Tips for accurate focus on a Hasselblad 500CM?

Twotone · Apr 6, 2023

Morning folks,

Picked up a Mamiya C33 TLR about 6 months ago and after getting it CLA'd and a focus issue fixed I learned to really love it, and more importantly do a good job at nailing focus with the magnifier, as such I've taken some great shots with it.

As time went on, I found myself wanting a MF camera that I could carry around with me more easily and that would stand the test of time, also with an excellent lens choice and fully mechanical - I decided on the 500CM!

I've had the 500CM about 2 months and have probably shot about 8/9 rolls through it, so far it's been a joy to use, and a learning curve. I got it fully CLA'd (body and lens) and replaced the original dull focus screen with a 'digitial markings' acute matt Hasselblad screen which made a big difference to focusing, however I'm not consistently getting subjects in focus, even when stopping the lens down. As an additional point to add, I know the camera/screen is correctly focused, so it's not a camera issue.

My main issues are:

- the focus throw range on the 500CM is huge compared to the 500CM so it feels like nailing the focus can be really challenging, especially as after a while I start to second guess what is more in focus! I think this is the biggest issue.

- the split prism is not my bag at all, so I use the rest of the screen to focus with the pop up magnifier as it's crisp enough (an accepted technique it seems, this would be no different to focusing on a normal freshnel screen without a splitprism).

I'm aware the focus throw 'arms' are available, has anyone used one? And if so, how did it improve things for you?
I'm also conscious that I could opt to replace my new screen with an original Acute Matt without the split-prism.

I do realise a huge part of this improving is me using it and getting to grips with it more, but just wondering if I'm missing anything which could make my life easier!

Funnily enough, I recently spoke with a chap who shot with one for 40 years a wedding photographer and reckoned shooting 1/30th at f/2.8 was widely accepted at weddings for good results

Thanks all

Photomultiplier · Apr 6, 2023

How old is the 500C/M?

My older ones (from the 70s) all had deteriorated foam pads underneath the mirror which caused the mirror to shift position randomly. This caused
focusing errors especially in medium ranges. The mirror has to touch the 3 little "bumps" (left, right, back) in the mirror frame tightly. No piece of paper should fit in there.

When i focused with a powerful loupe and to utmost precision and the slides came out unsharp anyway, i knew there was something wrong and got it fixed.

Twotone · Apr 6, 2023

Photomultiplier said:
How old is the 500C/M?

My older ones (from the 70s) all had deteriorated foam pads underneath the mirror which caused the mirror to shift position randomly. This caused
focusing errors especially in medium ranges. The mirror has to touch the 3 little "bumps" (left, right, back) in the mirror frame tightly. No piece of paper should fit in there.

When i focused with a powerful loupe and to utmost precision and the slides came out unsharp anyway, i knew there was something wrong and got it fixed.

Hi there,

It's from 1977, it has had the foam under the mirror replaced as part of the service. The reason for the service originally was that when I swapped over the screens, the infinity focus wasn't focused on the split prism, so it went off to a Hasselblad specialist here in the UK.

I have had some pretty sharp photos, however it's more of an issue with being consistent, and I'm wondering if there any tips in improving this.

Thanks!

Hassasin · Apr 6, 2023

And what is the reason you don't use the split image? I'm not sure why that is. If I am reading this correctly, you have split image, but use the area outside of it. While I think the Acute Matte is not what is that good for getting things in focus, in your case with split image, it's there why not use it?

Second, this has been said by several others, I will stand behind them as well: earlier screen 42250, grid with centre spot, seems to be at least as easy as Acute Matte for focusing Acute Matte D is maybe easier (have used both + older ones), but it's still a matter of observing how image pops into focus, a clear contrast peak, which usually is easy to see even on darker screens.

Twotone · Apr 6, 2023

Hassasin said:
And what is the reason you don't use the split image? I'm not sure why that is. If I am reading this correctly, you have split image, but use the area outside of it. While I think the Acute Matte is not what is that good for getting things in focus, in your case with split image, it's there why not use it?

Second, this has been said by several others, I will stand behind them as well: earlier screen 42250, grid with centre spot, seems to be at least as easy as Acute Matte for focusing Acute Matte D is maybe easier (have used both + older ones), but it's still a matter of observing how image pops into focus, a clear contrast peak, which usually is easy to see even on darker screens.

