Silver recovery from used fixer

[AgX]

You need to fixit first to get thesilver out off the emulsion; then, process as above but frankly this is all a bit OTT for me.

Andrew had it over "exposed" film and paper. I assume with this he meant "exposed and developed".
In this case you need to bleach and fix as I stated above.

 

[Sirius Glass]

What I have been doing is taking the spent hypo solution and added spent developer, put it in bottles and label it and take it to the hazardous material recycling near me. Of course there in no profit in it for me, but I feel that I am doing the right thing for the environment and recycling silver.

 

[Wayne]

What I have been doing is taking the spent hypo solution and added spent developer, put it in bottles and label it and take it to the hazardous material recycling near me. Of course there in no profit in it for me, but I feel that I am doing the right thing for the environment and recycling silver.

Do they recycle it or incinerate it? Aren't there any photo labs in SOCAL that will take it (the fix, not the developer)? I live in nowheresville and there are still photo labs that will take my used fixer.

 

[AgX]

The standard pocedure though is too keep baths apart.
Especially those intended for incineration from those intended for galvanic processing. In the EU there are even different codes to be attached to containers of the different photographic baths.
However I experienced at my local recycler that they do not even bother to reply on a question whether they want fixer and bleach kept apart, and another fellow from Apug reported that his recycler told them that they would send any bath for incinerating anyway...
Thus the days of coding and keeping apart may be over.

 

[KenS]

That's cool...what did you photograph?

Over all the years.. probably thousands of petri dish of bacteria and fungus cultures.. 'diseased plant materials, Polyacrylamide 'gels' (even published a paper on the 'how-to' photograph 'unstained' gels using 'cross polarized' transmitted light in the
Journal of Biological Photography (and I'm still a member of that I'd have to find 'my copy' to give you the issue number and 'date' I'll try and find 'my' copy the pages numbers etc. Or.. might you prefer a 'scan' of the pages?

And I'm not doubting you, I did terrible in chemistry despite my biological schooling. I've seen black silver deposits on bottles of used fixer and blixer I had laying around. I'm not sure why it happened sometimes and not others.

All I can offer is a suggestion that you 'Try it for yourself'.. i have been receiving some 'you are full of 'sh*t' replies'
I've been 'working' under the dark-cloth for some 65+ years.. but have indicated that "I still do NOT know all there is to know about either 'making' good Photographs or the 'best way to accomplish that which you feel you 'need' to do to 'get a 'something done' done.

I'm somewhat more than surprised to find that there are still 'some' contributors to Photrio who seem to rely on 'my way is ALWAYS
BETTER than your your way.
It coming to the point where I am seriously thinking about 'walking away' from Photrio.com even though I 'think' I may have more knowledge (gained from past experience and formal 'education') than a significant number of posters who do not have the practical experience (and knowledge) to 'diss' some of the 'how-best to achieve the better 'results' that I have submitted over my 'time' on the forum.

I found my silver recovery by 'accident' (and contacted Dr. Mowery) who then indicated it WAS the cheapest and easiest method of
(but NOT the fastest means of recovering silver from used fixer.

Ken
[All that being 'said'... I believe I may have more 'practical experience' (and 'formal' education) than a significant percentage of other posters. (and I do have the 'letters' (after my 'name) on my 'business' card than the majority of those who 'post' on Photrio.
and I'm becoming somewhat 'frustrated' by the "You are full off 'sh*t" Nay-sayers who do NOT have the number of years of 'practical experience' under their belts as I have.

Its almost enough for me to say "Good bye"

Ken





members

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

You need to fixit first to get thesilver out off the emulsion; then, process as above but frankly this is all a bit OTT for me.

What about the silver in exposed and developed prints? I've got piles of students' discarded prints, test strips, etc.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Do they recycle it or incinerate it? Aren't there any photo labs in SOCAL that will take it (the fix, not the developer)? I live in nowheresville and there are still photo labs that will take my used fixer.

They recycle. That is, they extract elements out of the hazardous materials. To be clear, that means that the silver is extracted. No I do not get any money for my efforts.

 

[Wayne]

All I can offer is a suggestion that you 'Try it for yourself'.. i have been receiving some 'you are full of 'sh*t' replies'
I've been 'working' under the dark-cloth for some 65+ years.. but have indicated that "I still do NOT know all there is to know about either 'making' good Photographs or the 'best way to accomplish that which you feel you 'need' to do to 'get a 'something done' done.

I'm somewhat more than surprised to find that there are still 'some' contributors to Photrio who seem to rely on 'my way is ALWAYS
BETTER than your your way.
It coming to the point where I am seriously thinking about 'walking away' from Photrio.com even though I 'think' I may have more knowledge (gained from past experience and formal 'education') than a significant number of posters who do not have the practical experience (and knowledge) to 'diss' some of the 'how-best to achieve the better 'results' that I have submitted over my 'time' on the forum.

