Teaspoon measuring

[Kirk Keyes]

I have their IR/laser temp meter. It's a lot of fun!

 

[gainer]

I'm looking forward to it. I'd I'm glad you're getting a copy of it again for yourself.

I'm planning to repeat at least the critical experiments with current film but using the instructions from the original article. Thus far I have found that the average weight per spoonful of Metol from PF is the same as the Elon I used originally. If you feel brave (or foolish- sometimes they seem the same) a really good approximation to D-76 is:
750 ml warm water.
Metol----------1/2 + 1/8 tsp.
Hydroquinone---1 + 1/2 + 1/8 tsp.
Sodium sulfite---4 tbs.
Borax-----------1/2 + 1/8 tsp.
Add in order shown. Add water to make 1 liter.
The admonition to add a pinch of sulfite with the Metol is not found in the earliest mixing instructions I have found for mixing this formula. It is not necessary because the pH of the Metol solution is lower than that at which Metol becomes active. The hydroquinone is to be added next so that when the sulfite is added, the synergism between M and Q is activated with the result that any oxidized Metol will be regenerated.

 

[sanking]

bump

 

[Sirius Glass]

bump

There it is again. What do you mean?

 

[phfitz]

"There it is again. What do you mean?"

any new post will 'bump' the thread to the top of the index page so it does not get lost 3 pages down.

 

[Keith Tapscott.]

I'm planning to repeat at least the critical experiments with current film but using the instructions from the original article. Thus far I have found that the average weight per spoonful of Metol from PF is the same as the Elon I used originally. If you feel brave (or foolish- sometimes they seem the same) a really good approximation to D-76 is:
750 ml warm water.
Metol----------1/2 + 1/8 tsp.
Hydroquinone---1 + 1/2 + 1/8 tsp.
Sodium sulfite---4 tbs.
Borax-----------1/2 + 1/8 tsp.
Add in order shown. Add water to make 1 liter.
The admonition to add a pinch of sulfite with the Metol is not found in the earliest mixing instructions I have found for mixing this formula. It is not necessary because the pH of the Metol solution is lower than that at which Metol becomes active. The hydroquinone is to be added next so that when the sulfite is added, the synergism between M and Q is activated with the result that any oxidized Metol will be regenerated.

That`s an interesting idea Patrick, should that apply to all MQ developers?
Most of the formulas I have seen, have the Hydroquinone to be dissolved after the sulphite.:confused:

Ilford ID-11 comes in two separate packages with Part `A` containing the Metol and Hydroquinone to be dissolved first and Part `B` containing the sulphite and borax.

 

[Kirk Keyes]

How do you know there isn't a small amount of sulfite in Packet A?

 

[Keith Tapscott.]

How do you know there isn't a small amount of sulfite in Packet A?

Good question, I don`t, although it is not mentioned in Ilford`s msds, that doesn`t mean it isn't there.
How ever, I would have thought that there might be some kind of reaction with the developing agents if it was there. According to a former Kodak employee, Kodak coat the developing agents to protect them from reacting with the other components in their single-powder packages, so I would think it is unlikely that Ilford would include sulphite in Part `A` of ID-11.

 

[Ian Grant]

How do you know there isn't a small amount of sulfite in Packet A?

Kirk's is possibly on the right track, some two part MQ, PQ or just plain Metol based developers have a small amount of Sulphite or Metabisulphite in Part A along with the developing agents as it helps prevent oxidation.

Ian

 

[Photo Engineer]

You can mix Metol and HQ and then coat that mixture with a mixture of Sodium Sulfite in a protective medium at high temperature under nitrogen. This is how it is done on a large scale. Just as color developers are packed in water and acid with Sulfur Dioxide.

PE

 

[Ian Grant]

You can mix Metol and HQ and then coat that mixture with a mixture of Sodium Sulfite in a protective medium at high temperature under nitrogen. This is how it is done on a large scale. Just as color developers are packed in water and acid with Sulfur Dioxide.

PE

That's how Kodak single package, in certain two packet developers Metabisulphite is/was used by Kodak, and Ilford.

Ian

 

[Keith Tapscott.]

That's how Kodak single package, in certain two packet developers Metabisulphite is/was used by Kodak, and Ilford.

Ian

It`s there in Microphen Part `A`, it just mentions M & Q in ID-11 Part `A` though.
http://www.ilfordphoto.com/Webfiles/2009212914312029.pdf
I never found out what the developer coatings were in Kodak`s single-powder developers or how they did it. Is it really just sulphite as P.E mentioned? If so, why hasn`t Ilford ever produced single-powder developers?

 

[Ian Grant]

No real need

Extra costs and lower volumes, and that's why Kodak never used it for all their chemistry. Xtol is 2 parts.

Ian

 

[Keith Tapscott.]

No real need

Extra costs and lower volumes, and that's why Kodak never used it for all their chemistry. Xtol is 2 parts.

Ian

As I make my own developers now, it doesn`t really matter. I rarely mix more than 500ml of stock D-76/ID-11 and D-72 at a time these days.

