Using and replenishing XTOL

[Sirius Glass]

I use undiluted replenished XTOL in Jobo tanks for 35mm, 120 and 4"x5" film. I use the Jobo set to 'P' for 35mm and 120, and to '4' for 4"x5" for agitation.

 

[NJH]

I put two rolls on Jobo reels many times without problems and then ruined four rolls on two reels after a trip. Never again.

One great thing about using a replenished developer is that there is no cost penalty to processing 1 roll or 2 rolls of 120 at a time, in the same working volume. This thread has certainly got me interested in trying XTOL once my current developers are used up.

 

[c41]

I made it to somewhere between 50 and 100 rolls across 6 months using a 2.5 litre tub of replenished XTOL (from the knowledge gained on this thread.)

Then I found my replenished XTOL getting quite foamy on top. I developed a roll of 35mm, I only used 300ml (enough but I could have used more of course)
The roll came out with an obvious development effect from bubbles - right across the top of the whole roll- something I've never experienced before - very clearly from the foam that formed during inversion development.

Is the foam something normal - or maybe contaminated developer?
It made me think of 'hot break' from my days making wort/brewing beer.

Below is an example image from the roll. I've had to leave the replenished XTOL for now, this roll wasn't important but... just burning through stock mixed 1:1 until I decide on my next move.

 

[John Wiegerink]

I made it to somewhere between 50 and 100 rolls across 6 months using a 2.5 litre tub of replenished XTOL (from the knowledge gained on this thread.)

Then I found my replenished XTOL getting quite foamy on top. I developed a roll of 35mm, I only used 300ml (enough but I could have used more of course)
The roll came out with an obvious development effect from bubbles - right across the top of the whole roll- something I've never experienced before - very clearly from the foam that formed during inversion development.

Is the foam something normal - or maybe contaminated developer?
It made me think of 'hot break' from my days making wort/brewing beer.

Below is an example image from the roll. I've had to leave the replenished XTOL for now, this roll wasn't important but... just burning through stock mixed 1:1 until I decide on my next move.
View attachment 198171

Are you sure those aren't alien clouds? Just joking of course. My batch is going on 3yrs old and has never had so much as a bubble. You aren't using any photo Flo in a pre-rinse by any chance? JohnW

 

[c41]

Thanks. Rarely seen 'Bubbular clouds' did cross my mind but the portrait shots gave the game up - the froth coming out of the dev tank was another hint in retrospect.
I think it must have been cross-contamination from Photo-Flo then. Probably a poorly cleaned tank. I'll have to up my cleaning game and start my replenishment again too.

 

[K-G]

Thanks. Rarely seen 'Bubbular clouds' did cross my mind but the portrait shots gave the game up - the froth coming out of the dev tank was another hint in retrospect.
I think it must have been cross-contamination from Photo-Flo then. Probably a poorly cleaned tank. I'll have to up my cleaning game and start my replenishment again too.

View attachment 198199

Also use one of the benefits with replenished Xtol and increase the volume of developer per film. In this way the foam on top of the developer will have a better chance to stay away from the film and you need not add any more replenisher.

Karl-Gustaf

 

[John Wiegerink]

Thanks. Rarely seen 'Bubbular clouds' did cross my mind but the portrait shots gave the game up - the froth coming out of the dev tank was another hint in retrospect.
I think it must have been cross-contamination from Photo-Flo then. Probably a poorly cleaned tank. I'll have to up my cleaning game and start my replenishment again too.

View attachment 198199

I really don't know what to tell you. I do know that I always pour my used Xtol developer into a beaker and leave until I'm completely done and my roll is hanging. when I pour the developer into the beaker there are a few instant bubble but are gone in two seconds. Your foaming/bubbles sound much different. You might be right about the cross-contamination. JohnW

 

[Sirius Glass]

I made it to somewhere between 50 and 100 rolls across 6 months using a 2.5 litre tub of replenished XTOL (from the knowledge gained on this thread.)

Then I found my replenished XTOL getting quite foamy on top. I developed a roll of 35mm, I only used 300ml (enough but I could have used more of course)
The roll came out with an obvious development effect from bubbles - right across the top of the whole roll- something I've never experienced before - very clearly from the foam that formed during inversion development.

Is the foam something normal - or maybe contaminated developer?
It made me think of 'hot break' from my days making wort/brewing beer.

Below is an example image from the roll. I've had to leave the replenished XTOL for now, this roll wasn't important but... just burning through stock mixed 1:1 until I decide on my next move.
View attachment 198171

I would retire [dump] that XTOL batch, and start a new replenished XTOL if I had bubbles like that and especially if the bubbles were messing up the development.

 

[c41]

I did tip that batch. No value in risking further problems, I’ll just start over. I’ll do my PhotoFlo in a separate container in future, not the inversion tank and with film off the reel to keep developing and rinse agent fully separated.

There was quite a bit of silvery sludge in the replenished XTOL too. I might consider decanting it every 15 rolls, i can’t imagine it was contributing anything positive to my negatives.

And thanks Karl, I’ll always overfill a little now, may as well.

I’ll also have to add a new mnemonic to my ‘if it’s brown, tip it down’ lol.

If it’s foamy, don’t use it homey?

 

[Huub]

I am planning to set up a replenishment system with XTOL, but asking myself about doing a presoak for 4x5, mainly to get rid of the anti-halation layer. When using a developer as one stock, the anti-halation layer is dumped with the developer, but in a replenishment system it would build up time after time, changing the colour of the developer into some dark tint. This might not have any negative consequences, but i was just wondering how other people handle this.