I found my silver recovery by 'accident' (and contacted Dr. Mowery) who then indicated it WAS the cheapest and easiest method of
(but NOT the fastest means of recovering silver from used fixer.

Ken
[All that being 'said'... I believe I may have more 'practical experience' (and 'formal' education) than a significant percentage of other posters. (and I do have the 'letters' (after my 'name) on my 'business' card than the majority of those who 'post' on Photrio.
and I'm becoming somewhat 'frustrated' by the "You are full off 'sh*t" Nay-sayers who do NOT have the number of years of 'practical experience' under their belts as I have.

Its almost enough for me to say "Good bye"

Ken





members

I'm not sure why you have directed such a venomous reply toward me. Perhaps that wasn't your intent. I neither doubted you nor said anything intended to cause doubt in what you said, in fact I related experience that I thought lent support to your method.

 

[AgX]

i have been receiving some 'you are full of 'sh*t' replies'

Please be reasonable. I do not see any of such.

You started this thread by advocating a process that you kept veiled. Are you really surprised that we did not refrain of joking around that? But that is by far different from what you just stated.

 

[Wayne]

Its mid-winter and mid-pandemic. People are grumpy.

 

[KenS]

I'm not sure why you have directed such a venomous reply toward me. Perhaps that wasn't your intent. I neither doubted you nor said anything intended to cause doubt in what you said, in fact I related experience that I thought lent support to your method.

Wayne
My sincere apologies....

My response was NOT directed at You.. it was 'supposed' to be directed at the 'non-believers' I guess I hit the 'respond' under your post rather than directly to the person that indicated "I was full of 'Sh*t" when providing the easiest/best way to recover silver
from used fixer in the home darkroom.

In all honesty, I was somewhat surprised by the 'nay sayers' in 'Reply' messages (and a couple in direct e-mails).. "Too much work"/"You are full of 's**t". /"You don't know what you are talking about".... Kinda "pissed me off" more than I expected and was in somewhat of a hurry to "put this to 'sleep' "

I was 'almost at the point of 'leaving' Photrio forever (and even as a $$ contributor I'm still thinking of so doing) even tho I probably have more years of practical experience 'under the Dark-cloth' (as a Pro) than a fair percentage of those who 'post' replies.

Ken

 

[Wayne]

Wayne
My sincere apologies....

My response was NOT directed at You..

Ken

OK, thanks for clarifying that's what I thought anyway.

Don't worry about it, there will be some who find your post useful and some who won't. That's the internet. Anyone PM'ing you with comments like you posted above should be reported as far as I'm concerned. That's BS.

 

[Sirius Glass]

I'm not sure why you have directed such a venomous reply toward me. Perhaps that wasn't your intent. I neither doubted you nor said anything intended to cause doubt in what you said, in fact I related experience that I thought lent support to your method.

Something must be wrong with me. I understood who was being referred to in each post. I will avoid that in the future.

 

[Besk]

KenS: I for one saved your post, printed it out and will be using it in the future. I am an avid recycler/saver and appreciate the information.

 

[KenS]

KenS: I for one saved your post, printed it out and will be using it in the future. I am an avid recycler/saver and appreciate the information.

Bob
I Thank you for your 'confidence' in my 'method'.. It actually happened by "accident" the first time. It was then I decided to make contact with Dr. Mowery (seeking an 'educated' answer to 'what had happened) and he was generous enough to 'explain' 'what had happened. Due to my having attended several 'annual meetings',I have had contact with a few of Kodak's 'top dogs.
Dr Martin Scott (Head of Kodak's 'Scientific Photography Department) actually sat on the final "oral" examination board' for my 'Certification' as a Registered Biological Photographer back in 1985 (he was President (and a "Fellow) of that organization at that time). If I may add a bit of 'history' I kind "blew his presentation on their quality control of Kodachrome processing to make sure the colour control was 'right on' for the colour spectrum (while showing a slide of a rainbow) and providing the 'order' of the colours 'in' the visible light spectrum'. and asked the attendees for a nemonic I kind of 'half heartedly' raise my hand and he asked me for 'mine' (Virgins In Bed Give You Odd Results). The attendees "Roared with Laughter', Standing up...Hooting and Hollering (thus stopping his presentation for 'about' two minutes).

About a year later my supervisor called me indicating that a "Dr Scott from Kodak wanted some 'valuable' information from me" (and hung around to overhear 'my side of the conversation') and was somewhat 'shocked and stunned' (and not a little amused) when he overheard my 'reply' to this "Dr Scott from Kodak in Rochester New York"

I'm now willing to wager that YOU will not (now) forget the 'order of the colours in the visible light spectrum.

