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You may be a photographer but are you an artist?

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Ces1um said:
The only thing keeping a knowledgeable (in the ways of plumbing) person from calling themselves a plumber are legal restrictions imposed by the trade. No such legal restrictions exist for most artistic trades. Again, if you create art and as you've said, others would qualify your work as art, then feel free to call yourself an artist.
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Can I also feel free to NOT call myself an artist?
 
darkroommike said:
Can I also feel free to NOT call myself an artist?
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Of course.
But I wouldn't suggest arguing if a bunch of people see what you do and then want to call you an artist.
Now if someone wants to call me a plumber, I would definitely protest!
 
darkroommike said:
I'm a well driller's son and do my own plumbing but I don't call myself a plumber either.
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I packed mules for ten seasons (May thru Oct) for the US Forest Service. I had my share of wreaks, which in packers' lore means I am a mule packer. But I do not call myself a mule packer, I just packed mules. I just feel that I never gained a sufficient skill and experience level -- in relation to those who are 'real' packers -- to justify it. It was just a job (that I loved) and I do not think I have been on a horse, nor want to be on one, in the over 25 years since I last packed a mule.

Actually -- pretty silly of me, I suppose. If someone called me a packer, I would not argue about it.

If someone with much less experience than I wants to call themselves a packer, that is fine with me, too (as long as they have had a wreak or two -- a traditional right-of-passage). So if someone wants to not call themselves an artist, that's cool with me...as long as they do not try to extend their personal definition of an artist to others and deny or critize someone else who wants to call themselves an artist.
 
In my mind, making a big deal about not calling yourself an artist is more an of affectation than calling yourself an artist.
 
Vaughn said:
I packed mules for ten seasons (May thru Oct) for the US Forest Service. I had my share of wreaks, which in packers' lore means I am a mule packer. But I do not call myself a mule packer, I just packed mules. I just feel that I never gained a sufficient skill and experience level -- in relation to those who are 'real' packers -- to justify it. It was just a job (that I loved) and I do not think I have been on a horse, nor want to be on one, in the over 25 years since I last packed a mule.
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So you packed mules for 10 years and still don't think you're good enough at it to call yourself a mule packer? That's like a 1/4-1/3 of the average persons entire working years. At what point do you think you would be good enough? I've never packed a mule- no idea what's involved, but I would think after a few years you'd have learned the ropes.
 
Vaughn said:
I packed mules for ten seasons (May thru Oct) for the US Forest Service. I had my share of wreaks, which in packers' lore means I am a mule packer. But I do not call myself a mule packer, I just packed mules. I just feel that I never gained a sufficient skill and experience level -- in relation to those who are 'real' packers -- to justify it. It was just a job (that I loved) and I do not think I have been on a horse, nor want to be on one, in the over 25 years since I last packed a mule.

Actually -- pretty silly of me, I suppose. If someone called me a packer, I would not argue about it.

If someone with much less experience than I wants to call themselves a packer, that is fine with me, too (as long as they have had a wreak or two -- a traditional right-of-passage). So if someone wants to not call themselves an artist, that's cool with me...as long as they do not try to extend their personal definition of an artist to others and deny or critize someone else who wants to call themselves an artist.
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Also- you win the award for most unique job ever.
 
faberryman said:
In my mind, making a big deal about not calling yourself an artist is more an of affectation than calling yourself an artist.
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I have to agree with you here. Most professional artists work very hard for very little pay and get very little respect. They do it because they love doing it. It's their passion in life. For 99% of artists, there's no fancy social club gatherings, magazine interviews, assistants working in their shadows, world traveling for gallery openings, and legions of adoring fans. There's just the artist, his/her tools, and a passion to create. I mean think about it. Very few artists achieve much in the way of fame, wealth, and social status during their lifetime. Recoiling at the idea of someone willing to work so hard for so little reward is what's wrong with our society. We need more people willing to roll up their sleeves, focus intently on a something, all for little to no outside reward (though great personal reward), and less people passively going through the mindless motions of a rehearsed technique and demanding a fat, steady paycheck. This world needs artists. Now more than ever.

So if you're a photographer who's passionate about your work, someone who's always pushing themselves to do better and get out of their comfort zone, someone who's never content to just phone it in and go through the motions, then proudly declare yourself an artist! You are someone who works hard for a living, and does so because they enjoy the hard work, and not because they're expecting a big pay day. That is the beating heart of the artist! ​
 
Ces1um said:
So you packed mules for 10 years and still don't think you're good enough at it to call yourself a mule packer? That's like a 1/4-1/3 of the average persons entire working years. At what point do you think you would be good enough? I've never packed a mule- no idea what's involved, but I would think after a few years you'd have learned the ropes.
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Well, packing them into those dang packing crates for shipping is the hard part.