 

[markbarendt]

I am planning to set up a replenishment system with XTOL, but asking myself about doing a presoak for 4x5, mainly to get rid of the anti-halation layer. When using a developer as one stock, the anti-halation layer is dumped with the developer, but in a replenishment system it would build up time after time, changing the colour of the developer into some dark tint. This might not have any negative consequences, but i was just wondering how other people handle this.

It doesn’t require any presoak or special anything, just follow the instructions for the replenished process.

The ‘leftovers’ that come off the film are an integral part of the process.

 

[c41]

Going back to Post #129 above. I did tip that batch of XTOL. I then cleaned all my equipment.
I also changed my process so that Photo-Flo now never contacts my reels or my Paterson dev tank.

I developed two rolls in my replenished XTOL at the weekend. Huge foam!
When I burped the Paterson tank after 3 minutes, the foam burst out like a shaken bottle of beer.
When I finished development and emptied the tank, there was a 1/2" head of foam on there.

The rolls show no signs of 'alien clouds' because I now overfill with developer.
But now I have another foamy bottle of replenished XTOL to tip. Maybe 30 rolls is my guess before it got too bad this time.

My chemistry setup is replenished XTOL, Ifostop then Hypam fixer then wash for 6 minutes.
The Photo-flo doesn't contact any of those things.
I only ever use a tiny amount anyway and the XTOL foam I see is not at all like a detergent foam.

The XTOL foam is not from the Photo-Flo is my conclusion - searching other user experiences seems to match.
It seems like the end for me and XTOL replenishment. A real shame as it was very convenient.

I'm imagining I can't be the only one who experienced the XTOL foam like this.
For now I am defeated and will return to 1 shot use.

 

[Smudger]

Your image artifacts are likely a product of inadequate tank agitation,maybe a product of your water supply. I have used Xtol/R for some years,without your symptoms. Try a "rough bounce" - which means thumping your tank,at least twice,after each inversion cycle. I do this for at least the first 6 repeats. And,with Xtol/R,you have the relief of knowing you are not wasting the developer. Caution : a Rough Bounce involves caution - Paterson tanks are brittle-Jobo not so much. A 2inch drop onto a hard surface will suffice.And using a larger tank will lift the foam level above your film..

 

[Tom Kershaw]

I've experienced a variant of the "bubbles on film" problem in the past which in my case was traceable to wetting agent cross contamination, so I now always pull the film off the reel and see-saw it through a wetting agent solution in a separate container.

 

[MattKing]

I developed two rolls in my replenished XTOL at the weekend. Huge foam!
When I burped the Paterson tank after 3 minutes, the foam burst out like a shaken bottle of beer.
When I finished development and emptied the tank, there was a 1/2" head of foam on there.

What type of water do you mix your X-Tol with?
And what type of agitation do you use (how vigorous)?

 

[saman13]

After about 3 months of not shooting any film, I shot a roll of Acros in NYC. During those three months, the replenished XTOL had sat in a room that probably regularly reached the mid 80s, so I was pretty nervous about using it considering this was a pretty important roll of film for me (visiting friends from college) but I didn't have any other developer so I added 80ml of fresh solution and went with it anyways.

Results were awesome! Great looking negatives with no loss in speed. Really, replenished XTOL has to be one of the best developers. Whoever says that it only works if you're shooting a lot of film is just wrong.

The contrast is a little high because room temperature for my darkroom is 78-80 degrees (summer in Florida), but I think the punchy look fits the scenes well.

 

[John Wiegerink]

After about 3 months of not shooting any film, I shot a roll of Acros in NYC. During those three months, the replenished XTOL had sat in a room that probably regularly reached the mid 80s, so I was pretty nervous about using it considering this was a pretty important roll of film for me (visiting friends from college) but I didn't have any other developer so I added 80ml of fresh solution and went with it anyways.

Results were awesome! Great looking negatives with no loss in speed. Really, replenished XTOL has to be one of the best developers. Whoever says that it only works if you're shooting a lot of film is just wrong.

The contrast is a little high because room temperature for my darkroom is 78-80 degrees (summer in Florida), but I think the punchy look fits the scenes well.
View attachment 208284 View attachment 208283

I like the roof shot, but miss the bubbler clouds. Ha-ha! I think you and Xtol-R will get along just fine. JohnW

 

[Serg Lavrenchuk]

Trying to run a replenished stock Mytol version with rebuild leader transport C41 machine. The developer is running for about 1.5 months. Tanks size is 10L with very strong agitation/mixing (as c41 Noritsu v30 have).
When the developer was mixed ph was 8.20-8.25 (we mixed 4 times by 5 L with some fluctuations in Ph). But generally what was expected.
Initial relp.=70ml/36film as adviced for XTol but machine tend to over-replenish (I think 80-90 ml / film). About 5 bw films are processed average a day with some days 10+ and some 0.

Every day we process few strips from sensitometer to track contrast change. Fisrt 3-4 weeks time was slowly drifting down and then one day everything changes a lot (time film effective speed etc).
I thought that developed died due to some errors / contaminations / overoxidation with too strong agitation-pumping in the tank. Ph meter showed 8.40+ in the tank and 8,25 in the repl tank.

But rereading a lot of information avaraged to the feeling that is not that easy to kill 10L of xtol in 1 month. I have replenished 0.7 L and measured 8.35 in the tank. Surprising was that that didn't show on test-strip CI but little bit on effective speed.

At last the question
1. should replenished bath on xtol / mytol have that same 8.20-8.25 pH all the time of it would be stabilized on some other digit?
2. how much lose of film speed is OK with replenished bath? It looks like we are coming to -1 stop already from the fresh state (speed point moved from 8.6 th field to 10th on (21 guide - 0.15 per step) for fp4+ film.

Thanks for help with info.