Survey - Kodachrome Revival Price Point?

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What is the MAXIMUM you be willing to pay for Kodachrome plus processing?

  • film + processing <$40 per roll

    Votes: 26 25.7%
  • film + processing <$50 per roll

    Votes: 12 11.9%
  • film + processing <$60 per roll

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • film + processing <$70 per roll

    Votes: 2 2.0%
  • No price limit

    Votes: 3 3.0%
  • uninterested at any price

    Votes: 58 57.4%

  • Total voters
    101
  • Poll closed .
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TheFlyingCamera

TheFlyingCamera

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Jnanian was right. The survey shows more than 57% of respondents would pay "any price". If that boundless love was representative of the feelings of the analogue community, Kodachrome would have never ceased being. People don't necessarily put their money where they put their mouth.
You misread that- 57% of the respondents said they would NOT be interested regardless of the price. So whether it was $40 a roll for film + processing or $70/roll for film + processing, they would not be interested. The reasons for the prices used here in the survey is that at the end of production, Kodachrome plus processing was already in the $25-30 range per roll. Any revival would cost more than it did before.
 

pdeeh

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Ian, trying to apply rational discourse in a thread which is largely about magical thinking is futile ...
 

BrianShaw

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I read the results differently:

25.7% would buy but not if the price was greater than $40/roll;
an additional 11.9% would pay between $40 and $40 per roll, but not more than $50;
an additional 0% would pay between $50 and $60 per roll, but not more than $60;
an additional 2% would pay between $60 and $70 per roll, but not more than $70;
an additional 3% would pay any amount of money, from $70 to $infinity.

But 57.4% would not buy any even if it were free.

What I want to know is who the 3rd person is that would pay any amount of money. The Sultan of Brunei is one, Trump is the second... Is the 3rd Elon???
 
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Sirius Glass

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Dear PE, I have a huge amount of respect for you, but you seem to be locked in the same mindset that lead Kodak to prevent themself to invest into any promotion effort regarding their analog products up until recently (hopefully not too late). The key word in your sentence above is "WAS". Based on the same reasonning people should stop producing vinyl records because back in the days when the Compact Disk was introduced, suddenly "NO ONE WAS INTERESTED" in vinyl records anymore. I'm not saying Kodachrome sales could be back at the colossal amount they once were, but I'm certain that with the right marketing and promotional tools there would be a lot more people interested (including me) now than when no one was interested. And I also think this applies to Cibachrome and other legendary products and processes which could interest more people now that they are extinct.

If all the the people who would really use Kodachrome got in a line, the line would not make it out of the doorway. Many of those to claim that they would use Kodachrome, would not even bother to shoot slides at all. The Kodachroministas need to get over themselves.
 

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What sissies. Asking about roll prices of Kodachrome. I'd like to see 5x7 sheets of it on the market again. I might be able to afford one sheet of it, but probably not with its processing. Gotta pick up just two sheet of C41'd 8X10
 

benjiboy

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I like the Fuji professional range of reversal films I think they are better than Kodachrome, and they aren't yet dead and burried
 

DREW WILEY

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All the Fuji chrome films I liked are now either dead and buried too, or receiving their last rites. The only thing left is Provia and Velvia on dimensionally unstable acetate base.
 

RPC

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The poll numbers would mean nothing even if they supported it. They describe a small number of responders to a poll about Kodachrome on a film forum viewed in part by a small number of people unrealistically hopeful of it's resurrection. In no way is it representative of the desires of the masses, who have in general left film in the dust, and many of who probably have a vague knowledge of what Kodachrome even was. That is what is meaningful.
 

BrianShaw

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Ah, how true. Nobody ever wants to discuss sample size or sample bias, nor the amount of revenue or engineering that would be required to really revive discontinued products.
 

removed account4

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Ah, how true. Nobody ever wants to discuss sample size or sample bias, nor the amount of revenue or engineering that would be required to really revive discontinued products.

you mean how out of 78,700+ people on this forum, 101 people cared enough about kodachrome to even say so ?
its kind of funny
 

Colin Corneau

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you mean how out of 78,700+ people on this forum, 101 people cared enough about kodachrome to even say so ?
its kind of funny

:D Perfect.

I loved the film, but this is one that's truly gone.

Let it go, already. Stop gazing at navels and go out and SHOOT.
 

Nzoomed

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The only thing left is Provia and Velvia on dimensionally unstable acetate base.
Pretty much ALL films are on acetate base! lol, including KODACHROME!

The only polyester films ive ever shot are digibase cr200 and cn200 and they have their own issues with light piping.
 