I was taught how to pack my first season from the crew foreman (we packed mules then went into the wilderness for 10 days at a time to build and maintain trails -- usually hand-leading the mules). The crew foreman had only one season 's experience with mules, but he taught me all he knew. For the next 9 years I was the foreman and teaching new crew members how to pack -- while the mules continued to teach me.

So I had no old mule packer to mentor me. There are large holes in my experience and knowledge that a mule packer should have. At the end of the season, I left and came back in May -- without having to take care of the animals. While the mountains I packed in are some of the roughest trails in CA, there are many landforms and weather conditions I never had to deal with. Major snow events, swimming the animals across wide rivers, very odd loads (never packed a piano on a mule like some did!) I am weak on long-term care of mules, and so forth.

I just feel that calling myself a mule packer does an injustice to those who I think are true packers.

I call myself an artist (when asked) because I feel that I am an artist all the way down to the bottom of my soul. I am not just one thing, though. I am also a father -- not just because I have kids, but because I have taken the label and embraced it hold it as hard as the label 'artist'. In truth, I do not even separate the father and the artist in me.

I have been fortunate that others have seen the artist in me and in my work -- and have provided me with confirmation of how I see myself, even though at first I resisted the title, like many here. I feel the label 'artist' comes with a responsibility -- to be true to oneself, honesty when working with others and in ones work, and to always push forward. I can see why some people prefer not to be called artist -- perhaps they do not wish to accept that responsibility
 
IMO technical competence is somehow related. If a photographer insists that s/he is an artist does that suggest s/he lacks important technical skills? Does it suggest s/he makes photos that don't seem significant to "better" photographers? Me, I think the question is ridiculous.
 
jtk said:
IMO technical competence is somehow related. If a photographer insists that s/he is an artist does that suggest s/he lacks important technical skills? Does it suggest s/he makes photos that don't seem significant to "better" photographers? Me, I think the question is ridiculous.
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Hear, here! Whatever "art" is, it is rarely a function of luck. The challenge is that one not let tech wag the dog but serve the purpose of vision. That requires, however, a whole lot of study, rehearsal, and application so that tech becomes second nature.

That said, if one doesn't have those technical skills, one will have to know who to hire to hold up that end.
 
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gr82bart said:
Do any of these questions matter? From an article at Lomography on the same blog:
1. Do you think about why some photos stay in the mind?
2. Are you willing to redefine your world?
3. Are you aware of visual relationships, including minute details?
4. Do you make photos that cannot be repeated?
5. Do you look within yourself for the benefit of your photography?
6. Do you push beyond the limits and confines of the mind?
7. Are you willing to face your fears?



Regards, Art
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guangong said:
A list that was obviously put together by someone who is not an artist.
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IDK
i think the person who made the video ( Roger Ballen )
has been called an artist by an awful lot of people and it seems he put together the list, ...
and idk, it seems to be a pretty good list... photography that makes you think, pay attention to details, think about who you are and why you made the photographs
being thoughtful, moving forward and facing fear, not sure why that isn't list put together by an artist
.. probably could be a handful of other things in there ...
 
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"Artist" is the SECOND easiest possible self-designated title. That person's "work" must be NFG to be "art."

"Photographer" is the NUMBER ONE easiest possible self-designated title: One must have access to a "camera" of some sort, or play for a few moments with photo sensitive materials, or make photo sensitive materials, or make snaps with a phone (intentionally or by accident), to be a "photographer."

Most bipeds, or former bipeds, are artists and all of them will be photographers very soon. Almost everyone in India and China is already a photographer and artist.
 
We disagree. How about the rainbow re-working films and such? Pre-packaged creativity ."Carefully crafted by our color contortionist chemical engineers" Not a gimmick? On the contrary, it is gimmick that exploits a market; you can learn that at Harvard, too.
 
Berkeley Mike said:
We disagree. How about the rainbow re-working films and such? Pre-packaged creativity ."Carefully crafted by our color contortionist chemical engineers" Not a gimmick? On the contrary, it is gimmick that exploits a market; you can learn that at Harvard, too.
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not really sure what is so gimmicky about catering to your customer base ...
so they don't have to respool film backwards or use a purple filter .. or reload 110 cartridges.
contortionist chemical engineers .. sounds like fun !

ps theflyingcamera here on photrio has and uses a lomo camera quite skillfully
no gimmicks just great photography ...
 
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Ces1um said:
Photographer is good too though. Just as good as artist. I agree though, it's always nice when someone else appreciates your work.
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When in doubt if you are an artist, ask your mother.
 
Yes.....
Dream.jpg
 
.......Being an artist is kind of like being an asshole, your opinion is meaningless. YOU do not get to say whether you are or are not. :smile:
 
CMoore said:
.......Being an artist is kind of like being an asshole,...
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Yep, if they are not used and appreciated, one gets full of shit.
 
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