You have 12 hours to talk me out of a Mamiya 645 and 150mm f3.5

[daleeman]

Upon reviewing the package at $200 you are getting a really good deal. I had the 1000s for years and it was by far the best Mamiya I had worked with. The 150 lens is tack sharp, too sharp for a woman's portrait over 45 years old so I had a cheap UV filter I would smear some finger grease on again and again to soften up the image.

The prisim is nice, but I really liked the waist level finder on mine. the grip is good and the rest of the items are a gift. But if you like turning the camer up for portraits, its almost necessary.

So buy a great camera. I was very happy with mine until a damn Hasselblad jumped up and bit me in the wallet. Then I switched systems. Ramie Noodles are not that bad 6 times a week I found out while owning and buying more Hasselblad equipment.

Lee

 

[Roger Cole]

Don't know why 645 gets little love here.
i actually like it. Still immensely portable but the IQ advantage of 135 is sure evident to me even in 8x10s.
The tones are just smoother.

Agree. I have a 645 Pro. It's a significant step up from 35mm and smaller and easier to hand hold than 6x7. I do have a 6x6 Yashicamat and a 6x7 back for my 4x5 so I shoot to some extent with all three. 6x6 was mainly invented for TLRs so you didn't need to turn the camera to shoot verticals. I do find I like the square for some images, but not all by any means, and often enough find myself cropping the 6x6 to 6x4.5 or so anyway. I don't think 6x4.5 to 6x6 is enough of a difference to make much difference and both are actually really big step ups from 35mm. 6x7 is in a different league, but is also in a different league in size and weight.

The batteries for my Pro are readily available 4SR44s silver oxide or equivalent alkaline or lithium, plus a 2CR5 for the winder, but I understand from one of the posts above that the 1000s is different. My metered prism is also powered from the camera body battery which is also good.

If the equipment checks out, go for it. If you like it, great, if not it can be sold without much if any loss.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Don't know why 645 gets little love here.
i actually like it. Still immensely portable but the IQ advantage of 135 is sure evident to me even in 8x10s.
The tones are just smoother.

1. Not enough improvement over 135
2. Why waste the ability to get 6x6?

 

[cliveh]

The situation with Mamiya today may be different, but about 20 years ago I sometimes visited a very established camera repair guy (lifetime service). I once asked him, what type of cameras do you most have to deal with for repair? His awnswer was Mamiya.

 

[Sirius Glass]

The situation with Mamiya today may be different, but about 20 years ago I sometimes visited a very established camera repair guy (lifetime service). I once asked him, what type of cameras do you most have to deal with for repair? His answer was Mamiya.

The job security must have been good for him.

 

[j-dogg]

Got it.

The difference between 35mm and this is like the difference between some high-grade marijuana and doing lines of puro Columbian coke.

I'm pretty sure I will have my Nikkormat system for sale soon, as much as I love it, this thing is a hopped-up version of a Nikon FTn

 

[M.A.Longmore]

Got it.

The difference between 35mm and this is like the difference between some high-grade marijuana and doing lines of puro Columbian coke.

I'm pretty sure I will have my Nikkormat system for sale soon, as much as I love it, this thing is a hopped-up version of a Nikon FTn

.
Congratulations, Mr. Dogg !

Ron
.

 

[Roger Cole]

The situation with Mamiya today may be different, but about 20 years ago I sometimes visited a very established camera repair guy (lifetime service). I once asked him, what type of cameras do you most have to deal with for repair? His awnswer was Mamiya.

I suspect that had a LOT to do with the popularity of Mamiyas among pro wedding photographers who were prone to wear out gear with massive use.

 

[zsas]

Congrats JDog! Was wondering when you wd show up to take your victory lap! Do post some images when roll 1 is in the can...

 

[j-dogg]

Yeah I love this, I've already taken 4 shots with it and plan on finishing the roll this week.

Since this is my first time with MF, couple things. F$&%#$& it's heavy, it weighs about as much as my Nikkormat FTn with a Vivitar Series 1 70-210 f3.5 on it. It's HUGE. Makes my Canon 5D with battery grip look like a toy.

The left grip takes some time getting used to. I've shot SLR's in 135 for a long time and the business end is on the right side. Though it's MF I have a rough idea of their 35mm equivalents, the 150 I believe is close to about 90-93mm 35mm-equivalent.

