For Sale WARNING: Scammers most likely operating on the forum.

[AgX]

I've just sighed with relief after a potential dodgy eBay sale, the US buyer it turned out after payment was actually in South Korea, wanting a Customs form with a lower purchase price. He has 100% feedback as a seller and buyer. In the end I just listed the two film holders at £100 each on the customs form/

At customs they are able look at the internet too... So they may wonder about a price significantly under the average.

 

[AnselMortensen]

I think it might help if buyers and sellers here actually left Trader History feedback for each other...

 

[Sirius Glass]

I think it might help if buyers and sellers here actually left Trader History feedback for each other...

I both check and leave Trader History feedback.

 

[Sean]

Isn't it easier to make the Classifieds time related to membership and a number of active posts.

I've just sighed with relief after a potential dodgy eBay sale, the US buyer it turned out after payment was actually in South Korea, wanting a Customs form with a lower purchase price. He has 100% feedback as a seller and buyer. In the end I just listed the two film holders at £100 each on the customs form/

eBay feedback today was just - Great. a relief, but sales here have less protection. Saying that I've bought into the $1000's here cameras, lenses, etc, all good honest purchases, but all long time members.

Ian

They need 20 posts to send PMs which usually helps us catch them out as they post quickly to get to the limit. When we see that happening we can then examine the account for telltale signs of a scammer. It seems their number one weapon is private messages and hitting people with WTB ads. It's hard to lock down private messages without affecting a lot of folks. One idea might be to charge $1 for lifetime PM access (subscribers would already have it). Most scammers will not go for this $1 charge as subscribing connects them to a paper trail.

 

[AgX]

They need 20 posts to send PMs which usually helps us catch them out as they post quickly to get to the limit. When we see that happening we can then examine the account for telltale signs of a scammer.

In this case the 20 posts were made within 10min. If then this falls into a moderationless time, the scammer might have enough time to contact members interested in a deal, and doing this way.

But as said, it also is to oneself to beware and not to rely on moderators.

 

[MattKing]

I've deleted the acknowledged as "smart ass" remark, and the responses to it.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

The $1 lifetime charge to PM sounds good to me. Whatever it takes, Sean.

 

[Disconnekt]

I reported this clown a day ago. He/she was posting blank replies to old threads. It
dodn't look right so I reported this person.

Yeah, when he messaged me I checked his profile & saw that he had just barely made his account a day before, and alot of his posts where either emojis or just periods on various posts which made me very weary & decided not to answer him/email him.

 

[Ian Grant]

I think we all have to help each other and Sean and the Moderator team in alerting them to these potential scammers. We need to watch for posts that aren't particularly relevant fon new members. While the 20 posts before you can send a PM is quite reasonable, maybe a limit as well in the number of posts a new member can make a day. Then a longer time before a new member can access the Classifieds, maybe a month.

Personally, I haven't used the Classifieds here for some time, for other reasons, but over the years have had numerous flawless dealing with members I'd guess spending maybe over £2,000/$2,400 and probably quite a bit more.

I would not buy/sell anything to someone who just signed up here. They have to have a history here first.

I think in my case, nearly all the people I've bought from here have been very active members of the Forum, particularly when I've placed Wanted adverts.

Ian

 

[AgX]

I think we all have to help each other and Sean and the Moderator team in alerting them to these potential scammers.

Well, some members here see other members doing reporting as "police"...

But I reported a lot of spam postings so far, did so in this very case the moment I saw these many nonsense postings about an hour after their upload. And it turned out other members did so too, so seemingly that spam reporting as such already works.



The only thing that might be added to us reporting is Don's idea of immediate, automatic locking of a new member after being reported:

What if the new member had a "probationary" status that, in conjunction with the 20 post, 5 day minimum, would see his/her privileges put on hold if he/she was reported - prior to any review in moderation. It would amount to a minor inconvenience to authentic members being incorrectly reported, but it would stop potential scammers while they awaited moderation.

 

[binglebugbob]

I have had one experience here with someone replying to "want to buy" posts. I found him with a Google search working other sites as well. He had BMW motorcycles and all kinds of stuff posted for sale on a variety of forums. Anyone offering big ticket items with a track record of a only a few days is a red flag.

 

[KerrKid]

As a fairly new member to the site, I can say that I came here in order to learn as much as I could about photography and gather equipment for the hobby. If I couldn't buy equipment right away from people I thought I could trust, I'd be stuck with eBay, Etsy, Craigslist, and thrift stores. Not that those are all bad, but there's nothing like buying from people you feel you can trust.

 

[Simon Benton]

Unfortunately I got scammed by this crook yesterday when he replied that he had some negative colour film that I had in a WTB. Amount is not large and I paid by PayPal FF so no chance of any recompense by PayPal. I have only just read the scammer warning and should have done more due diligence. Now older and hopefully a bit wiser.

 

[logan2z]

Unfortunately I got scammed by this crook yesterday when he replied that he had some negative colour film that I had in a WTB. Amount is not large and I paid by PayPal FF so no chance of any recompense by PayPal. I have only just read the scammer warning and should have done more due diligence. Now older and hopefully a bit wiser.

Sorry to hear you got scammed.

Never pay for goods or services using F&F. If a seller insists on it then walk away. It's against PayPal's terms of service to request F&F payment and there's obviously no safeguards in place when paying that way.

