B&H Lists XTOl (5L) as Discontinued

[OrientPoint]

I wish Kodak would publish the formulas for their developers, now that they're all gone. I'd love to be able to mix my own Technidol (which is long-gone) or TMAX developer (which I guess is now-gone). I am not holding my breath that that will ever happen though.

 

[braxus]

I noticed Xtol was gone over a week ago from B&H when it was removed from an order I had pending. It was listed as discontinued then. But I figured it was because stock is getting thin out there and we already know Sino Promise is basically out of business. I saw Freestyle had some, but I need to wait to put an order through with them. I will use up what I have and then switch to Adox XT-3. Assuming XT-3 doesnt become hard to get here in North America. I do have a few bags of Xtol, so that should last me a while. I do want to stock up on a few more before its completely gone though.

 

[braxus]

I just placed an order for Xtol from Freestyle and called them right after the order. They still list Xtol in stock with them. Phoning them, they said they finally got their last order from Kodak for this chemical and have about 430 bags in stock left. That wont last if more people get wind this is discontinued. I ordered 5 bags for myself, so with what I have and the new order, I should have enough for a few years. I also got one of their developing reels for my Patterson I was wanting for a while now. They also talked to me about substitues and I will be switching to XT3 at some point.

 

[John Wiegerink]

I wish Kodak would publish the formulas for their developers, now that they're all gone. I'd love to be able to mix my own Technidol (which is long-gone) or TMAX developer (which I guess is now-gone). I am not holding my breath that that will ever happen though.

Don't hold your breath. Especially with anything Kodak. I'm still waiting for the release of Paterson formula for Auctol film developer and Edwal's FG-7. I'm pretty sure I'll be dead and gone before any of those formula are release.

 

[Tom Taylor]

There is a formula for "Mytol" published in the Darkroom Cookbook which is described as being "similar to Kodak XTOL." I'm going to try it once my supply of Xtol is depleted.

 

[John Wiegerink]

There is a formula for "Mytol" published in the Darkroom Cookbook which is described as being "similar to Kodak XTOL." I'm going to try it once my supply of Xtol is depleted.

I made and tried "Mytol" and it works just fine, but it doesn't keep as long as my Xtol-R does, and using Xtol replenished is just so easy and convenient.

 

[Duceman]

...they said they finally got their last order from Kodak for this chemical and have about 430 bags in stock left.

425 now.

 

[Duceman]

There's the patent formula, which I have tried and I am very pleased with. It would be very hard to make a proper comparison between the patent formula and the actual product, but in my experience it works flawlessly and gives results that one would expect from Xtol. I have used the development times proposed in the Xtol datasheet and they work fine. I have even reused the developer and extended times according to the instructions, getting excellent results.

So, it's certainly anything but meaningless.

I've looked at that patent (have it saved on my computer somewheres) and was thinking that it wouldn't be all that hard to make on one's own. Though, I have not yet tried it. But your post above got me to thinking... if/when it does run out, I wonder if it would be a good little side business to be making XTOL-clone kits? Most of the ingredients are quite stable (from what I recall), so buying in bulk, then mixing and shipping the kits shouldn't be all the difficult.

 

[Paul Howell]

There is a chance that Kodak A will find new supplier.

 

[MattKing]

Sino Promise owns the business, including some form of license to use the Kodak name for the chemicals.. So they are the ones that will either have to sell the business, or find some way to re-start production and distribution.
The cessation may not have anything to do with production issues - it might be entirely related to distribution.

 

[Tim Stapp]

I used the last of my Xtol-R a few months back and switched to Adox XT-3 because I saw the handwriting on the wall. I'm very satisfied with XT-3 and actually like it better, but that's just my opinion.

Just curious, what do you like better about the XT-3? I've been vaccillating between that and Eco-Pro when last of my XTOL is gone.

 

[SodaAnt]

Determining the formula for a developer isn't rocket science. A company (like Ilford) with a well-equipped analytical chemistry lab could do it.

Some of the constituents, however, might be impossible to obtain or difficult to make.

 

[Peter Schrager]

Just curious, what do you like better about the XT-3? I've been vaccillating between that and Eco-Pro when last of my XTOL is gone.

XT3 is expensive and I only use xtol at 1+2 $20/5 liter bag...plus it's not available
Eco-Pro works fine
you might just have to recalculate some of your developing times a bit.
we just have to get used to what's happening in the industry. happy for the remaining companies and their products. same was/is happening with film. Kodak is making color film for Fuji. Ilford makes Across for Fuji. seems it's the new normal. I suspect there will be Kodak branded chemicals again.

 

[John Wiegerink]

Just curious, what do you like better about the XT-3? I've been vaccillating between that and Eco-Pro when last of my XTOL is gone.

It mixes like a dream, compare to Xtol.

 

[Craig]

Determining the formula for a developer isn't rocket science. A company (like Ilford) with a well-equipped analytical chemistry lab could do it.

I gather that ascorbate type developers have been known since the 60's the problem was their active life was measured in hours once mixed. Kodak solved that problem with Xtol and it is a long lasting developer, like D76 and others.

I understand it took Adox a number of years to reverse engineer and verify the solution to the stability problem, and with Adox marketing an Xtol clone it probably isn't worth using Ilfords limited resources on that project. Probably best outcome would be for Ilford to have Adox make it under contract for them and distribute as an Ilford branded product.

 

[Steven Lee]

Just curious, what do you like better about the XT-3? I've been vaccillating between that and Eco-Pro when last of my XTOL is gone.

