Unsuccessful C41 attempt with Fuji Hunt chems help

Radost · Feb 28, 2022

I followed the instructions. Used a paterson tank. left the bleach and the fixer a little longer.
Washed 5,10,20,30 inversions after bleach , and after fix.
I get redish cast on all pictures. It is not my scanning because my lab devs scan great.
I am prewashing in 100F and development is 3:15 in 100f.
I poor the bleach almost right away.
Also on both films I get streaks on top and bottom.
What am i doing wrong?

pentaxuser · Feb 28, 2022

What colours should the wall, tree and what looks like a reddish/orange carpet look like? Were the pinkish slabs a neutral white- grey colour Unfortunately this scene in its correct colours looks to be an unnatural scene of few colours

It might help if you were to show us scans of other negatives as well that have a bigger range of colours.

Your process appears to be done correctly so it leaves me wondering if somehow the problem is with your scanner

However I do not know enough about scanning to even begin to say what the scanning problem might be

Have you tried asking someone else to scan this negative or asking your lab to do so. What it might say might be useful

I have assumed that the chemicals were fresh.

pentaxuser

foc · Feb 28, 2022

Can you explain how you scanned and how you produced the positive image, please?
It would also be handy if you let us know the brand and type of film used, (eg: Fuji C200) and if it was fresh or not.
Also if you could show the negative with the edge markings please.

Radost · Feb 28, 2022

foc said:
Can you explain how you scanned and how you produced the positive image, please?
It would also be handy if you let us know the brand and type of film used, (eg: Fuji C200) and if it was fresh or not.
Also if you could show the negative with the edge markings please.

Portra 400 Scanned with PI Primefilm XAS as Raw image and also with negafix portra 400. My lab scans in the same setting look fine.
The film was shot in October 2021

Radost · Feb 28, 2022

pentaxuser said:
What colours should the wall, tree and what looks like a reddish/orange carpet look like? Were the pinkish slabs a neutral white- grey colour Unfortunately this scene in its correct colours looks to be an unnatural scene of few colours

It might help if you were to show us scans of other negatives as well that have a bigger range of colours.

Your process appears to be done correctly so it leaves me wondering if somehow the problem is with your scanner

However I do not know enough about scanning to even begin to say what the scanning problem might be

Have you tried asking someone else to scan this negative or asking your lab to do so. What it might say might be useful

I have assumed that the chemicals were fresh.

pentaxuser

Chems was just opened purchased last summer. They have no exp date so maybe i was sold very old chems.
Other negatives look the same.
It is not the scanner because my lab scans look fine scanned back to back with my dev.

koraks · Mar 1, 2022

At first glance I'd say you have a problem with silver retention, which would mean your bleach didn't do its job properly.

Please share a bit more about the chemicals and your processing. Specifically what do you mean by:

Radost said:
left the bleach and the fixer a little longer.

I don't know what that means...

Btw, note that bleach keeps very well; essentially indefinitely. Fixer does deteriorate; if the fixer concentrate has thrown down a white/yellowish precipitate in its container, it's bad. It should be crystal clear.

Good job on posting a picture of the negative, but please also post a photograph of the negative strip on e.g. a light table or against any other diffuse light source, preferably side by side with a known-good lab-developed strip of C41 film.

Radost · Mar 1, 2022

koraks said:
At first glance I'd say you have a problem with silver retention, which would mean your bleach didn't do its job properly.

Please share a bit more about the chemicals and your processing. Specifically what do you mean by:

I don't know what that means...

Btw, note that bleach keeps very well; essentially indefinitely. Fixer does deteriorate; if the fixer concentrate has thrown down a white/yellowish precipitate in its container, it's bad. It should be crystal clear.

Good job on posting a picture of the negative, but please also post a photograph of the negative strip on e.g. a light table or against any other diffuse light source, preferably side by side with a known-good lab-developed strip of C41 film.

1 year old Fuji hunt just opened and mixed 1L containers
I bleached for 8 minutes and fixed for 8 minutes after my first bad roll. I was told red cast means bleach is not working good so I tried to bleach and fix a little extra.
Will post pictures of negs later

foc · Mar 1, 2022

@Radost . Thank you for your detailed reply. I look forward to seeing the negs and edge markings.

A quick and simple way to see if a negative has retained silver, not bleached enough, is to hold the neg, emulsion side up. Then tile it back and forth and from side to side and see if the viewed image appears to change from negative to a dull positive.

BMbikerider · Mar 1, 2022

I have used FUJI C41 developer once and long before I got even half way through the 5 litre kit it started to go off. Reluctantly I threw away what was left. (I can only buy Fuji in 5 ltr size in UK. I now use a 5 lite kit sold under what is named Digibase and this I have found to be so stable even after many films (I have lost count) it delivers the goods and is as good as it was when 1st opened several months ago. You may well have fallen foul of either a kit that was expired or is well on the way after opening it up.

koraks · Mar 1, 2022

BMbikerider said:
Digibase

Which is Fuji Hunt.

pentaxuser · Mar 1, 2022

koraks said:
Which is Fuji Hunt.