Hi there,

I find the split prism very difficult to use, I struggle to tell see when the lines are lined up, I think this is exaggerated by the long focus throw on the 500CM as I struggle to tell the difference between when it's in focus Vs after further movement on the throw and it still looks in focus.

Thanks for the suggestion on the other screen, I may look into this as I've found the original Mamiya C33 to be easier to use and that isn't anything special!

Thanks

BrianShaw · Apr 6, 2023

Try using a tripod or monopod. One or the other will improve “focus consistency” immensely.

… and the wedding chap, well he was telling tall tales more than he was serious.

P.S. good on you for getting your vintage gear serviced!

Twotone · Apr 6, 2023

BrianShaw said:
Try using a tripod or monopod. One or the other will improve “focus consistency” immensely.

… and the wedding chap, well he was telling tall tales more than he was serious.

P.S. good on you for getting your vintage gear serviced!

Thanks! So far, out of the 4 mechanical cameras I've bought in the past year, all have needed to be serviced for one reason or another. Currently getting set up to repair them myself

guangong · Apr 6, 2023

Ditto the tripod. Or relax. Trying to hold a camera steady probably causes most blurred pictures. Firing a camera is no different than firing a gun. Relax. Let the neck strap support the camera.
As for the focusing handle, I found it to get in the way. May be useful if wearing gloves, but I never used gloves with Hassy.

campy51 · Apr 6, 2023

Twotone said:
Hi there,

I find the split prism very difficult to use, I struggle to tell see when the lines are lined up, I think this is exaggerated by the long focus throw on the 500CM as I struggle to tell the difference between when it's in focus Vs after further movement on the throw and it still looks in focus.

Thanks for the suggestion on the other screen, I may look into this as I've found the original Mamiya C33 to be easier to use and that isn't anything special!

Thanks

I have the same problem which is why I don't use mine much. I held onto it because the value was high compared to what I paid for it. My Mamiya 6 is much easier and tend to use it much more so I am selling my 500 C/M.

Twotone · Apr 6, 2023

campy51 said:
I have the same problem which is why I don't use mine much. I held onto it because the value was high compared to what I paid for it. My Mamiya 6 is much easier and tend to use it much more so I am selling my 500 C/M.

I've been looking at them recently, my main concern is the eventual death of the electronics!

Sirius Glass · Apr 6, 2023

I had something similar to that when I first got my Hasselblad. The Hasselblad repairman said the body got a little twisted, which can happen with many other cameras. He put the body in a jib and adjusted it back to factory specification. I never had any focusing issues since then. That may be worth looking into. It is not a CLA and should not be a big deal cost wise.

Twotone · Apr 6, 2023

Sirius Glass said:
I had something similar to that when I first got my Hasselblad. The Hasselblad repairman said the body got a little twisted, which can happen with many other cameras. He put the body in a jib and adjusted it back to factory specification. I never had any focusing issues since then. That may be worth looking into. It is not a CLA and should not be a big deal cost wise.

Thanks for this suggestion! The CLA it had a few months back was by a Hasselblad specialist with the jigs etc so they confirmed everything was correct or otherwise adjusted. The camera has proven to be capable of delivery great shots, I'm just not able to consistently deliver them sadly!

Hassasin · Apr 6, 2023

Twotone said:
however I'm not consistently getting subjects in focus, even when stopping the lens down. As an additional point to add, I know the camera/screen is correctly focused, so it's not a camera issue.

Using smaller aperture is not a way to get better focus, so the point is not making a difference

But in spite of me not having much trouble focusing Hasselblad, I will say it does take some strange getting used to, like no other camera. I am not sure what that is, but the fact that focusing issue keeps popping up not that infrequently, there is something to it.

In addition to what I have posted, I would say try to put your mind to the screen as you focus. Image behaves on Hasselblad screens in some unique way (even if generally not all that different), that one needs to see through that process (how off focus to in focus transition goes) before it becomes more natural. In other words, it does seem Hasselblad screens have own grain pattern not as good (or unlike) as many other cameras.

BTW, I use pop up magnifier almost all the time, even with split image screen.

Sirius Glass · Apr 6, 2023

Twotone said:
Thanks for this suggestion! The CLA it had a few months back was by a Hasselblad specialist with the jigs etc so they confirmed everything was correct or otherwise adjusted. The camera has proven to be capable of delivery great shots, I'm just not able to consistently deliver them sadly!

