The Death of Photojournalism, in full color. Me Backpedalling Big Time.

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Sirius Glass

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When in California Mark Twain wrote, "Whiskey is for drinking and water is for fighting."
 

DREW WILEY

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Mark Twain's house up in the Sierra foothills, where he wrote some famous works, came within a few feet of burning down a couple or so years ago. Last time I drove past there, they were still cleaning things up. It's a small State Park now. And the oldest industrial building in Oregon, a waterwheel-driven flour mill once owned by my grandfather, came very close to burning just a month ago, even though it's a substantial distance from forest and in a relatively moist valley. But hot ash can fall from a fire front ten or even twenty miles away.
 
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Vaughn

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There is the replica of Mark Twain's cabin in Sonora. Is that the one you mean? The last time I stopped off to see that was in 1977 or 78. Looked it up... the replica was built around the original fireplace and chimney in 1922.

Off of Hwy 49 between 4 and 108 (Sonora). I don't go that way often either -- usually cut over below from Copperopolis then over to Yosemite on 120.
 
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DREW WILEY

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It's well north of Sonora, off a completely different highway. I don't go that way very often. But otherwise, I think we're referring to the same spot. There seem to have been a number of other original artifacts left around.
 

Mick Fagan

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Did you click any of the red markers and then the image? The surveyors took photos of the destroyed buildings.

Bill, I didn't know about clicking on the graphic to get a picture. I've just done that, quite disheartening.

Thanks for the tip.

Mick.
 
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While the fire photos by journalist are impressive, the ones which got my emotions flowing are the pictures tagged to burned building pins.

https://calfire-forestry.maps.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=1933470ef8ea4c7e9cede56adf54efe1&extent=-13377356.4387,4419677.6073,-13142541.8878,4523937.7139,102100
The burned down homes are terrible; completely destroyed except for chimneys. What's amazing is that there are so many trees near the burned down homes that are still standing, many seemingly without damage.
 
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Vaughn

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It is a matter of fuel. Paper burns at 451F, add another 100 degrees to get wood to burn. Add more degrees to get wet bark to burn. But a house is filled with loose fuel -- curtains and other cloth-covered items, clothes in closets, rubbing alcohol, solvents, gasoline in the mower (and generator) and gas cans, propane tanks and propane in the gas lines. A fire approaching can be up to 1400F. Many of these houses burst into flames from the heat in front of the oncoming fire,...not burnt by fire directly. That's why standing there with a garden hose is a sure way to die.

Chances are the heat killed the trees, even though still standing
 

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Modern residences are also full of plastics, even lots of plastic storage sheds and furniture outside. Some even have vinyl windows, vinyl siding, plastic decks, etc. Our urban/suburban fires have been hot enough to melt steel. That Creek Fire was right above my former property, and did precisely what I considered inevitable. No surprises to me whatsoever. Where most of those photos were taken was at the a main road junction, at a relatively accessible spot where journalists and officials were briefly allowed to take a look. It was atop a ridge with fantastic views toward both the Ritter Range to the north and LeConte Divide to the south. But anyone who builds atop such a ridge is quite naive. For one thing, water doesn't flow uphill, and a deep enough well is likely to cost more than the house itself, if even successful. For another thing, fire travels uphill, and quite quickly when you've got both a steep canyon and thick forest below. That's why nobody lived on the narrower portion of that ridge until recent decades; they knew better. There was an elementary school there too. When I was a little kid attending the school downhill, to play a football game there, they'd have to bring out their entire school consisting of both boys and girls, and we'd still have to loan them three additional players just so they could have a team. Some family friends drove that road yesterday, now that it's partially open. Nothing left.
 
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wiltw

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The burned down homes are terrible; completely destroyed except for chimneys. What's amazing is that there are so many trees near the burned down homes that are still standing, many seemingly without damage.

Somebody applied fire proofing to the trees?! :tongue:
 
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BradS

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Somebody applied fire proofing to the trees?! :tongue:

millions (billions?) of years of evolution in the presence of regular wild fires has.
 
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wiltw

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But anyone who builds atop such a ridge is quite naive. For one thing, water doesn't flow uphill, and a deep enough well is likely to cost more than the house itself, if even successful. For another thing, fire travels uphill, and quite quickly when you've got both a steep canyon and thick forest below. That's why nobody lived on the narrower portion of that ridge until recent decades; they knew better.

Several years ago, the Tubbs fire started near Calistoga and high winds blew the embers long distances, so that the Coffey Park neighborhood in the valley, 9 miles to the west in north Santa Rosa, burned down totally. In between, there were nice neighnborhoods in areas like Fountaingrove, which burned as well. Santa Rosa considered banning homes built on ridges of Fountaingrove, but later grandfathered burned properties on ridge tops if the home was rebuilt within 2-3 years of the Tubbs fire (I forget exactly), The hills where Fountraingrove neighborhood burned, had burned decades earlier, so one wonders about the lack of wisdom in allowing the development of that land to later burn so completely.
 
