When the camera you buy becomes the deciding factor for your ethics rating

[DonJ]

I am rather dumbfounded with how much 'controversy' such a simple act has generated. - David Lyga

Why did this "simple act" required the starting of a thread on a website, with a 3-paragraph OP? Clearly, for you, there was nothing simple about it. Yet you're surprised when others don't find it so simple either.

 

[removed account4]

A dealer always buys below the respective retail price level. Still many people, collectors included, sell to dealers, as for them the benefit of doing so is obvious.
Obviously such benefits do not apply on David's case.

I'm guessing after everyting was sorted out, David actually got the camera for like $5, he put a little work into it had a little bit of fun in the end that's what matters to him ...
I don't really see that there was any controversy by what you did David, I was just a bit confused how you equate it with ethics. It almost seemed ( from the way I read what happened ) that the shopkeeper pulled rank on you and you lowered your price, but now I know that isn't really what happened. I totally understand the whole kharma thing and how you want to pay it forward and all that stuff, but I don't think it has anything to do with ethics but just being a nice person.

 

[David Lyga]

A dealer always buys below the respective retail price level. Still many people, collectors included, sell to dealers, as for them the benefit of doing so is obvious.
Obviously such benefits do not apply on David's case.

Yes, AgX, this situation is different.

 

[David Lyga]

Why did this "simple act" required the starting of a thread on a website, with a 3-paragraph OP? Clearly, for you, there was nothing simple about it. Yet you're surprised when others don't find it so simple either.

But the interest remained, did it not? Apparently, when I post, I become the engine for photrio.com. - David Lyga

 

[David Lyga]

I'm guessing after everyting was sorted out, David actually got the camera for like $5, he put a little work into it had a little bit of fun in the end that's what matters to him ...
I don't really see that there was any controversy by what you did David, I was just a bit confused how you equate it with ethics. It almost seemed ( from the way I read what happened ) that the shopkeeper pulled rank on you and you lowered your price, but now I know that isn't really what happened. I totally understand the whole kharma thing and how you want to pay it forward and all that stuff, but I don't think it has anything to do with ethics but just being a nice person.

The semblance with ethics is that for many years I was given good buys from them and now I want to be a little nice. Don't worry, David Lyga is not as stupid as the theory here suggests. - David Lyga

 

[David Lyga]

Ah, but it does...if one goes to the same nice cafe in a small town or in the area of a city where one lives often, and one does not tip, or tip well, ones relationship to the wait staff will be damaged and one may not be welcomed. And being welcomed is part of a good meal.
I am amazed at the feeling of some here that there is a right or a wrong in this situation. Reminds me for some strange reason of the movie, The Jerk, when Steve Martin suddenily realizes that there is a profit motive behind the canival game he is running! There are other values besides money and profit...and each of us sets our own values.
So it goes...

Vaughn, you have no right to dominate the 'common sense' market. How dare you!!! - David Lyga

 

[jtk]

Vaughn, your reply was the absolute best: a simple, transparent attempt to understand my mind and the dimensions that I embrace. When the blacks in NYC sit in the subway or in Philadelphia on the bus, and stretch their legs so no one can get a seat (called by the NYPD as 'manspread', but race is always left out because of political correctness mandates even though everyone knows who they are) I do not get upset that my 'rights' are violated. Such hogging, pure and simple, emanates from a lack of security and a desperation to assert their 'superiority' over others. People who do this are insecure, even though, outwardly they are passively aggressive. The real victors in those situations are those who bear and persevere, knowing that resolution of that specific topic will not be forthcoming in an immediate sense.

For those who say that Tyler Seelig is ugly or dead wrong or other pejoratives, I say this: He was raised by a very decent man, Kurt Seelig, and Tyler is a highly desirable member of the human race. He was not trying to screw me; perhaps he was a bit flummoxed that I would delve (so intelligently?) into his inventory as I had done and he was probably privately embarrassed that his staff would be deficient in not noticing something being sold for peanuts that had real potential. I said that he needs experience with life and business relations, nothing more pejorative than that.

Do I need to always need to assert my rights? (On the bus or subway I do not dare; I would not win and I would be called a racist, to boot). Instead, maybe my 'largess' will do Kurt's son something positive after the dust settles and he has had time to think this out, privately, without threat. When I gave him the camera he did not seem to think that he was the victor. He did not even check it out! I think that his angst was more out of fear, loss of control, that someone had 'found gold' in that box and he did not want to be 'outsmarted'. These are human traits that we all went through on the way to maturity. (The 'manspread' crowd will have to learn this, as well.) Experience settles the stumbling in life and points the direction towards character improvement. Thus, immediate 'winning' falls by the wayside in terms of importance. Too few understand that factor because we live in an 'immediate' culture. I have no regrets for what I did and whatever I feel that I have lost, I feel I have gained more in other areas. - David Lyga

This particular post makes a statement that weakens any claim to righteousness. See if you can find it.

Discussions about "ethics" are frequently driven by self-righteousness and fogged by verbosity, but sometimes they hint at evolution (remembering William F Buckley Jr in this context).

 

[David Lyga]

My gosh, jtk, you seem to have summed up the ego of David Lyga most appropriately! And I thank you for this revelation which will inform and benefit all.