Every camera takes time to grow on one and Hasselblad is no different. Repeated usage is the path to become one with the camera.

Hassasin said:
Using smaller aperture is not a way to get better focus, so the point is not making a difference

But in spite of me not having much trouble focusing Hasselblad, I will say it does take some strange getting used to, like no other camera. I am not sure what that is, but the fact that focusing issue keeps popping up not that infrequently, there is something to it.

In addition to what I have posted, I would say try to put your mind to the screen as you focus. Image behaves on Hasselblad screens in some unique way (even if generally not all that different), that one needs to see through that process (how off focus to in focus transition goes) before it becomes more natural. In other words, it does seem Hasselblad screens have own grain pattern not as good (or unlike) as many other cameras.

BTW, I use pop up magnifier almost all the time, even with split image screen.

Each person has their preferences. Before I started using prisms on TLRs including the Mamiya C330, I would use the pop up magnifier. On Minoltas I had used split image screens and the focusing ring. For what worked best for me was using the rest of the screen and focusing back and forth quickly. Today is us AF for 35mm and rarely have to tweak the focus and for the Hasselblad the prism without a split image works well for me. Frankly what is import is what works for you, not anybody else.

Twotone · Apr 6, 2023

Hassasin said:
Using smaller aperture is not a way to get better focus, so the point is not making a difference

But in spite of me not having much trouble focusing Hasselblad, I will say it does take some strange getting used to, like no other camera. I am not sure what that is, but the fact that focusing issue keeps popping up not that infrequently, there is something to it.

In addition to what I have posted, I would say try to put your mind to the screen as you focus. Image behaves on Hasselblad screens in some unique way (even if generally not all that different), that one needs to see through that process (how off focus to in focus transition goes) before it becomes more natural. In other words, it does seem Hasselblad screens have own grain pattern not as good (or unlike) as many other cameras.

BTW, I use pop up magnifier almost all the time, even with split image screen.

Thank you for the reassuring words, I'm sure it'll come to me with more practice, my 'hit rate' is definitely improving.

My approach to a smaller aperture was to give me some extra margin for error due to DOF increasing, however I appreciate this isn't a way to correct poor focusing!

Like you, I also use the pop up magnifier, I had also considered a prism finder however it makes a semi portable camera into a behemoth instantly so I'm going to persevere, with a view to swapping out the screen if I don't get any better!

Twotone · Apr 6, 2023

Sirius Glass said:
Every camera takes time to grow on one and Hasselblad is no different. Repeated usage is the path to become one with the camera.

Each person has their preferences. Before I started using prisms on TLRs including the Mamiya C330, I would use the pop up magnifier. On Minoltas I had used split image screens and the focusing ring. For what worked best for me was using the rest of the screen and focusing back and forth quickly. Today is us AF for 35mm and rarely have to tweak the focus and for the Hasselblad the prism without a split image works well for me. Frankly what is import is what works for you, not anybody else.

Thanks for this!

Completely agree, I need to spend some more time with it to become better acquainted!

As for focusing techniques, I also agree - it's a very personal thing, and something I'll continue to explore!

Hassasin · Apr 6, 2023

Twotone said:
Thank you for the reassuring words, I'm sure it'll come to me with more practice, my 'hit rate' is definitely improving.

My approach to a smaller aperture was to give me some extra margin for error due to DOF increasing, however I appreciate this isn't a way to correct poor focusing!

Like you, I also use the pop up magnifier, I had also considered a prism finder however it makes a semi portable camera into a behemoth instantly so I'm going to persevere, with a view to swapping out the screen if I don't get any better!

As for finder, I cannot agree more that prism is adding on quite a bit and also would not change much as focusing aid. I don't know if using the chimney magnifier (52094 or variants) would help you. While this has some bulk added, it weighs next to nothing and in several ways it is better in my view than WLF.

Hassasin · Apr 6, 2023

I also note that I have not heard a single discussion of focusing issues with manual focus cameras except for Hasselblad. Surely everything is personal and what works for one may not for another, yet focusing on a screen is a rather universal routine and I find it sort of abnormal for these kind of discussions, unless there is some inherent issue with how these screens are designed.