You can find an older post by @Henning Serger who extensively tested XT-3 and compared it to Xtol. The 3 advantages I remember from his report were:

• Slightly finer grain and higher sharpness than Xtol at 1+1 with T-grain films
• Easier to dissolve
• Less toxic

If we assume that Eco Pro is a straight Xtol clone, then these XT-3 advantages extend to Eco Pro as well. My biggest problem with Eco Pro is that it's made by an anonymous entity hidden behind a store/reseller brand. I am just not interested living in the world where makers are anonymous. The brand printed on a product box should also live on a website and hang on a physical building one can walk into and meet the CEO.

 

[Tim Stapp]

Where is everyone buying the XT-3? Freestyle shows out of stock on both the 1l and 5l. B&H or Adorama don't list it.

 

[Craig]

Where is everyone buying the XT-3? Freestyle shows out of stock on both the 1l and 5l. B&H or Adorama don't list it.

ADOX XT-3 Developer to mix 5000 ml - fotoimpex.com analogue photography

Well balanced film developer based on ascorbic acid yielding full box speed negatives with high sharpness and very fine grain. Hydroquinone-free and without boric acid ...

www.fotoimpex.com

ADOX XT-3 Developer to mix 1000 ml - fotoimpex.com analogue photography

Well balanced film developer based on ascorbic acid yielding full box speed negatives with high sharpness and very fine grain. Hydroquinone-free and without boric acid ...

www.fotoimpex.com

 

[Tim Stapp]

ADOX XT-3 Developer to mix 5000 ml - fotoimpex.com analogue photography

Well balanced film developer based on ascorbic acid yielding full box speed negatives with high sharpness and very fine grain. Hydroquinone-free and without boric acid ...

www.fotoimpex.com

ADOX XT-3 Developer to mix 1000 ml - fotoimpex.com analogue photography

Well balanced film developer based on ascorbic acid yielding full box speed negatives with high sharpness and very fine grain. Hydroquinone-free and without boric acid ...

www.fotoimpex.com

Have you purchased through fotoimpex? If so, what were the freight charges? I realize that you are in Canada and I'm in the USA.

 

[Craig]

I have. You can add things to the cart and it will show the freight. I did an order of about 300 euros worth of film, paper and chemistry and the freight was about 35 euro. I found that the initial charge was high, but I could add quite a few items and that didn't change the shipping. There were in the process of changing shipping to the US, so it might be different now from last summer.

I picked up some of the Euro sized Ilford paper that isn't stocked here, like 9.5x12 and 12x16. I found the prices very competitive with what I can buy Ilford for on this side of the Atlantic.

 

[Tim Stapp]

I have. You can add things to the cart and it will show the freight. I did an order of about 300 euros worth of film, paper and chemistry and the freight was about 35 euro. I found that the initial charge was high, but I could add quite a few items and that didn't change the shipping. There were in the process of changing shipping to the US, so it might be different now from last summer.

I picked up some of the Euro sized Ilford paper that isn't stocked here, like 9.5x12 and 12x16. I found the prices very competitive with what I can buy Ilford for on this side of the Atlantic.

Thanks!

 

[Anon Ymous]

I've looked at that patent (have it saved on my computer somewheres) and was thinking that it wouldn't be all that hard to make on one's own. Though, I have not yet tried it. But your post above got me to thinking... if/when it does run out, I wonder if it would be a good little side business to be making XTOL-clone kits? Most of the ingredients are quite stable (from what I recall), so buying in bulk, then mixing and shipping the kits shouldn't be all the difficult.

Meh, no side business for an individual. There are already Xtol clones out there and you'll have a hard time finding DTPA-5Na in solid form. Even the solution is rather hard to find. But making your own when needed and at the quantity needed? Sure, why not?

 

[mshchem]

SinoPromise could sell the rights to manufacture and distribute to someone. Not sure it's worth anything anymore.

 

[Henning Serger]

You can find an older post by @Henning Serger who extensively tested XT-3 and compared it to Xtol.

Steven, thank you very much for mentioning my test results.
For all who are interested in it, here it is:

ADOX XT-3 Developer: Further and Final Test Results

Dear photrio-members, as some of you may remember, some months ago I have reported about my ADOX XT-3 test results. Since then I have done several further very detailed tests with the currently available, final XT-3 version with CAPTURA. In total I have done so much intensive/detailed tests...

www.photrio.com

If we assume that Eco Pro is a straight Xtol clone, then these XT-3 advantages extend to Eco Pro as well.

I would be very cautious with such a conclusion. Because ADOX has indeed put quite a lot of effort and additional R&D in its XT-3.

My biggest problem with Eco Pro is that it's made by an anonymous entity hidden behind a store/reseller brand. I am just not interested living in the world where makers are anonymous. The brand printed on a product box should also live on a website and hang on a physical building one can walk into and meet the CEO.

That is completely understandable.
I also much prefer buying from companies I know, which are transparent and communicate with me as a customer in an honest way.
And all that is the case with ADOX.

Best regards,
Henning

 

[Henning Serger]

I have. You can add things to the cart and it will show the freight. I did an order of about 300 euros worth of film, paper and chemistry and the freight was about 35 euro. I found that the initial charge was high, but I could add quite a few items and that didn't change the shipping. There were in the process of changing shipping to the US, so it might be different now from last summer.

It is indeed a bit different now - it is improved. DHL Express can now be used and the shipping times are much much faster now, about 2-5 days (2-3 days for locations on the east coast, and up to 5 days for the west coast).

Best regards,
Henning