What an asset you are to society! - David Lyga

 

[jtk]

This particular post makes a statement that weakens any claim to righteousness. See if you can find it.

Discussions about "ethics" are frequently driven by self-righteousness and fogged by verbosity, but sometimes they hint at evolution (remembering William F Buckley Jr in this context).

Where there's life there's hope.

 

[Vaughn]

I do not think we understood each other...That is ironic in your statement is to say that there are other values than money in life (and I agree) but to support a response whose money is the only vector...

I guess we don't. What I supported had nothing to do with the concept that money is the only element of a business relationship between a customer and a store owner and/or employee. "Common decency" is another element and I believe David is talking about exactly that...doing what he felt was right.

Common decency, ethics, morality, respect are all words to describe the same thing. It is what lubricates social interactions.

 

[Dali]

I guess we don't. What I supported had nothing to do with the concept that money is the only element of a business relationship between a customer and a store owner and/or employee. "Common decency" is another element and I believe David is talking about exactly that...doing what he felt was right.

Common decency, ethics, morality, respect are all words to describe the same thing. It is what lubricates social interactions.

Well, you make assumption from the something I never wrote but from your own words, so it is going nowhere.

 

[Vaughn]

Well, you make assumption from the something I never wrote but from your own words, so it is going nowhere.

So it goes.

 

[binglebugbob]

It will be interesting to see how he treats you in the future. If he regards you as a "special" customer, maybe it was worth it. If not.....

 

[MattKing]

Common decency, ethics, morality, respect are all words to describe the same thing. It is what lubricates social interactions

I don't know that they do describe the same thing. I think that they are often related, but not equivalent.
I would put ethics and morality together with each other, and common decency and respect with each other, but I would suggest that issues of decency and respect need not involve any questions of ethics or morality. Putting it another way, you can be completely ethical and moral, while still not showing any sign of decency or respect.

 

[Vaughn]

A definition of ethics: moral principles that govern a person's behavior or the conducting of an activity

If someone is not acting decently or respectfully, it would give reason for me to question their ethics. But this becomes a picking of nits.

 

[David Lyga]

Where there's life there's hope.

Even with the verbiage of James Joyce, no less! - David Lyga

 

[David Lyga]

I guess we don't. What I supported had nothing to do with the concept that money is the only element of a business relationship between a customer and a store owner and/or employee. "Common decency" is another element and I believe David is talking about exactly that...doing what he felt was right.

Common decency, ethics, morality, respect are all words to describe the same thing. It is what lubricates social interactions.

Few heed, let alone understand, that imperative and function for a viable and worthy existence. Vaughn, your prescience will pay dividends. - David Lyga

 

[David Lyga]

It will be interesting to see how he treats you in the future. If he regards you as a "special" customer, maybe it was worth it. If not.....

I do not care whether or not I am 'special'. I did this because I wanted to do this. Only the morally deficient will see that act as self-defeating. Yes, I mean just that. - David Lyga

 

[David Lyga]

I don't know that they do describe the same thing. I think that they are often related, but not equivalent.
I would put ethics and morality together with each other, and common decency and respect with each other, but I would suggest that issues of decency and respect need not involve any questions of ethics or morality. Putting it another way, you can be completely ethical and moral, while still not showing any sign of decency or respect.

Ethics, morality, common decency ... all eventually meld into one life-formula. Either know that or life will make you learn that. One begins to see who embraces, or who fends off such matters as pedestrian and unimportant. - David Lyga

 

[Dali]

So what is the exact purpose of this thread? To share with us, mere mortals, your self-esteem and your "ethics"? To be blut: Who cares?

There was life before David Lyga. There will be life after David Lyga.

 

[Vaughn]

So what is the exact purpose of this thread? To share with us, mere mortals, your self-esteem and your "ethics"? To be blut: Who cares?

There was life before David Lyga. There will be life after David Lyga.

Why are you taking the time and effort to reply many times to David's thread? That is a far more interesting question.

 

[MattKing]

Ethics, morality, common decency ... all eventually meld into one life-formula. Either know that or life will make you learn that. One begins to see who embraces, or who fends off such matters as pedestrian and unimportant. - David Lyga

While I don't disagree with this David, it still seems obvious that the situation that brought rise to this thread doesn't involve any issues of ethics or morality at all.

 

[jtk]

While I don't disagree with this David, it still seems obvious that the situation that brought rise to this thread doesn't involve any issues of ethics or morality at all.

Many small businesses are run by people who categorize problem people in Yiddish.

Two Yiddish retail words: krekctser and tshudak. This phrase is even more appropriate: veytik in tokhses.

 

[BrianShaw]

Yiddish... easily understood when heard... even to folks not fluent. A much less powerful language in writing, though.

 

[removed account4]

The semblance with ethics is that for many years I was given good buys from them and now I want to be a little nice. .... - David Lyga

The Kharma Train offers a nice ride, with a great view.
Positivity is a great thing to spread, I'm hoping the shop appreciated the gesture.
Have a great 4th !
John

ps. Sorry my questions about the situation might have garnered negativity, it wasn't my intent !