Which lenses for Praktina

[ant!]

The same design optically, the difference is the Pancolar had much better new coatings, these gave far better colour balance. The earlier T coating gave a colder (bluer) look on transparencies films.

Ian

Interesting. This article https://zeissikonveb.de/start/objektive/normalobjektive/pancolar2.html doesn't mention the change in coating, which doesn't mean it is not the case. The change seem to have been done within a production batch though, which explains also DMS206's observation...

 

[Ian Grant]

The first image on that web page shows the quite different reflections from the Pancolar's coatings. I had one in the early 1970s which was similar, and the two Exacta Pancolars aI have now are the same, quite different to the Flexons I've seen.

All the Pancolars have the newer coatings, somewhere I have a CZ advert that mentions the Pancolar's balanced coatings for colour work. The term single coating is a misnomer Zeiss were using more than one coating layer fairly early. Likewise, the term Multi Coated only became the norm when Pentax released their Super Multi Coated lenses, many lenses had multiple coating before that.

Ian

 

[markjwyatt]

The same design optically, the difference is the Pancolar had much better new coatings, these gave far better colour balance. The earlier T coating gave a colder (bluer) look on transparencies films.

Ian

The Flexons were made through the 50s and the Pancolors started at latest by 1960, and serialized after the Flexons (some data missing).

 

[DMS206]

Here is a pic of the lens that had the pancolar ring over the flexon

 

[markjwyatt]

Here is a pic of the lens that had the pancolar ring over the flexon View attachment 332787 View attachment 332787

The Flexon is listed (serial number) for 1958 (I think first piece off the line) for Praktina (note says "auch" Pancolor- also Pancolor). The Pancolor ring of that serial number is in a range (ending in 1962) that should be an M42 (note says "zT. [zum Teil] Exakta", partly Exakta) 58mm f2 Biotar (per the Fabrikationsbuch refenced above).

 

[Ian Grant]

Here is a pic of the lens that had the pancolar ring over the flexon View attachment 332787 View attachment 332787

Interesting as it has the newer coatings.

Ian

 

[ant!]

According to the link I posted above ( https://zeissikonveb.de/start/objektive/normalobjektive/pancolar2.html , section "Flexon und Pancolar 2/50"), there was a new calculation done in 1960 (maybe this had the improved coating?), but the name change to Pancolar happened already before, so there are some Pancolar with the 1954 version (=Flexon) around. And the picture says the lens section (https://zeissikonveb.de/____impro/1/onewebmedia/Marco/Normalobjektive/Pancolar 2!50b.jpg ) is for both versions (1954 & 1960)...

 

[ant!]

And another question:
How would I know from the lens mount if a lens is the SB or ASB version? Has the SB lens always a little lever to open the aperature? Anything which can be seen when looking only at the bottom of the lens?

 

[markjwyatt]

And another question:
How would I know from the lens mount if a lens is the SB or ASB version? Has the SB lens always a little lever to open the aperature? Anything which can be seen when looking only at the bottom of the lens?

I believe the ASB lenses have a cocking mechanism on the bottom of the lens barrel, and a large radial protrusion to activate the shutter release. The SB have a smaller radial protrusion, but no cocking lever. Not sure there is anything different on the bayonet mount.

 

[ant!]

So, the camera arrived. Unfortunately, even though the Tessar was described as "semi-auto", it is preset. This alone would be ok I guess, even though I would have preferred the semi-auto version, but the camera is as well the FX without any aperature stop-down thing (this version: http://www.praktina.com/pucam04.htm ), which means I could not use any semi-auto lenses on it. Since the ebay ad said it's a semi-auto lens and those work only on the FX with the semi-auto feature, I assumed it is one of those. Of course I could have asked. The camera mount internals where not shown on the photos, so the only glue would have been the lens. And of course, the FX versions with semi-auto aperature are much more common then the preset only ones.

I contacted the seller, a repair man in Slovakia who knows about cameras and not just a random person selling a camera unknown to him. His answer: Sorry, I copied the text from an earlier ad (but updated serial numbers), but you should have seen in the images that it's preset and not semi-auto since it looks different.

I meanwhile found as well a IIa with double aperture function (SB and ASB), in a good shape (have not received it yet, but seller seems to know what he talked about and used it not too long ago, without shutter time problems or light leaks). It comes with the Pancolar 50/2, Flektogon 35/2.8 ASB, and Sonnar 135/4 (plus a few other things, like both prism and waistlevel finder, rapid-winding lever, some original boxes and papers and stuff).

So, what do you think about the FX? I mean it is serviced, works well, outer appearance ok without being crazy mint, but limited to preset/manual aperture lenses. Should I keep it (if yes, why?), or use the ebay return due to wrong item description?

 

[markjwyatt]

So, the camera arrived. Unfortunately, even though the Tessar was described as "semi-auto", it is preset. This alone would be ok I guess, even though I would have preferred the semi-auto version, but the camera is as well the FX without any aperature stop-down thing (this version: http://www.praktina.com/pucam04.htm ), which means I could not use any semi-auto lenses on it. Since the ebay ad said it's a semi-auto lens and those work only on the FX with the semi-auto feature, I assumed it is one of those. Of course I could have asked. The camera mount internals where not shown on the photos, so the only glue would have been the lens. And of course, the FX versions with semi-auto aperature are much more common then the preset only ones.