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A more important question now is how many here still shoot E6 films. Following that is what price will they pay for film and then processing.

Ian

I'll put my hand up, but as you would know I shoot nothing much more than E6 regularly. Of the wider picture, at last estimate here in Australia, around 840 people per 100,000 at using E6 and falling. Once E6 goes (2-3 years??), my prediction is that photographers will migrate to alternative methods and "be done with it"rather than screwed around by manufacturers. It's not the availability of E6 film or the cost at this time that is a worry by any stretch, but the future shock we all know that is coming and needs to be planned for.
 

Nzoomed

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Kodak advertised Kodachrome heavily until the early '90s when sales began to lag. About then it shared ads with Ektachrome, which had sales far greater than Kodachrome.

Kodachrome was coated once a year and supplied the entire world for that year at about that time. Then the coating schedule slipped because unused outdated Kodachrome was being returned. Gradually slippage to the coating schedule to about 1 time every 2 years, and just one master roll. When returns on that became too great, costs could not be supported.

As for keeping of the solutions, you have three developers with the developing agent and the coupler mixed together. These don't stand around long. In KRL we used to make blanks with no coupler or developer both for keeping and to allow easy experimentation. But to keep it running well, you had to keep it running or it went bad.

It is such a complex product that it overwhelms the making of vinyl records by orders of magnitude. You talk about this as a simple undertaking, but it is not. Steve Frizza worked a near miracle to get the results he got! And that is just with the process. The film already existed.

PE

I feel that Kodak could have done some more promotion on Kodachrome in the last couple of years before they quit Kodachrome, they could have even just promoted it on their website or facebook, even warning people that they need more sales to keep it alive etc.
I heard nothing from them about Kodachrome at all, in fact i actually thought it was finished in 2006 when i sent in my last roll of super8 for processing Kodak told me that no more is made and they were shutting the lab down the month after i sent it so i got it there just in time, what they did not tell me was it was just their super8 products were finished and that they were closing the Switzerland lab down.
So i feel Kodak could have done more promotion, Dwaynes photo lab were certainly getting a huge amount of business from Kodachrome also, so there must have been a decent amount of people shooting the stuff around the world.

Anyway, your right on the life of the chemicals when mixed. How long do they last? Is it a matter of minutes or will they keep for an hour?
I know they oxidise fast and you could see the staining on the tanks at dwaynes.

Putting the complexity of the rem jet backing removal and re-exposures etc aside, is it really that hard to measure and mix each developer and use immediately? They say trained chemists were needed? I can see this an issue for long film runs on a large scale processor that requires constant replenishment, but for say the likes of a jobo style tank that is mixed and used just the once like alot of people already do in their darkrooms, could this have been made possible?

As long as the temperature is bang on and mixed correctly, i dont see much of an issue, could Kodak have looked at the option of selling the kits to mix the chemicals etc?
I could imagine that they could have easily packaged each amount already measured in sealed pouches or perhaps even premixed in amall amounts like the K-Lab used. IDK, maybe im dreaming here, but im sure a special tank could have been designed for Jobo use that did the light exposures, and Kodak could have produced a version of Kodachrome that did not have rem-jet backing? The rem-jet was only needed for cine film use, and even then Ektachrome was used in cinefilm applications etc.

Please just take these as questions, im not suggesting this can be possible in any shape or form, im just interested to know if the likes of this is possible or not.

I'll put my hand up, but as you would know I shoot nothing much more than E6 regularly. Of the wider picture, at last estimate here in Australia, around 840 people per 100,000 at using E6 and falling. Once E6 goes (2-3 years??), my prediction is that photographers will migrate to alternative methods and "be done with it"rather than screwed around by manufacturers. It's not the availability of E6 film or the cost at this time that is a worry by any stretch, but the future shock we all know that is coming and needs to be planned for.
Ferrania will save E6, im still happy to pay $40(NZD) to get mine developed and scanned, i could save about half that if i get my own scanner.
 

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Nzoomed, it is not as easy as you think. Most APUG members can't mix chemicals this complex. The pH of the 4 developers is critical as is the time and color of the two reversal exposures. You cannot use a Jobo for the process without removing the film. In fact, it can't be done on a reel. If you would sit down and consider these problems rather than just jumping up and down in enthusiasm, you would begin to see how difficult this is.

Yes, this used trained professionals just as motion picture film processing did even though it is not Kodachrome. The pH value there is critical as well.

