Adox HR-50 developed in Caffenol LC+C looks like London fog?

[John Wiegerink]

Great light though for a contrasty film .

Yes, you're right Matt, but when I did the Rodinal testing it was partly cloudy with breaks of some sun. I waited for the clouds to beak and was shooting an old one room schoolhouse with white lapboard siding. I really would like the lighting to be as close to that as possible for FX-39II. I'm going to cut the roll in three sections and develop in FX-39II, Rodinal 1+25 and diluted Perceptol 1+3 to see how they all compare, but probably not until the weather clears on Friday.

 

[250swb]

But how do you know that the results with Rodinal aren't as good as those with the developers you mentioned? I mean, have you seen any comparative results?

What I said was 'I don't automatically associate Rodinal with that type of film (a copy film)', which in no way implies Rodinal isn't as good as anything else in somebody else's eyes or imply that I've used it. But HR-50 is marketed as a fine grain film, and Rodinal is not a fine grain developer, it is a high acutance developer, hence my not automatically associating it with HR-50. That it can be developed in Rodinal is neither here nor there, presumably Adox do not recommend Rodinal because it isn't as suited to fine grain as something like FX-39. Often times common sense can lead to a conclusion without having to test everything.

 

[Raghu Kuvempunagar]

presumably Adox do not recommend Rodinal because it isn't as suited to fine grain as something like FX-39. .

Apparently Rodinal gives fine grain with some Agfa films and TMax 100. That goes against commonsense. I've not tried those combinations but @Ian Grant has time and again written about this.

Anyway I'm looking forward to the data point that John will provide hopefully soon on Rodinal vs FX39.

 

[John Wiegerink]

Apparently Rodinal gives fine grain with some Agfa films and TMax 100. That goes against commonsense. I've not tried those combinations but @Ian Grant has time and again written about this.

Anyway I'm looking forward to the data point that John will provide hopefully soon on Rodinal vs FX39.

Still waiting for just a little brighter weather here in snowy Dullsville, Michigan. I want to through this question out there..........has anybody had what they think are great results using Pyrocat-HD(C) with HR-50? I was going to cut this 36exp roll in three sections, but now think I might go with four sections. One section for Rodinal 1+25, one for FX-39II, one for Perceptol and the last for one of my favorite developers, Pyrocat-HDC. I'm going to take pictures of the same white lap sided school house and bracket every three shot -1, N and +1 for the whole roll to keep things consistent as possible with exposure. My Contax G1 is very good for accurate shutter speeds and does auto-bracketing in half stops and full stops. I'll meter with a Pentax digital spot meter and set the camera up manually. That should eliminate almost all variables on the exposure end of this.

 

[John Wiegerink]

What I said was 'I don't automatically associate Rodinal with that type of film (a copy film)', which in no way implies Rodinal isn't as good as anything else in somebody else's eyes or imply that I've used it. But HR-50 is marketed as a fine grain film, and Rodinal is not a fine grain developer, it is a high acutance developer, hence my not automatically associating it with HR-50. That it can be developed in Rodinal is neither here nor there, presumably Adox do not recommend Rodinal because it isn't as suited to fine grain as something like FX-39. Often times common sense can lead to a conclusion without having to test everything.

I really wouldn't call FX-39II a "fine grain" developer. With films like Tmax 100, HR-50 and other slower speed, fine grained films it actually helps to have a developer that is not a fine grained solvent type developer. I even see it with Ilford FP4+ when I use it in a larger format. I just like to see a little bite to the print. When I wet printed the Rodinal 1+25 negatives I printed on 8X10 paper, but set the enlarger to print 16X20 size. I saw absolutely no problem with grain in the sky or lap siding of the white school house that was the subject. I thought that was pretty darn good, to me anyway.

 

[psmithp]

I double checked the recipe for Caffenol C-H and it is indeed 16g of Vita-C (ascorbic acid). I did find two varieties of
Caffenol C-H. One is regular with KBr and the other is the UK version with iodized table salt to replace KBr with a common, easy to get, household item.

