Are there any film recorders that do not require software?

Discussion in 'Digital Negatives' started by jsmoove, Dec 5, 2017.

  1. jsmoove

    jsmoove Member

    Messages:
    42
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2017
    Location:
    Ottawa
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Im looking into getting a film recorder (a thing that outputs a digital image onto film) for a personal project.
    However alot of the old film recorders required software that is no longer usable with current tech, or is just too hard to acquire/too costly.
    I know of only two analog film recorders, one being the first polaroid palette film recorder, and the polaroid freeze frame.
    Both of these however are really low quality 640x480.
    The freeze frame used NTSC, so you could essentially connect a computer monitor and go from there.
    Does anyone know of any others that were released at the time that do not require software and might have a higher resolution than 640x480?
    Thanks!
     
  2. darkroommike

    darkroommike Subscriber

    Messages:
    1,169
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2007
    Location:
    Iowa
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Nope and the icing on this cake is that a lot of these old recorders use vintage interfaces as well. SCSI is not too bad to still use, Firewire is not too bad either but some of these units used the HP instrumentation bus or other antique tech, no current compatible hardware, not drivers, nothing, nada. There are still some film recorders made for the graphic arts so if B&W output is OK you might succeed. AGFA made image recorders, too. And neither Polaroid or AGFA is around. Look also into LVT, LaserGraphics, Durst, etc.
     
  3. ozphoto

    ozphoto Subscriber

    Messages:
    1,546
    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2006
    Location:
    Bangkok, Thailand
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Groups:
    Ahh yes - I remember having to use one of these for a project, think it was an Agfa model.

    FWIW, I still use an old Agfascan (SCSI) on a newer (old) Windows PC and it works perfectly (had to transfer from an even older PC!!) - you might get lucky, as the software for the Duoscan 1200 is still floating around in cyberspace (as was the driver for the SCSI card); whether that translates to a film recorder having software floating out there too is another matter.

    Good luck!
     
  4. OP
    OP
    jsmoove

    jsmoove Member

    Messages:
    42
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2017
    Location:
    Ottawa
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Hey thanks for the response. Did analog film recorders still use software though? At least with the polaroid freeze frame, you'd be taking it right from NTSC or maybe VGA as far as I am aware. Just black and white would work for me. Yeah the lvt is pretty pricey.....I'm looking to do this just as a hobby project haha. The problem with the Freeze Frame is that the CRT is tiny, so its only 640x480 resolution.
     
  5. OP
    OP
    jsmoove

    jsmoove Member

    Messages:
    42
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2017
    Location:
    Ottawa
    Shooter:
    35mm
    @ozphoto agfascan....never heard of it! This is a scanner right?
     
  6. AgX

    AgX Member

    Messages:
    16,380
    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2007
    Location:
    Germany
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Agfa made a lot of apparatus for the graphic world, plus the whole inventory for indústrial photolabs. Both is hardly known, as hardly as these machines are around on the market.
     
  7. Craig75

    Craig75 Member

    Messages:
    530
    Joined:
    May 9, 2016
    Location:
    Uk
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Ilford /harmanlabs offer digital files to rc silver geletin paper prints which might be an avenue
     
  8. Craig75

    Craig75 Member

    Messages:
    530
    Joined:
    May 9, 2016
    Location:
    Uk
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Oh i misread and thought you just wanted a single frame. Ignore me!
     
  9. OP
    OP
    jsmoove

    jsmoove Member

    Messages:
    42
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2017
    Location:
    Ottawa
    Shooter:
    35mm
    I suppose a better question is.....what film recorders are available that are under $500 and are able to be set up with available software on a modern computer?
     
  10. OP
    OP
    jsmoove

    jsmoove Member

    Messages:
    42
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2017
    Location:
    Ottawa
    Shooter:
    35mm
  11. Craig75

    Craig75 Member

    Messages:
    530
    Joined:
    May 9, 2016
    Location:
    Uk
    Shooter:
    35mm
  12. OP
    OP
    jsmoove

    jsmoove Member

    Messages:
    42
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2017
    Location:
    Ottawa
    Shooter:
    35mm
    @Craig75 How does this work exactly? Is there an affordable machine that can do this for the layperson?
     
  13. Craig75

    Craig75 Member

    Messages:
    530
    Joined:
    May 9, 2016
    Location:
    Uk
    Shooter:
    35mm
  14. Sponsored Ad
  15. Kino

    Kino Subscriber

    Messages:
    2,092
    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2006
    Location:
    Virginia
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    None that I am aware of...