Still generally it is not a problem, but for whatever reasons it continues to be reported.

BrianShaw · Apr 6, 2023

Hassasin said:
I also note that I have not heard a single discussion of focusing issues with manual focus cameras except for Hasselblad. Surely everything is personal and what works for one may not for another, yet focusing on a screen is a rather universal routine and I find it sort of abnormal for these kind of discussions, unless there is some inherent issue with how these screens are designed.

Still generally it is not a problem, but for whatever reasons it continues to be reported.

I know why you have that impression but there have been plenty of discussions about other MF WL finders, such as Rolleiflex. Use magnifier or not; eye at finder or finder at belly; dim versus bright screens; laterally reversed or…

The long throw of the Hassy lenses seems to put them in a special category.

Twotone · Apr 6, 2023

BrianShaw said:
I know why you have that impression but there have been plenty of discussions about other MF WL finders, such as Rolleiflex. Use magnifier or not; eye at finder or finder at belly; dim versus bright screens; laterally reversed or…

The long throw of the Hassy lenses seems to put them in a special category.

Thanks! I agree, the long throw is also the issue for me. My Mamiya C33 has barely any turn of the focusing knob for it to go in and out of focus, whereas it feels like the 500C/M has a much larger focus 'window', of which I struggle to see the difference between the beginning and end of, hence the soft focusing I experience.

itsdoable · Apr 6, 2023

Unless I missed it in the thread, one other thing to check is the diopter used in your finder (WLF i'm assuming). The scribed marks on your screen should be critically sharp to your eyes, or you will never be able to focus correctly on the matte part of the screen. You can push the flip-up magnifier in and out a bit to see if the screen sharpens up, and if it is not optimally sharp when it is in the resting position, then you should fix it.

The other thing is, the acute matte screen has a small arial image component, which will appear sharp over a small range of focus. The technique to get critical focus is to ensure that the scribed lines look sharp at the same time the focus point looks sharp - which ensures that the focussed plane is coincident with the scribes on the matte side of the screen. The split and micro prism do not display this issue, and neither do the acute matte II screen (by your description, I think you have the II)

I use the Split, micro prism, and/or matte, depending on the subject and screen I have installed.

Twotone · Apr 6, 2023

Hassasin said:
As for finder, I cannot agree more that prism is adding on quite a bit and also would not change much as focusing aid. I don't know if using the chimney magnifier (52094 or variants) would help you. While this has some bulk added, it weighs next to nothing and in several ways it is better in my view than WLF.

View attachment 334935

Thanks I'll look into this too!

Saganich · Apr 6, 2023

Yea, know the feeling. Ye old 500 needs a Zen like relaxation when squeezing the trigger...or a tripod. Don't bother hand holding anything longer then 80 even if your a Zen master.

Sirius Glass · Apr 6, 2023

Hassasin said:
I also note that I have not heard a single discussion of focusing issues with manual focus cameras except for Hasselblad. Surely everything is personal and what works for one may not for another, yet focusing on a screen is a rather universal routine and I find it sort of abnormal for these kind of discussions, unless there is some inherent issue with how these screens are designed.

Still generally it is not a problem, but for whatever reasons it continues to be reported.

It would be nice to have AF for my Hasselblad, but that will never happen.

Twotone · Apr 6, 2023

itsdoable said:
Unless I missed it in the thread, one other thing to check is the diopter used in your finder (WLF i'm assuming). The scribed marks on your screen should be critically sharp to your eyes, or you will never be able to focus correctly on the matte part of the screen. You can push the flip-up magnifier in and out a bit to see if the screen sharpens up, and if it is not optimally sharp when it is in the resting position, then you should fix it.

The other thing is, the acute matte screen has a small arial image component, which will appear sharp over a small range of focus. The technique to get critical focus is to ensure that the scribed lines look sharp at the same time the focus point looks sharp - which ensures that the focussed plane is coincident with the scribes on the matte side of the screen. The split and micro prism do not display this issue, and neither do the acute matte II screen (by your description, I think you have the II)

I use the Split, micro prism, and/or matte, depending on the subject and screen I have installed.

Thanks for this, my screen is this: https://www.cliftoncameras.co.uk/hasselblad-focusing-screen-cfv-50c

Does your suggested technique still apply?

Tips for accurate focus on a Hasselblad 500CM?

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