So Fuji Hunt now makes the Digibase kits and/or always have made the Digibase kits? Is it in effect the exact same chemicals as in the Fuji Hunt kit? Who I wonder makes the packaging and finishing? By this I mean the bottles, filling the bottles, the instructions etc

Thanks

pentaxuser

koraks · Mar 1, 2022

AFAIK it has always been Fuji Hunt. I assume they do the confectioning as well, so Rollei only has to deal with part of the logistics and branding/marketing.

pentaxuser · Mar 1, 2022

Thanks, koraks. I assume from this that it must have been the size of the 5L Fuji Hunt kit that then made the difference in BMbikerider's experience. It was just too much to use in the period within which it could be expected to remain good and a Digibase kit of the same size would have had the same result?

pentaxuser

brbo · Mar 1, 2022

Digibase is probably from Fuji Hunt, but almost cetrainly not the same as the Fuji Hunt X-Press C-41 kit (that is presumably the kit the OP is using). AFAIK, Digibase requires the use of developer starter that is not part of the Fuji X-Press C-41 kit.

BMbikerider · Mar 1, 2022

pentaxuser said:
Thanks, koraks. I assume from this that it must have been the size of the 5L Fuji Hunt kit that then made the difference in BMbikerider's experience. It was just too much to use in the period within which it could be expected to remain good and a Digibase kit of the same size would have had the same result?

pentaxuser

My Digibase kit is made under the Rollie brand the and I have just checked the 5ltr kit is no longer available but there is a 1 and 1/2 litre kits which works out as being a lot more expensive. I wonder if the reason the Digibase kit is so long lived is due to the starter being left out until the working dilution is made.

AgX · Mar 1, 2022

koraks said:
AFAIK it has always been Fuji Hunt. I assume they do the confectioning as well, so Rollei only has to deal with part of the logistics and branding/marketing.

Maco are connected to a bottler doing this for them.

grat · Mar 1, 2022

100F? Not familiar with the Fuji kit, but I'm used to seeing 102F.

A shot of the negative including rebate would be helpful. Otherwise, I'm just going to have to tell you it's your own fault for shooting the image on Mars.

The bits at the top and bottom look like you might have had to fight to load the film on the reel..?

pentaxuser · Mar 1, 2022

BMbikerider said:
My Digibase kit is made under the Rollie brand the and I have just checked the 5ltr kit is no longer available but there is a 1 and 1/2 litre kits which works out as being a lot more expensive. I wonder if the reason the Digibase kit is so long lived is due to the starter being left out until the working dilution is made.

Thanks your point about leaving out the starter until the dilution is made is the reason for its extra life is worth an answer or answers from anyone with C41 chemicals knowledge

pentaxuser

koraks · Mar 1, 2022

pentaxuser said:
leaving out the starter until the dilution is made is the reason for its extra life

No.

mshchem · Mar 1, 2022

I can print color negatives fine. I think the scan needs to be adjusted, scanning color negatives can be a pain.

BMbikerider · Mar 1, 2022

If that was an actual print, I would hazard a guess and say it is too red. Again if I was printing I would dial filtration so that reduced the red but would not affect the sky. So try doing the same with the scanned image.

BMbikerider · Mar 1, 2022

I have had an attempt to correct the colour but it is not perfect and the shadows are quite under exposed. To do this in PS I removed 56 units of Cyan and added 29 units of green

mshchem · Mar 1, 2022

BMbikerider said:
I have had an attempt to correct the colour but it is not perfect and the shadows are quite under exposed. To do this in PS I removed 56 units of Cyan and added 29 units View attachment 299527 of green

Yep this is what needs to be done. This is a terrible shot to try and balance. Ideally studio flash, a model holding a gray card and a color checker. Work the method described in a Kodak color darkroom dataguide.
Slides are easier to scan, from a color standpoint, unless the lighting is weird, like this shot.

Looks pretty good now.

koraks · Mar 2, 2022

BMbikerider said:
shadows are quite under exposed

They're pretty much completely empty, so exposure is one part of your problem. The question is if there is also a problem with the processing. A side by side comparison with a good negative is usually a good indication of big issues.

BMbikerider · Mar 2, 2022

After a nights sleep I have had another go with fresh eyes and made a few more changes.
1. I selected the deep shadow on the bottom right and desaturated the green cast (under exposed.
2. Removed now visible shadows of artifacts that appeared.
3. Added 11 units of red from the colour balance palette
4. Selected the tree then removed as much red as I could and tried to replace it with green (not very successful)
5 took out the drying mark in the sky

Unsuccessful C41 attempt with Fuji Hunt chems help

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