How wide does the 35mm come out to be? I want to get a decent wide, the 80 1.9 (which is the 50mm equivalent) and maybe something with more reach like the 210 or 300. Not ruling out A glass, which seems to be their equivalent of Canon L glass (of which I own a few) the 150 2.8 looks like that could be great for portraits.

Also how accurate is the light meter? It seems to be close to my 5D which is dead-nuts on. And my noob MF question for the day....are the exposures supposed to be the same as 35mm? I find at 400 ISO a shot that should be a 1/60th is like 1/100 or 1/125 on my digital. I'll have to check it again, I know my digital Rebel has a smaller sensor and it's always running a higher shutter speed than my 5D which would make sense on the 120 if true.

 

[Sirius Glass]

j-dogg, I knew that you would take the fall and you did. Enjoy!!

 

[Roger Cole]

Exposure has nothing to do with film/sensor area, just sensitivity (film speed, sensor sensitivity) and subject brightness.

The 645 with prism and winder does make a fairly big package, but it's still smaller than any 6x7 SLR I know of. If you dislike the grip on the left you can move to a 645 Pro system which uses a right grip and also offers interchangable film backs, but that's an entirely different camera and winder and, I think, prism. The same lens will work, however.

 

[daleeman]

Take the bracket off for a while to get a feel for the camera. I'd even go to KEH and order a WLF to have that option to really feel how light it really is. Then get an 80mm lens too.

 

[Roger Cole]

The lens will definitely lighten it up. The camera body doesn't weigh much (unless it's very different from my Pro, and the Pro may in fact be a bit heavier due to the interchangeable backs) but when you add stuff, well, it adds up. My Pro at least handles so much better with the winder grip that I think it's well worth the weight. I have to take it off to use my Polaroid back and it's - odd. I think it's the shutter release position I don't really care for. (Well the Polaroid back is also a big clumsy thing on the back but that's nothing to do with the grip.)

 

[Nige]

My Pro-TL and 1000s take the same battery which is not something you can find in a corner store, but is available at 'better' battery outlets. I have a 45mm which equates to 28mm or so in 35eqiv speak but in use 'seems' wider. I rarely use it and find the 55mm gets more use but that could just be my view of the world (I rarely use my 90mm on 4x5" either)

I would think exposure given the same film speed regardless of format should be the same.

 

[Nige]

My Pro at least handles so much better with the winder grip that I think it's well worth the weight.

I'm the other way. I have the winder for the Pro but never use it. Probably because I started with the 1000s and got use to holding that. The 1000s has better shutter release (2 of them too!) than the Pro-TL. Shutter makes a nicer 'clunk' too, but I use the Pro for all the other benefits it gives and the poor old 1000s just sits and dreams about having film run through it...

 

[Roger Cole]

I'm the other way. I have the winder for the Pro but never use it. Probably because I started with the 1000s and got use to holding that. The 1000s has better shutter release (2 of them too!) than the Pro-TL. Shutter makes a nicer 'clunk' too, but I use the Pro for all the other benefits it gives and the poor old 1000s just sits and dreams about having film run through it...

Hum, interesting. Admitedly I got the Pro with the winder in a package, but I swapped it for the crank and tried it both ways and the release where it is just feels weird and awkward to me without the winder. Holding the camera isn't too bad, though - in fact now that I think of it the release is in a similar position to my Yashicamat but that feels nice to me. I think that's the fact that I use the 645 Pro with the prism and the Yashica at WL. The release on the lower right below the lens feels good and right held at waist level, much less so for me at eye level. YMMV of course - try it both ways. (Assuming, of course, that the OP also got the manual wind crank with the package. Glad I did, as I stumbled on the Polaroid back for free while still waiting for the camera to arrive and need it - the Polaroid back won't fit with the winder and neckstrap on, and you need the crank to cock the shutter. I'm having fun with that - many people consider the 6x4.5 image too small for Polaroid and I see their point, but it's nice for proofing and a lot of people these days have never even seen, or barely remember, a Polaroid, especially a peel-apart one, so it has a certain cool factor.)

 

[MattKing]

When you have the grip with built in release connection, your left hand takes most of the weight of the camera and is responsible for releasing the shutter. The right hand winds the film, adjusts the shutter speed and aperture and sets the focus. It also steadies the camera at the time of exposure.

With the right hand grip/winder, your left hand is responsible for focus, aperture and shutter speed. The right hand releases the shutter.

Horses for courses.

