The New Leitz - Wetzlar Leica M6 (and the dreaded film scratching issue)

Frank Dean,  Blacksmith

A
Frank Dean, Blacksmith

  • 9
  • 5
  • 81
Woman wearing shades.

Woman wearing shades.

  • 1
  • 1
  • 84
Curved Wall

A
Curved Wall

  • 6
  • 0
  • 98
Crossing beams

A
Crossing beams

  • 10
  • 1
  • 120

Recent Classifieds

Forum statistics

Threads
198,842
Messages
2,781,744
Members
99,725
Latest member
saint_otrott
Recent bookmarks
0

Huss

Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2016
Messages
9,058
Location
Hermosa Beach, CA
Format
Multi Format
Just buy a Minolta CLE and have Scott Nielsen service it.
It’s a better viewfinder and better build.
You can buy 7-8 Minolta CLE for the price of a Leica m6.
If I ever buy a M Leica “otheir than CL”it would be a 20th century one,
It’s obvious the Germans are not their best in the 21st century.

I had two. Better build? Are you kidding me? You like that plastic body covered with metal paint? Ever noticed why a CLE does not dent, but gets spider cracks? That is the metal paint impacted over the plastic base.
Better vf? for 28mm yes, everything else no. Try to focus a 50mm lens on it wide open. Step up to a 90.
And I hate how the meter turns off in manual mode. No sense. At least it has AE lock to make up for that - oh wait, it doesn't.

I have a bunch of Ms - this new M6 is the only freak show. Once it gets sorted it will be fine. All my other Ms are great, and there is a big reason I sold my CLEs but kept the Ms.
 

Radost

Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2021
Messages
1,657
Location
USA from Ukraine
Format
Multi Format
I had two. Better build? Are you kidding me? You like that plastic body covered with metal paint? Ever noticed why a CLE does not dent, but gets spider cracks? That is the metal paint impacted over the plastic base.
Better vf? for 28mm yes, everything else no. Try to focus a 50mm lens on it wide open. Step up to a 90.
And I hate how the meter turns off in manual mode. No sense. At least it has AE lock to make up for that - oh wait, it doesn't.

I have a bunch of Ms - this new M6 is the only freak show. Once it gets sorted it will be fine. All my other Ms are great, and there is a big reason I sold my CLEs but kept the Ms.

Apparently they are better build because they dont scratch film. :smile:
I have 3. none of the have spiders. I only shoot 28 and 40.
For more SLR. Range finders are not made for long lenses IMHO.
 

NB23

Member
Joined
Jul 26, 2009
Messages
4,307
Format
35mm
I had two. Better build? Are you kidding me? You like that plastic body covered with metal paint? Ever noticed why a CLE does not dent, but gets spider cracks? That is the metal paint impacted over the plastic base.
Better vf? for 28mm yes, everything else no. Try to focus a 50mm lens on it wide open. Step up to a 90.
And I hate how the meter turns off in manual mode. No sense. At least it has AE lock to make up for that - oh wait, it doesn't.

I have a bunch of Ms - this new M6 is the only freak show. Once it gets sorted it will be fine. All my other Ms are great, and there is a big reason I sold my CLEs but kept the Ms.

The CLE is way better, you should buy a fewskies.
 

brbo

Member
Joined
Dec 28, 2011
Messages
2,105
Location
EU
Format
Multi Format
I only shoot 28 and 40.
For more SLR. Range finders are not made for long lenses IMHO.

Especially not the crippled ones like CL or CLE. M3 has more than twice the effective rangefinder base length of that in CLE.
 

Huss

Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2016
Messages
9,058
Location
Hermosa Beach, CA
Format
Multi Format
Apparently they are better build because they dont scratch film. :smile:
I have 3. none of the have spiders. I only shoot 28 and 40.
For more SLR. Range finders are not made for long lenses IMHO.

See now, I have been completely transparent about the issues w my particular M6. Not doing the fan boi thing, the way you are trying to do w the CLEs.
I have owned two CLEs - both failed, became bricks. And I currently own 8 film Ms, not including the M6. The film Ms have been, and are, fantastic. The issue with the M6 is down to the incompetency of Leica NJ.

