what about Oriental Seagull paper?

[PHOTOTONE]

People seldom mention working with Oriental Seagull paper. It is still around, and available from several vendors in the USA.

Is it just not popular anymore? Is it now just a private label brand for another well known line lf papers?

At one time, this used to be the "ultimate" b/w paper for many. I, however, have never tried the fibre based Oriental Seagull papers.

 

[Paul Howell]

People seldom mention working with Oriental Seagull paper. It is still around, and available from several vendors in the USA.

Is it just not popular anymore? Is it now just a private label brand for another well known line lf papers?

At one time, this used to be the "ultimate" b/w paper for many. I, however, have never tried the fibre based Oriental Seagull papers.

I have used Seagull in the past and liked it, but not enough to pay the addtional cost compaired to Ilford, Kentmeyer, or for that matter Salvich. I think seagull is the most expensive, or at least near the top of price list. I dont know who makes Seagull, perhaps Fuji.

 

[Andrew Moxom]

Oriental Seagull is still alive and kicking and available at freestyle for very reasonable prices comapred to Ilford and other european papers that have gone up in price significantly. The new priental paper is not the same as those mythical papers they used to make, but still good nonetheless. Ilford, FOMA, and Bergger are more pricey than Oriental...much more!

 

[r-brian]

After many years of printing with RC paper (but to be honest, fairly low volume printing) I decided to make the jump to fiber paper. After studying the different types and manufacturers of FB paper in the Freestyle cataloge, I decided on the Oriental VC FB paper; white whites, black blacks. After the first 25 sheet pack, i'm now ready to open the new 50 sheet pack. So far, so good. At Freestyle, Oriental is CHEAPER than Ilford, Kentmere and others, but a little more expensive than the Arista line of papers. I don't know where Paul is getting his pricing.

As I said, I'm not a master printing by any means, don't do as much printing as I would like but the Oriental paper seems to do what I want it to do.

 

[PHOTOTONE]

As far as pricing is concerned, from the current Freestyle catalog & web site...Ilford Multigrade FB Warmtone 100 8x10 sheets $109.99, Oriental Warmtone VC FB Glossy 100 8x10 sheets $88.49. Ilford Multigrade IV FB Glossy 100 8x10 sheets $84.99, Oriental VC FB Glossy 100 8x10 sheets $69.99. Ilford Gallerie IG2 8x10 100 sheets #2 glossy: $134.99, Oriental G 100 8x10 sheeets Glossy #2: $102.99

So, the Oriental is across the board cheaper than comparable Ilford papers...but more expensive than Private label papers.

 

[David Brown]

I recently purchased some Kentmere and some Oriental FB VC to compare to Ilford MG. I haven't done the tests yet, but I intend to report here when I get around to it.

 

[Paul Howell]

Oriental Seagull is still alive and kicking and available at freestyle for very reasonable prices comapred to Ilford and other european papers that have gone up in price significantly. The new priental paper is not the same as those mythical papers they used to make, but still good nonetheless. Ilford, FOMA, and Bergger are more pricey than Oriental...much more!

100 sheets of Seagull 8X10 FB grade 2 is $102.99. At least $25 more than any others, double Salvich.

 

[Paul Howell]

100 sheets of Seagull 8X10 FB grade 2 is $102.99. At least $25 more than any others, double Salvich.

I stand corrected Galerie is $134, boy has Ilford gone up. I guess I will buy some seagull.

 

[bill spears]

Anyone in the UK using it ??
It used to be about the most expensive paper over here.
Made in Japan I think. I only ever used it very briefly for lith work and it was gorgeous ! Gave much gentler lith look which I really liked.
I think when it first came out it was called Seagull, then the company went under, resurfaced and produced it again but was named Oriental ?
Silverprint was the main stockist over here but it disappeared never to be seen again. I assumed it was out of production
Bill

 

[Anscojohn]

I began using Seagull FB after Zone VI dropped the French-made Brilliant. I found the Seagul completely adquate in comparison. IIRC, it was originally made by Mitsubishi. Don't know who would make it now.

 

[Ole]

I've been using Seagull on and off over the years, and was really glad when I discovered my 10+ years old paper was still good as new.

But most of the time I use Bergger or Ilford Galerie for final prints.

 

[PHOTOTONE]

Foma, Ilford and Bergger are all more expensive than comparable Oriental Seagull papers.

 

[2F/2F]

It is my primary black and white neutral-tone printing paper, both G and VC. It is wonderful. Whether it is the "original" formula or not, I do not know or care. Lots of my pix have dark shadows, and nothing gets them looking as sweet as this paper. IMHO, it puts Ilford Multigrade FB to some serious shame. I will never use MGFB again after using this paper, except to burn off my existing stock of expired gift paper.