Have you checked that the iodized table salt has iodine enough to have any effect?

 

[John Wiegerink]

Have you checked that the iodized table salt has iodine enough to have any effect?

It might not, but why take a chance when a pound of pickling salt is so very cheap.

 

[npl]

About the effect of iodized salt on staining :

Roll of fomapan 100 cut in two strips
- On the left the part developped in HC-110 (h)
- On the right the end of the roll developped in caffenol C-H (rs) with 10g/L of iodized salt instead of Kbr. Package says 15 to 20 mg/kg of sodium iodide.

 

[John Wiegerink]

About the effect of iodized salt on staining :
View attachment 421059
Roll of fomapan 100 cut in two strips
- On the left the part developped in HC-110 (h)
- On the right the end of the roll developped in caffenol C-H (rs) with 10g/L of iodized salt instead of Kbr. Package says 15 to 20 mg/kg of sodium iodide.

So the one on the right is with just plain olde table salt added? Sure don't see any difference from my monitor. I'll still use pickling salt since I have a large amount of it in the cupboard.

 

[npl]

So the one on the right is with just plain olde table salt added? Sure don't see any difference from my monitor. I'll still use pickling salt since I have a large amount of it in the cupboard.

Yes, ubiquitous brand of iodized table salt found over here

 

[John Wiegerink]

Yes, ubiquitous brand of iodized table salt found over here
View attachment 421060

Well, it sure seems to work just fine from what I can see. Did you check the negative under magnification to see if there was a marked difference in grain structure or edge sharpness between the two halves? No big deal, just curious.

 

[npl]

Well, it sure seems to work just fine from what I can see. Did you check the negative under magnification to see if there was a marked difference in grain structure or edge sharpness between the two halves? No big deal, just curious.

I'll check with my "magnifying glass" which will be a 50mm lens if there's noticeable difference in grain, but this was a first shot at finding a good developing time for both HC-110 (h) and caffenol C-H (rs) with my usual film (fomapan 100) shot at box speed. I don't exactly start from 0 with both developer so the density is somewhat similar in both strips but I can do better. I plan in the near future to shoot the same scene in the same light with a tripod for a whole roll and get to as close as I can to the same density between frames developped in HC-110 and caffenol. Then I'll have much better data to compare.

But right of the batt fomapan 100 @100 developped for 9min in CC-H (rs) using the standard Ilford agitation and with ten time the amount of iodized salt instead of Kbr works just fine. Full recipe is :

500ml water room temp
20g anydrous sodium carbonate
8g ascorbic acid
5g iodized salt
20g instant coffee

Add ingredient in order. Coffee need a little time to dissolve, let if sit after mixing for a few minutes. Be aware that the T° will rise after adding the ascorbic acid (or was it the carbonate ?). PH should be around 9.5

 

[John Wiegerink]

I'll check with my "magnifying glass" which will be a 50mm lens if there's noticeable difference in grain, but this was a first shot at finding a good developing time for both HC-110 (h) and caffenol C-H (rs) with my usual film (fomapan 100) shot at box speed. I don't exactly start from 0 with both developer so the density is somewhat similar in both strips but I can do better. I plan in the near future to shoot the same scene in the same light with a tripod for a whole roll and get to as close as I can to the same density between frames developped in HC-110 and caffenol. Then I'll have much better data to compare.

But right of the batt fomapan 100 @100 developped for 9min in CC-H (rs) using the standard Ilford agitation and with ten time the amount of iodized salt instead of Kbr works just fine. Full recipe is :

500ml water room temp
20g anydrous sodium carbonate
8g ascorbic acid
5g iodized salt
20g instant coffee

Add ingredient in order. Coffee need a little time to dissolve, let if sit after mixing for a few minutes. Be aware that the T° will rise after adding the ascorbic acid (or was it the carbonate ?). PH should be around 9.5

View attachment 421077

View attachment 421079

You probably won't see much difference if any. That tree trunk shot is very nice!