By the way, the more recent bodies (Super/Pro/Pro Tl) with prism may actually be lighter than the 1000s with prism.

Due to the differing aspect ratios, it is difficult to compare the effects of different focal lengths between 35mm and 645 systems.

For me, the 55mm lens on the 645 is a really nice standard-wide lens. I don't even have an 80mm lens any more - I use a 55mm and 110mm pair instead.

And the 45mm lens on the 645 is somehow significantly wider than the 55mm.

You need to realize, however, that my standard lens kit for 35mm is 24mm, 35mm and 85mm.

 

[zsas]

I only own the 80mm 1.9, which is roughly 50mm if comparing to how it wd look on a 35mm camera. If I were to get another lens it wd be the 55mm, for whatever that is worth.

Enjoy that 150mm, get to know it well, maybe get the WLF and a 80 or 55 or something down the road? Like Matt says, the ergonomics of the left hand grip frees up my right to do all the serious work, I find it genius.

Did you see Graham is selling a 500mm!!!

Congrats!!!

 

[Roger Cole]

When you have the grip with built in release connection, your left hand takes most of the weight of the camera and is responsible for releasing the shutter. The right hand winds the film, adjusts the shutter speed and aperture and sets the focus. It also steadies the camera at the time of exposure.

With the right hand grip/winder, your left hand is responsible for focus, aperture and shutter speed. The right hand releases the shutter.

Horses for courses.

That's probably why it feels natural to me with the right hand winder - it works just like I use 35mm cameras. Even my Yashicamat has the release on the right and the focus knob on the left. It's probably mostly what you are used to.

 

[j-dogg]

Shot a little bit more, on a second look the exposure is spot on compared to my 5D, both would do ISO 400 1000th-sec @ f11 in the same FL and scene. Very solid feel, every shutter advance is like loading another clip on a .50 machine gun.

It really is a big beast, getting used to the left grip now, think I'll keep it. Definitely see an 80, 45 and a WLF in my near future, also scored some 20-year old B+W Kodak 120 pan-x.......not sure on the condition but hey free film.

Also the local camera shop has a nice Metz 45 with all the attachments, would look decent on this rig. Has the sync cord (and I can use it with my EOS system) might end up picking it up too. They gave me the film and the shutter cord that came with it free.

Bottom line is, this one is definitely a keeper and I may step up to a Pentax 67 and keep it as a sidearm, much as I do with my 5D full-frame digital and digital Rebel APS-C sidearm.

One more question I have, I want to get some more 120 backs for it, would it be safe to have like 3 120 backs, and pre-load 2 and keep them in the case they come in, then when it's time to exchange rolls I can just pull the old back out and put the new one in?

Also, can I get a Polaroid back for it and shoot Fuji FP?

 

[MattKing]

By "backs" I take it you mean "inserts".

If you have the cases/boxes for the inserts, they are designed to be pre-loaded.

The only thing you have to watch is with respect to the exposed films. You need to be sure that the sealing tape goes on ASAP or some other step is taken to make sure that the backing paper and exposed film doesn't unravel.

 

[Old-N-Feeble]

Bahh... drunk, I am!!

 

[MattKing]

And the link to the manual is here: http://www.mamiyaleaf.com/documentation_legacy_645.asp

Have fun!

 

[Roger Cole]

One more question I have, I want to get some more 120 backs for it, would it be safe to have like 3 120 backs, and pre-load 2 and keep them in the case they come in, then when it's time to exchange rolls I can just pull the old back out and put the new one in?

Also, can I get a Polaroid back for it and shoot Fuji FP?

Unfortunately, no. The 1000s does not use interchangable backs, so you can't get more backs and change mid-roll either. You CAN get additional inserts and pre-load them for quick film loads. Same with the Polaroid - you need to move up to the Pro or Pro-TL (but not the AF model - I got my Polaroid back free from someone who bought it not realizing it wouldn't work on his 645AF.)

I've been finding the Polaroid back fun, and it's useful for proofing, but the lack of one isn't a big thing. Bear in mind how small the image is. The print area is the size of a contact print from your negatives. It wastes a lot of the 3.25x4.25 Fuji film area.

I'd stick with the 1000s for now and build a system around some lenses and get some inserts. If mid roll film changes are really important, you can then add a Pro or Pro-TL body and some inserts, prism and winder too if you want, for not much money at all, and use both bodies with all your lenses.