Ken

 

[removed account4]

KenS

Sorry for the raft of questions but I figure you are a scientist / science person and you might know the answers/ have them written down somewhere or PE ( or some other EK. photochemist you know ) might have told you ...

- Have you determined how much silver remains in solution after you do your recovery method ( using something like a STF50 or industry standard test, or environmental lab ) ?

-Have you "washed" your spent fixer more than once to determine if you can extract more silver out of it ?

( No method extracts all the silver from tailings and some do it better than others ( electrolysis leaves about 50 parts / million, ion transfer ( like steel wool ) can get you down below 5 ) ).

- I'd love to learn how low you typically get your spent fix samples, and how saturated your tailings have to be for it to work best ( does it work best when you get 2x clear time with a clip test, or when hypo check doesn't reabsorb milky white precipitation, and if you can you do this recovery method with low concentrations like wash water / when you use your fixer 1 or 2 shot too ).

- I'd also love to know how aggressively one has to shake the bottle of fixer + developer and see if you have made a determination if your methods would work with a vibrating platform, or something like a magnetic stirrer would work instead of aggressive shaking ?

Thanks
jn ba a/arch h-sp, ma hp-crmp e-s, oa, sahd

 

[KenS]

KenS

Sorry for the raft of questions but I figure you are a scientist / science person and you might know the answers/ have them written down somewhere or PE ( or some other EK. photochemist you know ) might have told you ...

- Have you determined how much silver remains in solution after you do your recovery method ( using something like a STF50 or industry standard test, or environmental lab ) ?

-Have you "washed" your spent fixer more than once to determine if you can extract more silver out of it ?

[Snip]

I may have missed out the fact that I do syphon off 'about' 40% of the total volume after I can see the few inches of the 'black precipitate.. mostly to 'make room for more used fixer that will be followed by 'more used but not dead developer.
As a 'rule' it may take me a few weeks to 'replenish the volume of used fixer (followed by some used.. but not 'dead developer

Its almost like 'topping up the last 1/3 of the coffee in your mug and adding a little more 'cream/cream and some more brown sugar.
I don't wait until I have a (excuse my pun) a 'fixed volume' unless I 'need the space' 'available to add more of both used chemical solutions. (but I Never 'throw out' any left overs.. they are 'saved and 'lebled' as to either U-Dev or U-Fix. for the next
"Make The Black Silver Appear" session a few months later (after I have washed the 'recovered silver.. dried it.. and poured into a 'ready for melting' container)

I have to admit that there have been a few times (after a somewhat longer darkroom session.. and I'm in need a 'sleep' break
so just I pour it into a smaller 'brown glass' container that is then 'capped' and labeled as to the contents.

My Scots heritage HATES to see 'money' going down the drain.

Ken

Ken

 

[removed account4]

may have missed out the fact that I do syphon off 'about' 40% of the total volume after I can see the few inches of the 'black precipitate.. mostly to 'make room for more used fixer that will be followed by 'more used but not dead developer.
As a 'rule' it may take me a few weeks to 'replenish the volume of used fixer (followed by some used.. but not 'dead developer

Its almost like 'topping up the last 1/3 of the coffee in your mug and adding a little more 'cream/cream and some more brown sugar.
I don't wait until I have a (excuse my pun) a 'fixed volume' unless I 'need the space' 'available to add more of both used chemical solutions. (but I Never 'throw out' any left overs.. they are 'saved and 'lebled' as to either U-Dev or U-Fix. for the next
"Make The Black Silver Appear" session a few months later (after I have washed the 'recovered silver.. dried it.. and poured into a 'ready for melting' container)

I have to admit that there have been a few times (after a somewhat longer darkroom session.. and I'm in need a 'sleep' break
so just I pour it into a smaller 'brown glass' container that is then 'capped' and labeled as to the contents.

My Scots heritage HATES to see 'money' going down the drain.

Ken

Ken

I missed that part where you are constantly removing part and leaving some seasoned.
it would be interesting to know how much silver is left in the part you are getting rid of ... maybe put some developer in THAT
and shake it up and see what happens.. even thought you have a bunch of black stuff
there might still be a bunch of silver in the stuff you toss.. if you can get your hands on a reactive metal test kit that will tell you for sure.

 

[jpohara]

BTW "black silver" = "colloidal silver" = microscopically small grains of silver.

I don't see any reason why adding developer to spent fixer wouldn't work, but I'm no chemist. I suspect it would work better with alkaline fixer rather than acid fixer, which would at least partly deactivate most developers.