I contacted the seller, a repair man in Slovakia who knows about cameras and not just a random person selling a camera unknown to him. His answer: Sorry, I copied the text from an earlier ad (but updated serial numbers), but you should have seen in the images that it's preset and not semi-auto since it looks different.

I meanwhile found as well a IIa with double aperture function (SB and ASB), in a good shape (have not received it yet, but seller seems to know what he talked about and used it not too long ago, without shutter time problems or light leaks). It comes with the Pancolar 50/2, Flektogon 35/2.8 ASB, and Sonnar 135/4 (plus a few other things, like both prism and waistlevel finder, rapid-winding lever, some original boxes and papers and stuff).

So, what do you think about the FX? I mean it is serviced, works well, outer appearance ok without being crazy mint, but limited to preset/manual aperture lenses. Should I keep it (if yes, why?), or use the ebay return due to wrong item description?

I would keep it. I have a mix of lenses (ASB, SB, preset), and they are all fine with me. Having to meter manually is ok also. It is good to have a second camera with the correct mount for lens investment security purposes, plus both these cameras are part of camera history., Maybe you could negotiate a small discount due to the mis-advertising to make it more worthwhile to keep. I just renegotiated on an Exacta that I was tole works fine (rather than sending it back), but does not, and kept it for repair parts and a second prism finder (better than my current one actually).

 

[Romanko]

I would keep the camera and save a good relationship with the seller. You might want to use his repair services in the future. Your new type IIA could benefit from a CLA, and so would your lenses.

 

[ant!]

I don't think I would use him for a CLA, for general repair I have servicecamerapro.com/ in Quebec City (they did already a few cameras for me). For a specialist in East German cameras and lenses, I would always go to Olbrich in Görlitz ( http://www.fotoservice-olbrich.de/repair-programme-en/ ), at least for a camera which is in Europe already, or on a trip to visit family...

 

[ant!]

Just in case someone is looking for one, the Zeiss Fernobjektiv 500/8 which I mentioned above dropped quite a bit in price to €200, from 400 or 500 or something. Nothing for me, too long and too heavy, but maybe someone else likes it...

 

[ant!]

And now that Zeiss 500/8 dropped to 130 Euro. I have totally no use for it, but I guess if it goes down to 50 Euro I have to get it, just for curiosity. Unless someone actually has a use for it. https://www.kleinanzeigen.de/s-anze...na-lens-objektiv-praktina/2385186638-245-3407

 

[justlikeswimming]

I hope you're enjoying your praktina(s). I was given an FX with a 58mm f2 biotar lens (preset, my personal favorite type) - the curtain was full of pinholes, but the amazing (though spotty) shots I got sent me down the praktina road. To this is added a IIA with a waist-level finder along with 50mm f2.8 Tessar and 50mm f2 flexon lenses. There is a T-mount to praktina adapter available. Currently I have a tele-lentar 135mm f2.8 and soligor 180 f3.5, they do well stopped down (not comparable to a CZJ lens but a lot cheaper). Of all the 35mm film cameras I've used the praktina is my favorite. I hope you enjoy yours as well! Included is the crazy shot (hand held macro) that started me down the praktina journey...

 

[ant!]

Shipping took quite a while (slow non-express with German post is 2 months to Canada right now, on the boat. Somehow the same from Austria and Slovakia needs only 2-3 weeks...), so I received the IIa with the Flektogon 35/2.8, Pancolar 50/2, Sonnar 135/4 (this one is a but stiff but useable, the other two lenses very smooth) just 2-3 weeks ago and I am still in the first testing film (as I had also still a Canon Demi EE17 loaded...).
The IIa is in the most beautiful condition you can imagine, and for both full- and semi-auto lenses, with the rapid-wind lever (first I found it strange to have a wind lever on the bottom instead of the top, but it's really useful and faster then the knob!). Also in the package: Both waist lever and eye-level finder (with split-screen, the FX I received first has only a simple mat screen).

The FX, even though it had a CLA, is in a much rougher outer condition. Glad I got the IIa too! From inspection the shutter curtains and shutter speeds seem fine, the first film will show if I need a CLA for this one. And since it is in such beautiful condition, it would make sense...

I also got as a portrait lens a Biometar 80/2.8, which I got for a reasonable price since the focus ring was completely stuck and a bit hazy, but Service Camera Pro fixed both at a very reasonable rate.

Since you have the Biotar 58/2, the Tessar 50/2.8 and the Flexon 50/2: Is the Biotar much different to the other two? Worth to add if I find it for a reasonable price, or not really needed when having the Tesser and the Pancolar (which should be similar to your Flexon)?

I think I have no need for the T-mount adapter at the moment, first I need to play with the lenses I got now, and some native lenses are cheap as well (after looking into the market for a while and reading: Zeiss Jena, Schneider, Steinheil and Angenieux seems the premium, ZJ the most common of these and therefore a bit cheaper then the others. The cheaper brands with, except some special lenses, are Meyer Görlitz, ISCO, Enna. Schacht maybe somewhere in the middle...).

