Why do you think Ansel Adams is better known than William Mortensen?

[DREW WILEY]

Yosemite Ahwahneechee Indians did not have that custom, nor any in the vicinity. But mercury poisoning might explain some of Mortensen's compositions. Perhaps he ate too much swordfish.

 

[Vaughn]

Is it possible to get back on topic?

Really? Thirteen pages, over 300 comments...what's the topic?

 

[removed account4]

Why do you think Ansel Adams is better known than William Mortensen? Both have books on photographic aesthetics and techniques. Has “pure photography” won over Pictorialism?

not even sure what pure photography is

 

[BrianShaw]

not even sure what pure photography is

LOL... back to square one.

I’m still daydreaming about Eskimo/Inuit hospitality. Or am I fantasizing. Or is it pure lust... whatever that is.

 

[Sirius Glass]

LOL... back to square one.

I’m still daydreaming about Eskimo/Inuit hospitality.

Not related to incest which is known as "rolling your own".

 

[removed account4]

LOL... back to square one.

I’m still daydreaming about Eskimo/Inuit hospitality. Or am I fantasizing. Or is it pure lust... whatever that is.

I'm trying to ignore it. I don't need another distraction in my life

 

[Mainecoonmaniac]

not even sure what pure photography is

I don't either. That's why I put the term in quotes. Do people that do it, imply that somehow, other types of photography that is tainted? To me, it sounds dogmatic.

 

[Vaughn]

... To me, it sounds dogmatic.

"Purists" make good targets...even if they have to be created in order to have something to aim at.

 

[SchwinnParamount]

I think some of you old farts need to eat more bran. Just because you think you are an expert doesn't make your opinion mean much.... Especially those that claim they are photographers but never even show an image. I suppose after all these years of reading the blather of some I should be used to it.

Oh gosh, what have I missed since I have been away from the thread for a few days? Patrick, your ageism doesn't sit well with me or a fair number of other folks here. Please tone it down.

 

[removed account4]

"Purists" make good targets...even if they have to be created in order to have something to aim at.

pure photography, does it exist ?
I'm still trying to figure out how a photograph being "unmanipulated" ...
its always too many arguments, 150+years of blather and not enough photography

 

[Mainecoonmaniac]

pure photography, does it exist ?
I'm still trying to figure out how a photograph being "unmanipulated" ...
its always too many arguments, 150+years of blather and not enough photography

I don’t know how a photographer reconciles pre-visualization and pure photography. Is the “pure” part just technique?

 

[Vaughn]

pure photography, does it exist ?
I'm still trying to figure out how a photograph being "unmanipulated" ...
its always too many arguments, 150+years of blather and not enough photography

No, purity is just a strawman set up to be knock down by people who think an image has to be manipulated in a certain way in order to be art or something.

 

[macfred]

... its always too many arguments, 150+years of blather and not enough photography

John, just do not bother about it ...

 

[Vaughn]

Pre-visualization is also known as caffeine consumption.

 

[macfred]

Pre-visualization is also known as caffeine consumption.

And what about post-visualization ... The great disillusionment thereafter ?

 

[Vaughn]

And what about post-visualization ... The great disillusionment thereafter ?

Scotch...

 

[warden]

John, just do not bother about it ...

That comic is excellent!

 

[MattKing]

I think we should also argue about the term pre-visualization. There is no pre-visualization. Just visualization.

When it comes to the Zone system and the terms used:
Ansel Adams = visualization
Minor White = pre-visualization
Isn't language fun.

 

[MattKing]

Right, but I'm sorry, Minor White's term is nonsense.

Mostly I agree.
Although I guess you could argue that when you are trying to put together a photographic project, the steps (such as research) taken to refine the idea before you actually consider the photos themselves (if you work that way) could constitute pre-visualization.

 

[Sirius Glass]

When it comes to the Zone system and the terms used:
Ansel Adams = visualization
Minor White = pre-visualization
Isn't language fun.

Right, but I'm sorry, Minor White's term is nonsense. Visualization is in the mind. What comes before that? Literally anything else you thought or did up until that moment.

Vaughn's example is as good as any.

Step one: Have coffee (pre-visualization)
Step two: Visualization
Step three: Post-visualization

Mostly I agree.
Although I guess you could argue that when you are trying to put together a photographic project, the steps (such as research) taken to refine the idea before you actually consider the photos themselves (if you work that way) could constitute pre-visualization.

Pre-visualization: Walking around with ones eyes closed.

 

[Wayne]

Step one: Have coffee (pre-visualization)
Step two: Visualization
Step three: Post-visualization

Step four. Realization. That you should have stuck with Step one a lot longer.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Step five. Stop worrying about it; just take the damn picture.

 

[removed account4]

No, purity is just a strawman set up to be knock down by people who think an image has to be manipulated in a certain way in order to be art or something.

huh, and i thought the straw man had the brain, the lion had courage and tin man had a heart...

John, just do not bother about it ...

View attachment 265829

thanks for reminding me to carry on there's nothing to see here.

 

[DREW WILEY]

I don't have the extra fourteen hours and 36 Snicker's bars of extra calories to pre-visualize, post-visualize, perpetually visualize, or invent new prefixes, postfixes, and posted predicaments. That's all a recipe for another print in the trashcan instead of at the mounting press. Does it really have to be that complicated? No wonder AA got a bent nose over it.

John - the tin man got a ticking watch in lieu of a heart, the lion got a medal in lieu of courage, and the scarecrow a diploma in lieu of a brain. Once as a joke retirement gift to a coworker, we gave him all three - watch, medal, and diploma, implying he had neither a heart, courage, nor brain.

 

[DREW WILEY]

I started making really good prints once I accepted the fact there is no such thing as a perfect print. Only the Wizard of Oz would claim otherwise.