Using a Speed Graphic hand held - doable?

Ian Grant · May 29, 2012

All the Speed Graphics use a continuous curtain with a number of fixed width slits, usually four.

The Thornton Pickard Company in Altrincham near Manchester in the UK were the pioneers of early roller blind shutters and held a number of Patents including variable slit focal plane shutters. John Edward Thornton left the company in 1899 and went on to licence his film pack to ROC (later EK) and early tri-colour cine film to Eastman Kodak.

Presumably the Graflex shutter curtain was a way around the Patents.

Ian

E. von Hoegh · May 29, 2012

hoffy said:
Howdy,

Maybe I had too much time on my hands on a Lazy Sunday, maybe it was the Mexican I had for dinner, but I can feel some GAS coming on.

Now, since I have had some fun of late going to retro car shows and Rock'n'Roll festivals, I was thinking a Speed Graphic might be a good way to get into Large Format, as well as being a bit of fun at such shows.

OK, so we are all well aware that Speed Graphics were the Press cameras of choice back in the day. What I want to know is how hand holdable is using one of these cameras (assuming that the said camera is range finder equipped)? Or would I be better off sticking with something like my Koni-Omega and keeping the Large Format on the tripod?

Cheers.

Hand-holdable? You've got to be kidding. Those days are gone, albeit memorialised in countless old movies and some annoying commercials on TV.
You see, human physiology has changed over the years, rendering it impossible for modern humans to hold and use tools. All those millions of years of evolution, culminating in the opposable thumb and the brain adapted to utilise it are for naught. I mean, you have to not only hold the camera reasonably still, you have to manage the filmholders, remember to remove and replace darkslides, meter and set the exposure, focus, etcetera etcetera. It's just too much for the modern abbreviated attention span to comprehend.

Richard S. (rich815) · May 29, 2012

E. von Hoegh said:
Hand-holdable? You've got to be kidding. Those days are gone, albeit memorialised in countless old movies and some annoying commercials on TV.
You see, human physiology has changed over the years, rendering it impossible for modern humans to hold and use tools. All those millions of years of evolution, culminating in the opposable thumb and the brain adapted to utilise it are for naught. I mean, you have to not only hold the camera reasonably still, you have to manage the filmholders, remember to remove and replace darkslides, meter and set the exposure, focus, etcetera etcetera. It's just too much for the modern abbreviated attention span to comprehend.

And if you could somehow bring someone from that era to this one and ask which they'd prefer to use, that as you describe or what they could make use of today, what do you think the vast majority of them would say?

E. von Hoegh · May 29, 2012

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sarcasm

It was a rather pointless question, the Speed Graphic was designed to be hand holdable.

Today? If I wanted to hand-hold 4x5, I'd use my Linhof. If I simply wanted to record an event on film, I'd use my Nikon F and 35mm lens.

I suspect the time traveler would want something smaller, lighter, and digital. Said traveler was using the gear available at the time, not looking for a "retro" statement.

Photo Engineer · May 29, 2012

If I wanted hand held LF today, I would use an i-Pad!

PE

E. von Hoegh · May 29, 2012

Photo Engineer said:
If I wanted hand held LF today, I would use an i-Pad!

PE

Heresy! Quick, put the tongs in the fire...

Richard S. (rich815) · May 29, 2012

E. von Hoegh said:
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sarcasm

It was a rather pointless question, the Speed Graphic was designed to be hand holdable.

Today? If I wanted to hand-hold 4x5, I'd use my Linhof. If I simply wanted to record an event on film, I'd use my Nikon F and 35mm lens.

I suspect the time traveler would want something smaller, lighter, and digital. Said traveler was using the gear available at the time, not looking for a "retro" statement.

Yup. I was agreeing with you.

Richard S. (rich815) · May 29, 2012

I have a Speed Graphic but would only use hand-held with a flash I think. Got my modified Polaroid 110B with 4x5 back for my hand held "snap shots"! Ha ha.

Ian Grant · May 29, 2012

I do use 5x4 Graflex cameras hand-held mainly out of necessity where tripods aren't permitted. I was using my pre-Anniversary Speed Graphic (ocassionally) and a Pacemaker Crown Graphic (mostly) for about 4 or 5 years until I found a bargain Super Graphic which allows me more movements..

It meant rethinking because prior to working hand-held I always used slow films, longish shutter speeds and I didn't want a compromise my final print quality. Now I use HP5 when working hand held and that enables me to use faster shutter speeds and f22. I tend to use slight movements and focus on the screen - the Crown & Super Graphics both have fresnel screens making them easy to use with just the focus-hood & no darkcloth.

It's slightly more of a learning curve than working with a tripod but yes it's very doable.

Ian

BrianShaw · May 29, 2012

E. von Hoegh said:
Heresy! Quick, put the tongs in the fire...

There are lots of heretics. Quick, get more tongs!

Sirius Glass · May 29, 2012

rich815 said:
I have a Speed Graphic but would only use hand-held with a flash I think. Got my modified Polaroid 110B with 4x5 back for my hand held "snap shots"! Ha ha.

Outside on a bright sunny day?

Richard S. (rich815) · May 29, 2012

Sirius Glass said:
Outside on a bright sunny day?

Overall I do not find myself out shooting on bright sunny days too much, at least not something I'd do handheld usually. But if I did and the light was sufficient I guess I would, sure.

lxdude · May 29, 2012

hoffy said:
maybe it was the Mexican I had for dinner,
but I can feel some GAS coming on.