You conveniently ignore all the issues of the CLE. The build quality - a plastic body w fake metal feel paint - is always there. There is no fix for it, and if you drop it, the plastic cracks underneath the paint, showing the spider web marks. That is build quality - it has nothing to do with an easily replaceable pressure plate. Leica NJ has repeatedly dropped the ball on that.
You gloss over the very real issue that the CLE only meters in auto, that's it. And has no AE lock. Or that is has a very short rf base length so it is not suitable to be used for fast lenses wide open. You're down to one tech who may or may not be able to work on your camera. But it is good that he gives you hope.

The CLE is a nice camera. It's a shame both of mine died - never abused, never dropped, just age. But you obviously have never used an M, and in not doing so are trying to make yourself feel better about the CLE. Enjoy your camera for what it is, no need to try to compare it to others.
 

Huss

Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2016
Messages
9,058
Location
Hermosa Beach, CA
Format
Multi Format
I have seen this, but long long time ago. Once it was on Zorki 4 range finder, and second time it was some SLR, but cannot remember which brand was it.

I have owned a lot of cameras. And three scratched film. A Leica r8 - it has a nylon film roller thing that wears out - easily fixed by covering it w a tiny piece of scotch/sellotape. Leica m6. Horizon S3 U500 pano camera. That Horizon was notorious for scratching film, BUT they do it on the edge of the picture frame on the horizontal border, so it wouldn't ruin a pic!
 

mshchem

Subscriber
Joined
Nov 26, 2007
Messages
14,661
Location
Iowa City, Iowa USA
Format
Medium Format
I have owned a lot of cameras. And three scratched film. A Leica r8 - it has a nylon film roller thing that wears out - easily fixed by covering it w a tiny piece of scotch/sellotape. Leica m6. Horizon S3 U500 pano camera. That Horizon was notorious for scratching film, BUT they do it on the edge of the picture frame on the horizontal border, so it wouldn't ruin a pic!

Huss, I'm with you on the M thing. Amazing how nice these cameras are. Clearly Leica fumbled a bit on the introduction of the new M6, sounds like the film scratches are due to a single out of tolerance part, hopefully the pressure plate is the solution.
My M6 with January build date is perfect (so far). Flawless finish, brilliant viewfinder and extremely bright rangefinder.

I noticed a different signature of the quality certificate. 😁
 

Sirius Glass

Subscriber
Joined
Jan 18, 2007
Messages
50,364
Location
Southern California
Format
Multi Format
I had two. Better build? Are you kidding me? You like that plastic body covered with metal paint? Ever noticed why a CLE does not dent, but gets spider cracks? That is the metal paint impacted over the plastic base.
Better vf? for 28mm yes, everything else no. Try to focus a 50mm lens on it wide open. Step up to a 90.
And I hate how the meter turns off in manual mode. No sense. At least it has AE lock to make up for that - oh wait, it doesn't.

I have a bunch of Ms - this new M6 is the only freak show. Once it gets sorted it will be fine. All my other Ms are great, and there is a big reason I sold my CLEs but kept the Ms.

Nothing handles or feels like a M camera but I still prefer SLRs instead.
 

Huss

Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2016
Messages
9,058
Location
Hermosa Beach, CA
Format
Multi Format
Huss, I'm with you on the M thing. Amazing how nice these cameras are. Clearly Leica fumbled a bit on the introduction of the new M6, sounds like the film scratches are due to a single out of tolerance part, hopefully the pressure plate is the solution.
My M6 with January build date is perfect (so far). Flawless finish, brilliant viewfinder and extremely bright rangefinder.

I noticed a different signature of the quality certificate. 😁

If your M6 is good, you're good! it'll be that way for years. Mine obviously is from an effected batch. The problem is Leica completely bungled the very easy fix.

Ms are amazing to hold and use, and for me because they feel so good in hand, they make me take them out and look for an excuse to go take pics. That is the ultimate compliment for a camera.
 

Radost

Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2021
Messages
1,657
Location
USA from Ukraine
Format
Multi Format
See now, I have been completely transparent about the issues w my particular M6. Not doing the fan boi thing, the way you are trying to do w the CLEs.
I have owned two CLEs - both failed, became bricks. And I currently own 8 film Ms, not including the M6. The film Ms have been, and are, fantastic. The issue with the M6 is down to the incompetency of Leica NJ.