 

[justlikeswimming]

Shipping took quite a while (slow non-express with German post is 2 months to Canada right now, on the boat. Somehow the same from Austria and Slovakia needs only 2-3 weeks...), so I received the IIa with the Flektogon 35/2.8, Pancolar 50/2, Sonnar 135/4 (this one is a but stiff but useable, the other two lenses very smooth) just 2-3 weeks ago and I am still in the first testing film (as I had also still a Canon Demi EE17 loaded...).
The IIa is in the most beautiful condition you can imagine, and for both full- and semi-auto lenses, with the rapid-wind lever (first I found it strange to have a wind lever on the bottom instead of the top, but it's really useful and faster then the knob!). Also in the package: Both waist lever and eye-level finder (with split-screen, the FX I received first has only a simple mat screen).

The FX, even though it had a CLA, is in a much rougher outer condition. Glad I got the IIa too! From inspection the shutter curtains and shutter speeds seem fine, the first film will show if I need a CLA for this one. And since it is in such beautiful condition, it would make sense...

I also got as a portrait lens a Biometar 80/2.8, which I got for a reasonable price since the focus ring was completely stuck and a bit hazy, but Service Camera Pro fixed both at a very reasonable rate.

Since you have the Biotar 58/2, the Tessar 50/2.8 and the Flexon 50/2: Is the Biotar much different to the other two? Worth to add if I find it for a reasonable price, or not really needed when having the Tesser and the Pancolar (which should be similar to your Flexon)?

I think I have no need for the T-mount adapter at the moment, first I need to play with the lenses I got now, and some native lenses are cheap as well (after looking into the market for a while and reading: Zeiss Jena, Schneider, Steinheil and Angenieux seems the premium, ZJ the most common of these and therefore a bit cheaper then the others. The cheaper brands with, except some special lenses, are Meyer Görlitz, ISCO, Enna. Schacht maybe somewhere in the middle...).

You've got a nice set-up! I've not tried the flexon (6-blade) yet (is in rough shape, but now functional), but love the preset biotar for bokeh (10-blade) and tessar for center sharpness. If you like character in your shots, or for portraits, the biotar is great. I long for the biometar 80mm (too expensive), the A. Schacht travenar 85mm and 135mm are others I'd like to have (at the right price). Until then I'll be using the T-mount soligor and tele-lentar short teles.

Just purchased another FX fitted with a Steinheil Munchen Quinon 55mm f1.9, a great deal I hope isn't too good to be true.

So enjoy your Praktina!

 

[ant!]

Thanks for your comment! Your Steinheil sounds cool, I only saw them really expensive until now!

Regarding the Biometar 80mm: There is right now on German ebay one auction with low starting price, ending Saturday evening European time. It might need some cleaning though, but depending on the price it might be worth it. I guess shipping to the US would be around €20... It's the automatic version, I have the full silver preset one...

In general, like with most German (rarer) stuff: It is much more available from Germany (ebay.de, kleinanzeigen.de) and sometimes other places in Europe then in North America, but of course speaking German and having family there where I could ship to makes it easier for me (although people usually have no problem shipping to Canada when I ask and cover the cost). Similar like rare Japanese stuff pops up easier/cheaper on Yahoo Japan...

 

[StevenG]

I don't think I would use him for a CLA, for general repair I have servicecamerapro.com/ in Quebec City (they did already a few cameras for me). For a specialist in East German cameras and lenses, I would always go to Olbrich in Görlitz ( http://www.fotoservice-olbrich.de/repair-programme-en/ ), at least for a camera which is in Europe already, or on a trip to visit family...

If you feel really adventurous you could perform the CLA yourself. I bought the repair notes from Rick Olesen and he explains well how to take the camera apart. When I bought my Praktina IIa, the second curtain was hanging. I took the camera apart and adjusted the shutter again. It works now at all speeds (luckily ).

The only problem I have now is that there are some pinholes in the second curtain, which I haven't fixed. As a work around I have used a textile marker on the second curtain to clog the pin holes with ink and after I take a picture I put the lens cap back on the camera. It is only a problem with the second curtain, because when the camera is wound, the mirror prevents light going through the shutter to the film.

But all in all, I love the camera. I have the 35mm Flektogon, which is a bit haizy and needs to be cleaned, a Flexon 50mm which works excellently, a Biometar 80mm with a dented filter ring and a Sonnar 135. Of all the lenses I tend to use the 50mm and 80mm the most. The 135mm I have never used. For me it's too slow (only pshycologically) and too long.

 

[ant!]

I just bought cheap in Germany the spring motor and the magnification viewfinder. Will probably take a few weeks until I actually have it...

Also, since my last post, I found a reasonable priced Biotar 58 SB where the owner thought the semi-automatic aperture was not working and the lens modified, but it was just a stuck (non-auto) macro extension ring which I got off with some effort.

I guess I'll do soon since test for myself to see how much the Tessar, Biotar and Pancolar differ...
And yes, I use beside the 50mm as well the 35 and 80mm the most. Same with my Minolta, I go rarely above 100mm.