s.
 

BrianShaw

Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2005
Messages
16,533
Location
La-la-land
Format
Multi Format
I think I see what's happening -- there are significant differences in the coverage, build quality, and image quality of the 90/6.8 Angulon over its production run of 35+ years, from pre-War to the 1970s.
… and quite varied expectations of performance over the years, many associated with usage context changes.
 

GKC

Member
Joined
Dec 12, 2012
Messages
222
Location
Fresno, wher
Format
Large Format
The GRAPHICS are utilitarian professional cameras that offer all of the functionality required for basic LF photography.

Other cameras offer different, or additional, functionality that serve other LF needs.
A decent Crown Graphic would be like shooting a Leica compared to a box camera and can certainly handle most of the jobs your asking of it..
Prices still aren't too bad f you shop around
Time to get off the porch and run with the big dogs!
iu
 

MattKing

Moderator
Moderator
Joined
Apr 24, 2005
Messages
53,008
Location
Delta, BC Canada
Format
Medium Format

Pioneer

Member
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
3,879
Location
Elko, Nevada
Format
Multi Format
I have been using a Schneider Angulon 90/6.8 for several years on 4x5. It will be shocked to learn it can't cover the format.
Angulon-90-Example.jpg
 
OP
OP

Candlejack

Member
Joined
Sep 2, 2021
Messages
228
Location
Louisiana
Format
Med. Format Pan
A decent Crown Graphic would be like shooting a Leica compared to a box camera and can certainly handle most of the jobs your asking of it..
Prices still aren't too bad f you shop around
Time to get off the porch and run with the big dogs!
iu

Someone on here offered me a crown to buy. It should be here thursday!!

Now to find a hat!
 

Mick Fagan

Subscriber
Joined
Sep 13, 2005
Messages
4,421
Location
Melbourne Au
Format
Multi Format
I have been using a Schneider Angulon 90/6.8 for several years on 4x5. It will be shocked to learn it can't cover the format.
View attachment 288041

I'm complete agreement with Dan on this.

I have a roughly 1952 build Angulon f/6.8/90 Linhof version in a Synchro-Compur shutter mounted onto a Linhof Technika recessed board.

As Bob S has mentioned earlier on in this thread, it is designed for the 9x12cm format, but it does manage to cover the 4x5" format.

I've used this 90mm lens for my 4x5" photography for around 14 years, apart from having little to no room for movements, it has always performed very well. I have since replaced it, but it is kept for the times when I need an absolute light weight kit for my ever decreasing backpacking trips.

For a box camera construction with no movement, this lens would certainly work and from my experience, work very well. They are certainly affordable, especially in the USA.
 

Donald Qualls

Subscriber
Joined
Jan 19, 2005
Messages
12,301
Location
North Carolina
Format
Multi Format
Now to find a hat!

BTW, it doesn't have to be a Weegee style fedora -- a Walter White pattern porkpie will work, too. I'd tend to avoid the ten gallon Stetsons, however -- they might get in frame with a 90mm on 4x5...
 

removed account4

Subscriber
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Messages
29,832
Format
Hybrid
BTW, it doesn't have to be a Weegee style fedora -- a Walter White pattern porkpie will work, too. I'd tend to avoid the ten gallon Stetsons, however -- they might get in frame with a 90mm on 4x5...
yea. but you wouldn't need a dark cloth if you were wearing a 10 gallon!
 

Donald Qualls

Subscriber
Joined
Jan 19, 2005
Messages
12,301
Location
North Carolina
Format
Multi Format
yea. but you wouldn't need a dark cloth if you were wearing a 10 gallon!

With a 90mm on a Speed, you'd just calibrate the RF and not even need the ground glass.
 

grat

Member
Joined
May 8, 2020
Messages
2,044
Location
Gainesville, FL
Format
Multi Format
My statement of 162mm is based on the actual size of the film being 4x5" (or ~ 102mm x 127mm). But that ignores the frame of the film holder.

Since a typical 4x5 holder has a "window" of 96.8mm x 120.4mm (at least mine does), the actual diagonal if you want to be really picky is:

(96.82 + 120.42)1/2 = ~ 154.5mm

Given that it's a 1.25 aspect ratio, that means that yes, the 154mm image circle will cover the entire exposed area of a 4x5 sheet of film. Give or take a few photons.

... interestingly, the Grafmatic loses 1mm compared to a Fidelity on the short axis, but is several mm longer on the long axis-- meaning it's diagonal is slightly larger. It also means that you don't really lose any space to the number wheel.
 
Photrio.com contains affiliate links to products. We may receive a commission for purchases made through these links.
To read our full affiliate disclosure statement please click Here.

PHOTRIO PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Ilford ADOX Freestyle Photographic Stearman Press Weldon Color Lab Blue Moon Camera & Machine
Top Bottom