You conveniently ignore all the issues of the CLE. The build quality - a plastic body w fake metal feel paint - is always there. There is no fix for it, and if you drop it, the plastic cracks underneath the paint, showing the spider web marks. That is build quality - it has nothing to do with an easily replaceable pressure plate. Leica NJ has repeatedly dropped the ball on that.
You gloss over the very real issue that the CLE only meters in auto, that's it. And has no AE lock. Or that is has a very short rf base length so it is not suitable to be used for fast lenses wide open. You're down to one tech who may or may not be able to work on your camera. But it is good that he gives you hope.

The CLE is a nice camera. It's a shame both of mine died - never abused, never dropped, just age. But you obviously have never used an M, and in not doing so are trying to make yourself feel better about the CLE. Enjoy your camera for what it is, no need to try to compare it to others.

You have 8 Ms????
You know they all do the same thing right?
Send me those death CLE I will be happy to get them back working.
 

Radost

Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2021
Messages
1,657
Location
USA from Ukraine
Format
Multi Format
Nothing handles or feels like a M camera but I still prefer SLRs instead.

I only shoot M for the lenses.
If somebody made a 28mm F2.8 quality lens for an SLR I will be happy to shoot that.
 

Radost

Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2021
Messages
1,657
Location
USA from Ukraine
Format
Multi Format
But you already have 3! You know they all do the same thing, right?

I want to make sure I have one for the next 40 years. I don’t shoot them all. If one breaks I will get the other.
 

Radost

Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2021
Messages
1,657
Location
USA from Ukraine
Format
Multi Format
But you already have 3! You know they all do the same thing, right?

Also the CLE range finder does not get out of adjustment every time I fart like the Leica once. Not my experience but have been told by repair man and Leica users.
The Leica CL “made by Minolta “ has been dropped and kicked and still works great.
 

Sirius Glass

Subscriber
Joined
Jan 18, 2007
Messages
50,364
Location
Southern California
Format
Multi Format
Also the CLE range finder does not get out of adjustment every time I fart like the Leica once. Not my experience but have been told by repair man and Leica users.
The Leica CL “made by Minolta “ has been dropped and kicked and still works great.

One can cut down on the farting by eating less gaseous foods. That will clear the air.
 

mshchem

Subscriber
Joined
Nov 26, 2007
Messages
14,661
Location
Iowa City, Iowa USA
Format
Medium Format
I'm full of gas, just ask my wife 😁 . I have several rangefinder cameras, different makes. My rangefinders don't go awry.
 

Sirius Glass

Subscriber
Joined
Jan 18, 2007
Messages
50,364
Location
Southern California
Format
Multi Format
I'm full of gas, just ask my wife 😁 . I have several rangefinder cameras, different makes. My rangefinders don't go awry.

Do you cut the cheese?
 

Huss

Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2016
Messages
9,058
Location
Hermosa Beach, CA
Format
Multi Format
You have 8 Ms????
You know they all do the same thing right?
Send me those death CLE I will be happy to get them back working.

Each one has doubled in value. Bought one M7 w 3xxx serial # for $1500. Now worth $4k. Bought my Mp .58 for $3500. Now worth $7-$8k.
it’s quite nice really to know that the cameras you are using are also making you money, and not just in print sales!

CLE? Three plastic cameras that don’t have AE lock or manual metering? I would have thought you would have noticed that on the first one.
 
Joined
Oct 21, 2016
Messages
1,274
Location
Calexico, CA
Format
Multi Format
The Leica R 28 2.8 is fantastic. i have one. You should get one. Highly recommended.

Have to agree with you Huss. That lens is one of the best 28's I've used. Leica R lens are pretty fastastic value. Probably they had gone up in price since they are being used on FF dslr though.
 

koraks

Moderator
Moderator
Joined
Nov 29, 2018
Messages
22,903
Location
Europe
Format
Multi Format
@Radost @Huss - we get it: one of you likes the CLE, the other likes the M. The jousting has been only somewhat snarky up to this point, so perhaps drop the subject already. You're not going to win each other over - and there's no need to, in the first place. Thanks.
 
Photrio.com contains affiliate links to products. We may receive a commission for purchases made through these links.
To read our full affiliate disclosure statement please click Here.

PHOTRIO PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Ilford ADOX Freestyle Photographic Stearman Press Weldon Color Lab Blue Moon Camera & Machine
Top Bottom