 

[gainer]

The following is a quote from "The Principles of Optics" by Hardy and Perrin, 1932. This is the oldest instruction I have seen for mixing what is obviously D-76, though not mentioned as such.

"The graininess of a photographic material is one of its intrinsic properties, at least to a first approximation, and is only slightly affected by the development procedure. For motion-picture work, however, it pays to take advantage of even slight improvements in the technique, and the following formula is recommended by the Eastman Kodak Company for developing the negative because it tends to minimize the graininess:
Metol (elon) ...........................2 grams .
Sodium sulphite (dry) ............100 grams .
Hydroquinone...........................5 grams . .
Borax......................................2 grams .
Water, to make.........................1 liter .

Directions for Mixing: Dissolve the metol in a small volume of water at about 125°F. (52°C.), and pour the solution into the tank. Then dissolve approximately one-quarter of the sulphite separately in hot water at about l60°F. (71°C.), and add the hydroquinone while stirring until completely dissolved. Then add this solution to the tank. Now dissolve the remainder of the sulphite in hot water at about 160°F. (71°C.), add the borax, and when dissolved, pour the entire solution into the tank. Dilute to the required volume with cold water. "

 

[gainer]

My Petersen's came in good condition save for a little browning of edges of pages. I have scanned the article using OCR which worked pretty well. It thought D-76 should be O-76, but most errors could be corrected by spell checking. Needless to say the text uses far less memory than a .jpg scan. I don't plan on sending the original photo illustrations because the magazine half-screen does tricks on the scanner.
Does anyone know how to send a spreadsheet in text format? I can put it in either Word Perfect or Microsoft Word and preserve the layout, but I can't find an ASCII DOS text program that does so.

 

[BradS]

....
Does anyone know how to send a spreadsheet in text format? I can put it in either Word Perfect or Microsoft Word and preserve the layout, but I can't find an ASCII DOS text program that does so.

might suffice to ask MS Word to save as html. It makes ugly html but, it generally works.

 

[Photo Engineer]

Several points here:

1. The particles in a one part developer are separated by having the developing agent and sulfite mixed in a matrix of an antioxidant material. It is not just sulfite.

2. Single part developers are very economical as everything just goes into one bag.

3. Even 2 part developers or 2 part fixers need some method of preserving the separate parts due to aerial oxidation and carbon dioxide.

4. XTOL cannot be 1 part due to the problems associated with ascorbic acid. I myself distrust any single part ascorbic acid developer that is either a powder or water based. It might be possible in an all solvent liquid mix but I would have to check it with my own parameters before trusting it.

5. Kodak has / had patents on this long ago.

PE

 

[Kirk Keyes]

Does anyone know how to send a spreadsheet in text format? I can put it in either Word Perfect or Microsoft Word and preserve the layout, but I can't find an ASCII DOS text program that does so.

Don't make it into a spreadsheet, that will just make a mess.

.Html or even .doc would work. How about .pdf and that could include some graphics? Or even simpler save it as a .txt file. An .rtf would preserve some formatting, and still be pretty small and openable by most everyone.

 

[BradS]

Don't make it into a spreadsheet, that will just make a mess.

.Html or even .doc would work. How about .pdf and that could include some graphics? Or even simpler save it as a .txt file. An .rtf would preserve some formatting, and still be pretty small and openable by most everyone.

Yes. rtf would be the best.

 

[Keith Tapscott.]

Several points here:

1. The particles in a one part developer are separated by having the developing agent and sulfite mixed in a matrix of an antioxidant material. It is not just sulfite.

2. Single part developers are very economical as everything just goes into one bag.

PE

This is the main reason why I preferred buying D-76 instead of ID-11. As I mix my own now, none of this matters any more.

 

[shotgun1a]

Does anyone know how to send a spreadsheet in text format? I can put it in either Word Perfect or Microsoft Word and preserve the layout, but I can't find an ASCII DOS text program that does so.

If you choose comma delimited output (usually a file ending in .csv) any spreadsheet or database program receiving it should be able to read it just fine. CSV should also be fairly lightweight with respect to file size for over-the-wire transfer.

 

[phfitz]

Open Office can handle .csv files. If anyone wants the ULTIMATE Ascii Dos text editor try:

Boxer Software

It has more features than most can use, 2G file size, Macros for about every programming language, spell check for medical, legal, foreign, ect, all types of add-ins. Crisp, clean killer program.

(usual disclaimers, I'm not associated with Boxer)

 

[phfitz]

"Does anyone know how to send a spreadsheet in text format? I can put it in either Word Perfect or Microsoft Word and preserve the layout, but I can't find an ASCII DOS text program that does so. "

Even easier with Windows and free is the program below, it installs itself as a selectable printer and saves the pages as a .pdf file. The self-install is seamless and it works in any program that prints. I don't think web pages can display tab-delimited pages correctly, HTML will automatically remove the white spaces.

http://sourceforge.net/projects/pdfcreator/

Just a thought.

 

[Photo Engineer]

That may be great or may be not good. My virus checker and my OS refuses to verify the program for download. It says that the source is unknown and cannot be verified.

PE