 

[BobUK]

We are all wiser after the event.
Ian Grant has a good idea about membership track record, but it is not fool proof.
FADU PHOTO in the UK doesn't even allow photographs to be added until a few posts have been made, so a few months of active membership before trading may be a way forward.
If a thief has patience though, nothing will stop them.
Finally, lets stop using words like mugged etc. it is base theft by a deceitful thief, and that's putting it politely.

Sorry to hear of your loss.

 

[AgX]

As a fairly new member to the site, I can say that I came here in order to learn as much as I could about photography and gather equipment for the hobby. If I couldn't buy equipment right away from people I thought I could trust, I'd be stuck with eBay, Etsy, Craigslist, and thrift stores. Not that those are all bad, but there's nothing like buying from people you feel you can trust.

Well, that seemed the original idea of the classifieds at Apug: members buying, selling, trading or gifting with members.

And to me members in this context are people participating at the forum, and be it even silently. But for these members it should not be their highest priority to interact at the classifieds the moment they join.


As a side note, I repeatedly pm'ed sellers of items here, not to buy but just for asking something about that thing, just out of my curiosity. And I got nice replies.
Try this at a true commercial site or with commercial sellers here...

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Well, that seemed the original idea of the classifieds at Apug: members buying, selling, trading or gifting with members.

And to me members in this context are people participating at the forum, and be it even silently. But for these members it should not be their highest priority to interact at the classifieds the moment they join.


As a side note, I repeatedly pm'ed sellers of items here, not to buy but just for asking something about that thing, just out of my curiosity. And I got nice replies.
Try this at a true commercial site or with commercial sellers here...

That's good advice.

 

[tallenpatterson]

PayPal invoicing or goods/services only. Offers buyer protection. The others, as you can see, not so much. I run the Fuji X USA sales group on FB and it is the only way to do it.

 

[JMB]

Hi all, I am sorry to say that I most likely got scammed on a WTB ad I put here. There is a 1% chance it is not a scam, so I won't name the person until they fail to make good, but I wanted to get it out there as their profile shows them looking at other classifieds so if this is with bad intent they are most likely engaging with other folks.

Long story short: I put an ad looking for a broken Coolscan for parts, they responded and we set a price which I paid over venmo. They now are claiming that there is a problem with the venmo transaction, and that I will get my money back in 72 days from Venmo (they know this because it has happened before), but please pay again using an alternate route. This is clearly not how Venmo works, and a 72 day period to get the money back????

Warning flags I see now: New account created last friday, no forum activity/normal posts, wanted to make the transaction over Zelle initially (which is a favorite of scammers). I should have paid more attention.

I'll update this post either way with how this progresses, if it is a misunderstanding I'll publically acknowledge this, otherwise I'll update with the name of the seller (but it is new account so....).

Anyway, keep your wits about you. I have had very good luck buying here before, but it's the internet so this is a lesson for me and hopefully my mistake can help someone else.

Responses to Wanted to Buy listings appear to warrant special scrutiny. I had two attempted scams in response to my WTB listing for a LOMO 8 mm film developing tank last April. He used different addresses each time. I won't list the addresses since I did not bite and cannot be 100% certain a scam was afoot.

 

[Don_ih]

It might be good, if you receive a message on a WTB listing, for the buyer to invite a moderator into the conversation. Scammers will be put off if there is a third party present - especially a third party who can see the scammer is offering to sell everything everyone everywhere wants to buy.

 

[pentaxuser]

He used different addresses each time. I won't list the addresses since I did not bite and cannot be 100% certain a scam was afoot.

Maybe therein lies another advantage for the scammers, namely as honest buyers we can never be sure that a scam was afoot and our instinct is to give the benefit of the doubt

pentaxuser

 

[BMbikerider]

Thanks for naming him/her. I have just posted this onto two more UK Based Photo Forums I use. If they are not paying anything they will try anywhere.

 

[MattKing]

It might be good, if you receive a message on a WTB listing, for the buyer to invite a moderator into the conversation. Scammers will be put off if there is a third party present - especially a third party who can see the scammer is offering to sell everything everyone everywhere wants to buy.

Well ....
There are not a lot of moderators to go around.
And we would rather not be involved in legitimate transactions, because we really don't need your private shipping and financial information.
If the Conversation is initiated by the potential seller, they control whether or not another party can be added to the Conversation. So you would need to start another Conversation yourself, and ad them and us.
All that being said, if you need our help, and can be patient with time differences and availability, I'd be unlikely to refuse.

 

[BrianShaw]

Going back to the basics is, generally, a worthwhile thing to do... unless someone is quite reasonably upset by such a proposal:

*** Classified Ad Rules ***

To reinforce what the site terms state, this classifieds system is "use at your own risk". You must be a Subscriber to post classified ads, subscription information can be found by through the "Support Us!" link higher up the screen. Members are still welcome to browse ads and contact ad...

www.photrio.com

 

[Don_ih]

Well ....
There are not a lot of moderators to go around.
And we would rather not be involved in legitimate transactions, because we really don't need your private shipping and financial information.
If the Conversation is initiated by the potential seller, they control whether or not another party can be added to the Conversation. So you would need to start another Conversation yourself, and ad them and us.
All that being said, if you need our help, and can be patient with time differences and availability, I'd be unlikely to refuse.

There are undoubtedly few moderators. There are also few WTB ads. There are fewer still new-members-trying-to-sell. I don't think it would overrun the system.

If the two people who had been scammed by this person had said, "Oh, wait. Let me restart this conversation with a moderator involved." .... What would have happened?