You're a cannibal?

Sirius Glass · May 29, 2012

Did you per chance mean "a can of bull"?

Jus' sayin'

hoffy · May 29, 2012

E. von Hoegh said:
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sarcasm

It was a rather pointless question, the Speed Graphic was designed to be hand holdable.

Today? If I wanted to hand-hold 4x5, I'd use my Linhof. If I simply wanted to record an event on film, I'd use my Nikon F and 35mm lens.

I suspect the time traveler would want something smaller, lighter, and digital. Said traveler was using the gear available at the time, not looking for a "retro" statement.

Yep, I get sarcasm and the internet has your response on file for the record.

Silly me for asking obvious questions. I think twice next time.

Now, back to normal programming.

Lets consider I was to get something like a Crown/Speed Graphic, what will I miss? I believe that these cannot be folded up like a pretzel (I saw that quoted somewhere). In real world scenarios, where will using a camera like this be limited?

Thanks

Sirius Glass · May 29, 2012

The Crown and Speed Graphic fold nicely into a box shape. Both have limited movements; enough for me but not as much a view cameras.

David A. Goldfarb · May 29, 2012

It's quite rare that view cameras are actually used with all the movements shown in advertisements for view cameras. There are times where you want one extreme movement, but not all of them at once. With a more limited camera, you just have to get creative about indirect movements, and you can do more than you might guess.

removed account4 · May 29, 2012

hoffy said:
Yep, I get sarcasm and the internet has your response on file for the record.

Silly me for asking obvious questions. I think twice next time.

Now, back to normal programming.

Lets consider I was to get something like a Crown/Speed Graphic, what will I miss? I believe that these cannot be folded up like a pretzel (I saw that quoted somewhere). In real world scenarios, where will using a camera like this be limited?

Thanks

hi hoffy

its just a big 35m camera with a tiny bit of rise.
good for stuff you don't need to do perspective control ..
great for portraits, documentary stuff &c ....

and you CAN strap a flash on the camera, and shoot it on bright sunny days ..
as long as your lens is syn'd ... ( leaf shutters sync at all speeds ) but if you use the focal plane shutter
you are kind of limited as to what you can use for a flash ( bulbs )

i for a long time attached a 200/400ws lumedyne head ( on a bacharach bracket )
to the tripod socket on the side, and shot it with a flash in bright daylight ... fill flash
or main light ... just meter and expose accordingly ... when i was shooting for a newspaper in the 90s
i would sometimes bring a 35mm camera and the speed graphic along for kicks ... it was fun

have fun !
john

ambaker · May 29, 2012

Photo Engineer said:
If anyone is interested, I have 2 Graphics of different age, and one mini Graphic 3.25 x 4.25 and a baby Watson.

Come by here and you can try them out. I might even give you one!

PE

Road Trip! ;-)

The 3.25 x 4.25 is the one I don't have.

As a kid I remember going to the races (cars) and seeing the track photographers in each turn with their press cameras, hand holding them at night. I assume they were likely speed graphics. I remember the flashes going off, and boy did I want one of those.

I never could understand why my Mom would not let me upgrade to one of those, from my Brownie Star flash, at all of 10 years old.

Photo Engineer · May 29, 2012

And now you are too old for one!

PE

Paul Howell · May 30, 2012

David A. Goldfarb said:
It's quite rare that view cameras are actually used with all the movements shown in advertisements for view cameras. There are times where you want one extreme movement, but not all of them at once. With a more limited camera, you just have to get creative about indirect movements, and you can do more than you might guess.

I agree, I have both view and press cameras, Speed and Crown, the Crown has somewhat more movement than my old Speed in most cases enough for landscapes, but not enough for artchitectural which is why I still keep my old Brand view. I do shoot some 4X5 handheld but I use the rangfinder and viewfinder so using a lot of movement will be tough to judge. I guess you could use the ground back, but in my way of thinking may be counterproducitve to shooting hand held.

Ian Grant · May 30, 2012

PDH said:
I agree, I have both view and press cameras, Speed and Crown, the Crown has somewhat more movement than my old Speed in most cases enough for landscapes, but not enough for artchitectural which is why I still keep my old Brand view. I do shoot some 4X5 handheld but I use the rangfinder and viewfinder so using a lot of movement will be tough to judge. I guess you could use the ground back, but in my way of thinking may be counterproducitve to shooting hand held.

Strangely I've found it quite easy using movements with my Crown and Super Graphics (my Speed Graphic isn't standard) and I focus on the screen but then use the Wire finderto shoot.

I'd add that I've now modified a Supwr Graphic front standard and it now fits my pre-Anniversary Speed Graphic and Pacemaker Speed & Crown Grphice, that opens up opportunities in terms of front ovements.

Ian

hoffy · May 30, 2012

Oh, I should have quantified that if I was to get such a camera it won't only be used hand held!

Cheers

mopar_guy · May 31, 2012

Worth a look...

http://museum.icp.org/museum/collections/special/weegee/

Newt_on_Swings · May 31, 2012

mopar_guy said:
Worth a look...

http://museum.icp.org/museum/collections/special/weegee/

It was a cool show, I saw it a few months back at the ICP. They had a recreation of his room as well as a wall of how his first show was setup. Many of his shots were done with a flash.

Using a Speed Graphic hand held - doable?

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