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Several years ago, the Tubbs fire started near Calistoga and high winds blew the embers long distances, so that the Coffey Park neighborhood in the valley, 9 miles to the west in north Santa Rosa, burned down totally. In between, there were nice neighnborhoods in areas like Fountaingrove, which burned as well. Santa Rosa considered banning homes built on ridges of Fountaingrove, but later grandfathered burned properties on ridge tops if the home was rebuilt within 2-3 years of the Tubbs fire (I forget exactly), The hills where Fountraingrove neighborhood burned, had burned decades earlier, so one wonders about the lack of wisdom in allowing the development of that land to later burn so completely.
The developers weren't the ones providing fire insurance.
 
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I put the blame more strongly on the Santa Rosa/Sonoma County planners...they had knowledge of the fhistory of major fire of the area.
They probably got a lot of campaign contributions from the developers. We have similar problems here in NJ with over building. OUr property taxes are going sky high. Meanwhile, the developers are buying up every farm they can get their hands on to build more condos and single family homes. NOw we have to buy a new Middle Schools and build another add on to the high school.
 

wiltw

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A fire approaching can be up to 1400F. Many of these houses burst into flames from the heat in front of the oncoming fire,...not burnt by fire directly. That's why standing there with a garden hose is a sure way to die.

Chances are the heat killed the trees, even though still standing
The extremely high heat is evidenced by photos of cars whose alloy wheels MELTED from the fire.
 
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Vaughn

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In a similar vein, this years best award-winning wildlife photograph was taken by a motion-activated remote exposure of a tiger.
 
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In a similar vein, this years best award-winning wildlife photograph was taken by a motion-activated remote exposure of a tiger.
Ah, But the photographer knew where to install the camera. :smile:
 
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Vaughn

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Ah, But the photographer knew where to install the camera. :smile:
Not impressed. But as they say, it is better to be lucky than good.

Edit: The image is impressive.
 
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BradS

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In a similar vein, this years best award-winning wildlife photograph was taken by a motion-activated remote exposure of a tiger.


Never leave the boat!
 

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DREW WILEY

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Alan - there has long been an analogous problem here with river bottom development. Not fires, but inevitable flooding. It's just a matter of time, and I've witnessed "once in thousand year" floods six years in a row. Developers like bottomland because it's easy to build on, and easy to tax or intimidate farmers out of. I've seen entire subdivisions washed away overnight, then rebuilt right in the same risky spot. In that part of the world, old fashioned cash bribes are predominant when it comes to corrupting those who should know better. I have a background in Geomorphology, so am especially aware of the risks. But that is a low elevation issue. Most of the valleys and canyons upriver can defend themselves from everything but major hydroelectric development due to the sheer steepness and inaccessibility of the terrain. No resorts or towns down in those things except little hydroelectric company villages, now mostly abandoned due to power plant automation. But the infamous Creek Fire of last month was named for the little town of Big Creek, which suffered quite a bit of loss, but is perched in a spot somewhat intermediate where there is (or was) a certain amount of resort properties and summer camps etc. There are a total of four active hydro plants in relation to it, which include some of most intensive engineering undertakings in world history. I've spent many a night atop the 10,400 ft summit up above there, where it drops 8500 ft to the River below, awaiting the dawn panorama. That's about twice the depth of the Grand Canyon.
 
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Sirius Glass

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One of the reasons people rebuild in the same place is because one can only get the insurance money if they rebuild in the same place. The insurance companies lose control if someone can just walk away with the money.
 

DREW WILEY

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Full replacement value is rarely given in "disaster" situations. Many of the new CA policies in high risk zones are both expensive and skimpy on returns. That's inevitable.
The root of the problem, however, is people simply willing to take those risks to begin with. They might do so naively; and there are plenty of developers out there fishing for suckers. But spending that kind of hard-earned money, you'd think that people shopping for a new house would do better homework to begin with. Fraud and cutting corners on building codes abounds in inland parts of the State, not as often here on the coast. That is what primarily caused the last great recession - en masse giant junk homes in the Stockton area people couldn't really afford being financed by matching unrealistic shady junk loans.
With the population steadily rising, and select areas where the best paying jobs are under the crunch of very high real estate pricing, forcing long commutes, and retirees seeking escape to more affordable quieter spaces, suburban sprawl happens. What begins as a nice little hideaway a reasonable distance out of town soon ends up surrounded by a lot of other people having the same thing in mind.
A somewhat different issue involves people with serious money having quality custom homes built in scenic woodsy locations which are sooner or later going to be subject to wildfires - "sooner" coming sooner and sooner as climate shift and drought itself accelerates. As we've seen in just the past few weeks, such fires get so large and turbulent that they can take out quite a bit of perimeter area too, including big vineyards and wineries that would otherwise seem a fair distance from susceptible brush itself. Monster fires aren't entirely new - I survived several of them decades ago. We knew how to protect our property with an abundance of caution. But now these kinds of fires are dramatically accelerating in both size and frequency. It's both a demographic problem, with way more people now living in semi-rural areas, and a shifting climate issue. But CA has a long history of reckless development in floodplains and river bottoms too, as do a number of other States.
 
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