So, in the damp dark halls of EK, some evil monster decided to deprive everyone of Kodachrome. Not likely. More like a bright, airy office with some nice guys sitting around a table and seeing how dismal the product was responding in 1990 because E6 films were so good. The first Fuji E6 films were recalled, giving a big lead to Kodak, but then all E6 films faltered as well and one-by-one, Kodak and Fuji began an exit from E6. Finally, Kodak called it quits. I expect Fuji to do so soon.

Ferrania has taken on a huge project and is years late for a number of reasons. They are slipping and slipping and the market is changing and getting smaller and smaller. I hope they make it in time.

PE
 

removed account4

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:D Perfect.

I loved the film, but this is one that's truly gone.

Let it go, already. Stop gazing at navels and go out and SHOOT.
LOL

i misspoke ( i mean mistyped )
101 people cared enough to answer the poll
and 44 people cared enough about the film to say they would buy it.

couldn't agree more

plenty of stuff to shoot//
 

Nzoomed

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Nzoomed, it is not as easy as you think. Most APUG members can't mix chemicals this complex. The pH of the 4 developers is critical as is the time and color of the two reversal exposures. You cannot use a Jobo for the process without removing the film. In fact, it can't be done on a reel. If you would sit down and consider these problems rather than just jumping up and down in enthusiasm, you would begin to see how difficult this is.

Yes, this used trained professionals just as motion picture film processing did even though it is not Kodachrome. The pH value there is critical as well.

So, in the damp dark halls of EK, some evil monster decided to deprive everyone of Kodachrome. Not likely. More like a bright, airy office with some nice guys sitting around a table and seeing how dismal the product was responding in 1990 because E6 films were so good. The first Fuji E6 films were recalled, giving a big lead to Kodak, but then all E6 films faltered as well and one-by-one, Kodak and Fuji began an exit from E6. Finally, Kodak called it quits. I expect Fuji to do so soon.

Ferrania has taken on a huge project and is years late for a number of reasons. They are slipping and slipping and the market is changing and getting smaller and smaller. I hope they make it in time.

PE
Firstly, im using E6 as much as possible, i think there is a right sized market for the stuff, ironically more are probably cross processing the stuff in the lomography community.
Im happy enough with E6 and I hope it continues to prosper, Ferrania are underway currently with getting production underway now that they have everything necessary behind them. The way their business model is set up should make it profitable for low volume, so fingers crossed.

I do understand it cant be done on a reel, and perhaps the PH issue is a problem when every water supply is different? Premixed like the K-lab used would obviously be a better solution.

You say its critical for motion picture films (ECN2?) Then i guess its still critical for C41 since both films are processed in near identical chemistry. Obviously its critical with K14 moreso.
Anyway, yes a Jobo style reel would obviously not work, i was suggesting whether or not a tank could be designed that fits on that fed the film past a correctly colored lamp for the exposures while inside the tank, all this would have to be built into the tank itself.

Im just looking at other possible options, i know its alot more complex to process than other films, just interested to know what other options potentially could work to make the process simpler for low volumes etc. I would have happily paid $100 to process a roll of the stuff if thats what it would cost, E6 is almost costing me half of that per roll as it is.
 

Theo Sulphate

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I never got a chance to vote in that ancient poll. If I could vote, I would be in the "no price limit category" -- meaning that I'd pay a lot to buy the film, use it, and have it processed. However, since I don't like slides, it would have to be either 8mm or 16mm cine film.

Let me vote! I have superdelegates!
 

Photo Engineer

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Firstly, im using E6 as much as possible, i think there is a right sized market for the stuff, ironically more are probably cross processing the stuff in the lomography community.
Im happy enough with E6 and I hope it continues to prosper, Ferrania are underway currently with getting production underway now that they have everything necessary behind them. The way their business model is set up should make it profitable for low volume, so fingers crossed.

I do understand it cant be done on a reel, and perhaps the PH issue is a problem when every water supply is different? Premixed like the K-lab used would obviously be a better solution.

You say its critical for motion picture films (ECN2?) Then i guess its still critical for C41 since both films are processed in near identical chemistry. Obviously its critical with K14 moreso.
Anyway, yes a Jobo style reel would obviously not work, i was suggesting whether or not a tank could be designed that fits on that fed the film past a correctly colored lamp for the exposures while inside the tank, all this would have to be built into the tank itself.

Im just looking at other possible options, i know its alot more complex to process than other films, just interested to know what other options potentially could work to make the process simpler for low volumes etc. I would have happily paid $100 to process a roll of the stuff if thats what it would cost, E6 is almost costing me half of that per roll as it is.

If you are into E6 then why not shut up about Kodachrome?

There is a difference between ECN and C41 that you (a non-chemist) does not understand.

See?

PE
 
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