 

[PHOTOTONE]

It is my primary black and white neutral-tone printing paper, both G and VC. It is wonderful. Whether it is the "original" formula or not, I do not know or care. Lots of my pix have dark shadows, and nothing gets them looking as sweet as this paper. IMHO, it puts Ilford Multigrade FB to some serious shame. I will never use MGFB again after using this paper, except to burn off my existing stock of expired gift paper.

Thats very positive! Makes me want to order some. It just seemed odd to me that there is very little discussion about this paper. Maybe it is a best kept "secret" paper that many of you love?

 

[2F/2F]

"Thats very positive! Makes me want to order some. It just seemed odd to me that there is very little discussion about this paper. Maybe it is a best kept "secret" paper that many of you love?"

I don't think it is a secret. It is one of the most loved papers of all time.

But it definitely is just an opinion the way I think about it. Others would say the same about MGFB, which I stated I do not like (mostly due to the tone and the look of the shadows). Everybody's negs are different. We all shoot different subjects in different parts of the world in different qualities of light. For what I shoot, and how I like to print it, the Oriental is almost perfect out of the box, without having to adjust my negs. If I wanted to print on MGFB, I'd need to do some testing and adjustments in the way I do things. However, MGFB might be just the same for many people as Oriental is for me. Like anything, you need to try it yourself before buying into what others say about it. The 25-sheet box of 8x10 VC for $21 from Freestyle would be the most economical way for you to try it out, since 8x10 appears to be the smallest size available. You could cut it down into 5x7s and have twice as many chances to experiment, plus lots of 1" thin test strips.

G looks similar to VC, but seems easier to burn and dodge, and looks a little bit more rich, delicate, and sharp (whatever that means). However, using VC will give you a very good idea of what to expect from G.

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

I tested the current Oriental Seagull graded (as opposed to the old Oriental Seagull that I used in the 1980s) a few years ago, and I think it's still quite a nice paper. I have a slight preference for Emaks (slightly better shadow detail, responds nicely to amidol, developer controls, and tones well), but if I weren't printing on Emaks, I'd probably be using Oriental Seagull.

 

[dancqu]

Agfa sold cheap, a least their film. Forte also
was very competitive.They have both closed
up shop. Kodak, Ilford, and Bergger are still
in business.

BTW, haven't I seen recently a huge increase
in Oriental's line up? A large selection of GRADED
RC? Dan

 

[2F/2F]

Interesting, David. Emaks is my "warm" alternative to Oriental, and my other main paper.

 

[removed account4]

blue box seagul paper ... i LOVED it.
i've used the warm tone, "neutral" and vc fiber papers.
it is/was my favorite before i ran out of money and started
buying the most inexpensive paper i could find.

i have some grade 3+ 4 from 1987/8 and it still prints nicely.
i'd buy it again in a heartbeat (if given the money) ..

 

[srs5694]

Agfa sold cheap, a least their film. Forte also
was very competitive.They have both closed
up shop. Kodak, Ilford, and Bergger are still
in business.

Kodak may still be in business, but they ceased production of B&W papers a couple of years ago. Agfa paper, OTOH, is being resurrected under the Adox name, as other threads here on APUG have been discussing.

 

[PHOTOTONE]

Bergger of course, does not make any paper. They contract it out, formerly to Forte, and currently to Ilford/Harman.

 

[Martin Aislabie]

Seagull in the UK

Anyone in the UK using it ??

Silverprint was the main stockist over here but it disappeared never to be seen again. I assumed it was out of production
Bill

Bill - Mr CAD were stocking it

Don't know if they are still doing it

It was v expensive

Martin

 

[dancqu]

BTW, haven't I seen recently a huge increase
in Oriental's line up? A large selection of GRADED
RC? Dan

Yes, I have seen glossy and matt GRADED RC
at B&H, Grades 2, 3, and 4. Oriental Graded RC,
new to me at least a few months ago. Dan

 

[2F/2F]

Yes, I have seen much more RC at Freestyle as well, whether it is new or not.

Unfortunately, they just discontinued their paper for b/w prints from color negs, though. It was very decent.

 

[Tom Stanworth]

Very nice paper! I am finding myself increasingly liking Kentmere Fineprint as a cheaper (UK) faster alternative. neautral tones, tones well, depth etc. Fineprint is preferable to MGIV in all respects IMO unless one wishes for more contrast. Fineprint is a very undervalued paper!

Oriental is probably the finest neutral paper I have ever used, but fineprint is hot on its heels and the speed is very welcome