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What effing universe is this?

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Horatio said:
And no lawn to maintain or gutters to clean!
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We do have two 7.4L 454 V8's to maintain though, so we aren't completely maintenance cost free!
 
DREW WILEY said:
I'm just waiting for some massive hack of the digital "cloud" where everyone's precious images get lost forever in nebulous cyberspace if they don't pay a ransom. That would really bring attention back to the common sense realm of real film imagery. But the digital crowd would probably pay 50 bucks for a brand-label "designer lenscap".
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You might appreciate this story. Or you might decide civilization as we knew it is over: https://www.vice.com/en/article/pkdj79/peoples-expensive-nfts-keep-vanishing-this-is-why
 
ChristopherCoy said:
That's why we live on a boat! The only thing we pay is about $500 a month to keep it docked. No mortgage payment, no property taxes, no mortgage insurance, no HOA fees... nothing. Just slip rent. Cheapest waterfront property ever!
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I like having a basement.
 
DREW WILEY said:
I'm just waiting for some massive hack of the digital "cloud" where everyone's precious images get lost forever in nebulous cyberspace if they don't pay a ransom.
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And that will be a loss to the world's culture, sociology, or art? That's Ok, these guys have their "workflow" and can regenerate their images.
 
I'd prefer that most of that kind of "art" and "culture" be lost forever in cyberspace. The aliens would pick it up and quickly figure out the earth is not worth invading.
 
a co-worker gave me his FM in, I think 2010. He had gone full digital. He didn't offer me any of his perfectly good lenses. :smile:
 
mrosenlof said:
a co-worker gave me his FM in, I think 2010. He had gone full digital. He didn't offer me any of his perfectly good lenses. :smile:
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I am rather surprised. After all, those old primitive lenses were not "designed for digital" so of course they would not work properly. I bet they did not have the right megapixels, equivalence, or ISO cheating.
 
Kodachromeguy said:
I am rather surprised. After all, those old primitive lenses were not "designed for digital" so of course they would not work properly. I bet they did not have the right megapixels, equivalence, or ISO cheating.
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Some photons need to be educated in handling digital light.
 
I used to have some little pixels running around the yard. But the cats caught and ate them all. I hated it whenever they left the uneaten head of one laying on the doormat.
 
The DSLR boom artificially depressed prices for film cameras, especially manual mechanical cameras in mounts with good lens availability. The FM is one of these cameras. The end of the boom brought prices back to normal. The reality is when buying a recently serviced body, the price floor is the cost of a CLA. So yes, $150 or so is reasonable for an FM in good working order, or for that matter any recently serviced or good working order manual mechanical camera. That's for the simple reason that the cost of servicing it will be at least $150.

There will likely always be a solid market for cameras which can have parts manufactured for them and lenses acquired. This means Nikon F and Pentax K mount for SLR's and Leica LTM & M mounts for rangefinders.

Electronic cameras, especially AF ones, have a finite lifetime and much less desirability for the simple reasons that parts will dry up so they will become unrepairable and AF film SLR's tend to have a 'digital but more awkward' user experience, the majority of the folks looking for full automation shoot digital. A handful of these bodies will remain desirable, like the F100, F5 and F6, the Maxxum/Dynax 7 & 9 and the EOS 1 & 3 models.
 
mawz said:
The DSLR boom artificially depressed prices for film cameras, especially manual mechanical cameras in mounts with good lens availability. The FM is one of these cameras. The end of the boom brought prices back to normal. The reality is when buying a recently serviced body, the price floor is the cost of a CLA. So yes, $150 or so is reasonable for an FM in good working order, or for that matter any recently serviced or good working order manual mechanical camera. That's for the simple reason that the cost of servicing it will be at least $150.

There will likely always be a solid market for cameras which can have parts manufactured for them and lenses acquired. This means Nikon F and Pentax K mount for SLR's and Leica LTM & M mounts for rangefinders.

Electronic cameras, especially AF ones, have a finite lifetime and much less desirability for the simple reasons that parts will dry up so they will become unrepairable and AF film SLR's tend to have a 'digital but more awkward' user experience, the majority of the folks looking for full automation shoot digital. A handful of these bodies will remain desirable, like the F100, F5 and F6, the Maxxum/Dynax 7 & 9 and the EOS 1 & 3 models.
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Part disappear for all mechanical cameras too.
 
I bought a Hasselblad and one lens about 12 years ago, sold it after 3 years for slightly more than I sold it for, but the same camera (a 203 FE with Zeiss 110mm f2) now is so much more. Wish I'd kept it.
 
Another option is using PLA to print a an object that is then used to create a mold for casting. There are also on-line resources that will take your CAD drawing and feed it into their very expensive CNC machines to produce limited run parts on demand. It's not terribly cheap, but it's cheaper than spooling up a factory production line.
 
Sirius Glass said:
Part disappear for all mechanical cameras too.
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However mechanical parts can be modelled and made on 3D printers (yes, metal 3D printing is a thing, although still expensive) or CNC (home CNC setups start at $200 or so) and lathes.

Mechanical cameras can be repaired essentially indefinitely, so long as you can get a part to model, you can continue to service it. They will simply increase in cost to repair over time.
 
The exact same argument can be made for the electronics. It is only a matter of cost effectiveness.

For some things it makes sense to design new electronics - the Boeing B-52 bomber for example. It was introduced in 1955. Many are still in service. None fly the original electronics - which used tubes. If you have the money, the electronics are easily re-designed and replaced.
 
Matt hit the nail on the head. Typical 3D printers and CNC devices can't make durable things like what typically wears out in a mechanical camera, like a timing gear, for example. If you want long-term results, it takes some kind of high-pressure die-cast alloy or special plastic capable of actual precise machining. Melt-casting is no substitute either - that's how nearly all Made-in-PRC junk tools are now is manufactured, and why they fail so fast.

As an adjunct to my own purchasing role before I retired, we had a huge equipment repair department. And the saying is true, "They just don't make things like they used to". Most things today are designed to have a short life and be expendable, even unrepairable. When repair parts are available, they're often worthless. The exception was the very high-end lines tool made in Germany; so that's what we mainly distributed.

If I were still young, it would be interesting to enroll in the Material Science program at the local University (UCB). But from my personal standpoint, I prefer not to buy any kind of machine I can't repair myself; so the simpler, the better; and the less electronics, the better.
 
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DREW WILEY said:
Matt hit the nail on the head. Typical 3D printers and CNC devices can't make durable things like what typically wears out in a mechanical camera, like a timing gear, for example. If you want long-term results, it takes some kind of high-pressure die-cast alloy or special plastic capable of actual precise machining. Melt-casting is no substitute either - that's how nearly all Made-in-PRC junk tools are now is manufactured, and why they fail so fast.
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True, but there's a difference between me making a camera I'll use for a few hundred shots, and me mass-producing a camera designed for a photographer traveling around the world who needs their camera to Absolutely Work No Matter What. My personal camera, I can service every few months, or years, and replace those worn parts with new ones-- because I can manufacture those parts myself.

Not everything needs to be precise out to 15 decimal places and be guaranteed not to fail for 100,000 actuations.
 
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