    I struggled for about a year to bring back up a Solitaire 8K film recorder that had 35mm, 4x5 and 8x10 heads, but was defeated by the ancient HP-IB parallel interface and the requirement for a custom RIP (Raster Imaging Program) that still cost in the $20K region, despite it's obsolescence. I did find the HP-IB card and cables, but a the man who sill owned the software rights to the RIP (and who claimed that he hadn't sold a copy in 10 years when I contacted him), refused to budge a penny from his $20K price tag.

    Wound up sitting out on the curb for a scrapper...
     
  16. ozphoto

    ozphoto Subscriber

    Messages:
    1,546
    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2006
    Location:
    Bangkok, Thailand
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Groups:
    Yes, it is. Used one in college and when I had the chance to grab one from a photographer in Melbourne, I snapped it up.
    It's an oldie but a goodie - scans from 35mm up to 5x4 plus it's a flatbed as well.

    https://creativepro.com/agfa-duoscan-series/
     
  17. calebarchie

    calebarchie Member

    Messages:
    294
    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2014
    Shooter:
    35mm
    What is the end goal or requirement for this personal project? That would help to know, you may not even require a recorder.

    Bests
    C
     
  18. David A. Goldfarb

    David A. Goldfarb Moderator Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    18,618
    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2002
    Location:
    Honolulu, Ha
    Shooter:
    Large Format
    Moved thread from the Analog/Misc Equipment subforum to the Hybrid/Digital Negatives subforum.

    Anything involving combining digital and traditional workflow should be in the Hybrid Workflow area.
     
  19. Ian Grant

    Ian Grant Subscriber

    Messages:
    19,669
    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2004
    Location:
    West Midland
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Bob Carnie in Toronto uses a Lambda machine to make film negatives from Digital files. There's also David Wood who's DR5 company offers film recording.

    Gone are the days when film recorders were easy to find second hand or even new, now anything left is specialist. I nearly bought one 12 years ago but have hardly seen any since and as pointed out above they use obsolete technologies.

    Ian
     
  20. Craig75

    Craig75 Member

    Messages:
    530
    Joined:
    May 9, 2016
    Location:
    Uk
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Would printing a digital file as a negative onto acetate / overhead projection paper to contact print onto photographic paper be an option? That would be cheapest and simplest option
     
  21. Chan Tran

    Chan Tran Member

    Messages:
    3,195
    Joined:
    May 10, 2006
    Location:
    Aurora, IL
    Shooter:
    35mm
    How good would the slides be if you just copy the image displayed on a 4K monitor?
     
  22. Ian Grant

    Ian Grant Subscriber

    Messages:
    19,669
    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2004
    Location:
    West Midland
    Shooter:
    Multi Format

    That's a common practice for making negatives for Platinum/Palladium prints and other Alternative processes and gives high quality results.


    Not that good as the screen resolution is not as high as you think.

    Ian
     
  23. Craig75

    Craig75 Member

    Messages:
    530
    Joined:
    May 9, 2016
    Location:
    Uk
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Yes, I did a few whenever Dan Burkholder's book came out (2002?) using one of those home office printer/scanners onto silver gelatin and even with that terrible set up from so long ago the quality was pretty good and photo tech has gone ballistic since then so I'd imagine quality now is amazing.

    Not knowing exactly what Op's project is, but this would seem cheapest route and should give some very fine results I'd have thought.
     
  24. OP
    OP
    jsmoove

    jsmoove Member

    Messages:
    42
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2017
    Location:
    Ottawa
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Hi everyone...the goal of the project is to store barcodes on film, so the more barcodes I can get the better. A film recorder would be ideal...but Im open to other ideas. Best resolution for cost is my #1 goal
     
  25. Craig75

    Craig75 Member

    Messages:
    530
    Joined:
    May 9, 2016
    Location:
    Uk
    Shooter:
    35mm
    cant just print them out and photograph them?
     
  26. OP
    OP
    jsmoove

    jsmoove Member

    Messages:
    42
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2017
    Location:
    Ottawa
    Shooter:
    35mm
    @Craig75 Hey, yeah I tried that with my 35mm...similar fashion to a microfilm planetary camera. Maybe I didnt have it sturdy enough though. The quality didnt turn out too good...probably because I didnt have enough light.
     
,