Personally, I use the steel wool in the bucket method. The silver in the bottom might be, in principle, recoverable, but I don't think it's worth my time to do so. I just do it to keep the dissolved silver compounds out of my septic system. It is a good idea to be nice to your septic system. It is unpleasant when they retaliate.

 

[MattKing]

Ken,
I expect the rude responses you got may have originated, in whole or in part, from a person or persons I have on ignore, because I couldn't figure out what rudeness you were talking about!.
You may wish to both report the rude responses to the moderators and put the source on "Ignore".

 

[KenS]

Ken,
I expect the rude responses you got may have originated, in whole or in part, from a person or persons I have on ignore, because I couldn't figure out what rudeness you were talking about!.
You may wish to both report the rude responses to the moderators and put the source on "Ignore".

Hardly worth the bother of so doing, As a Canuckian 'Immigrant' from the land of the 'Heather and the Kilt', (read "Thick" skin),
I learned to to put those 'reply-ers' on 'ignore' (in my head rather than on my 'mac') those kind are proving their lack of a 'real education and/or 'practical experience' of making great/good images.

Ken

 

[KenS]

Ken,
I expect the rude responses you got may have originated, in whole or in part, from a person or persons I have on ignore, because I couldn't figure out what rudeness you were talking about!.
You may wish to both report the rude responses to the moderators and put the source on "Ignore".

Matt,

I may be "Old and Grey" but I'm willing to bet that I have more years of experience (somewhere in the region of 65+ years) than many of those who seem to disagree with the means by which I recover the silver from used fixer. Many of those years were
spent as a "Professional" in the employ of Agriculture Canada's Research Branch. I am a "Board Certified" Registered Bilological Photographer' was elected A Fellow of the Biological Photographic Association for my contribution in the "Biological Sciences" and earned my BFA degree after my early 'retirement' thanks to Agriculture Canada's 'eastern' Agriculture Canada's Research Center was 'closed down (the PM 'sold the land' on which it stood.. and needed to transfer as many of the scientific staff westward to S. Alberta and thus needing the floor space I occupied.. just at the 'time' when digital capture was becoming easier (and less expensive). My daughter then 'challenged me to 'earn my BFA' degree at the nearby University.. so I did... and graduated at the ripe old age of 74 years, with a 'good' GPA (I believe it was 4.3 (I was also elected.As a Fellow of the Biological Photographic Association (now known as Biocomm.org) for my 'Contribution' of imaging in the Biological Sciences

In all reality... I believe I may have a 'wider and more extensive experience (and background) in the 'field' of photography than most of those who contribute images (and 'ideas') to the Photrio website. At the ripe old age of 80 I am quite willing (and able) to admit that I still don't "know enough" about the art and the required "Craft" of Photography.

Should you be interested... I have a substantial number of my 'post retirement' artistic endeavours on the 5x4.co.uk web site
as "KenS. in a number of the 'subjects (you MUST to sign in with your 'real' name, your e-mail and a 'password' as a 'visitor')..its for 'security purposes only.

I believe Donald Qualls has recently 'joined up' and has...or will be (or has been) posting some of his images.

Ken

 

[removed account4]

whatever process you folks might use to harvest silver from your spent fixer
the spot price is pretty high these days
a handful of years ago it was around $48 then it went down to $10 so in the 20s is pretty good.
https://www.kitco.com/charts/livesilver.html
be advised that any refiner will charge a fee
feel free to contact me if you want a reactive metal test kit to ascertain how much silver is left
post-reclamation .... no process will get 100% of the silver.

 

[mshchem]

There was a refinery in Chicago, this was over 20 years back that recovered silver from old X-ray films. They used sodium cyanide, got in deep s*t when they had a leak. Don't get your hopes up. Refiners don't mess with small quantities, there's a assay fee. It's good thing to not pollute. I don't doubt anyone here, just sharing. Silver m.p. is 1763°F. 961°C

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Matt,

I may be "Old and Grey" but I'm willing to bet that I have more years of experience (somewhere in the region of 65+ years) than many of those who seem to disagree with the means by which I recover the silver from used fixer. Many of those years were
spent as a "Professional" in the employ of Agriculture Canada's Research Branch. I am a "Board Certified" Registered Bilological Photographer' was elected A Fellow of the Biological Photographic Association for my contribution in the "Biological Sciences" and earned my BFA degree after my early 'retirement' thanks to Agriculture Canada's 'eastern' Agriculture Canada's Research Center was 'closed down (the PM 'sold the land' on which it stood.. and needed to transfer as many of the scientific staff westward to S. Alberta and thus needing the floor space I occupied.. just at the 'time' when digital capture was becoming easier (and less expensive). My daughter then 'challenged me to 'earn my BFA' degree at the nearby University.. so I did... and graduated at the ripe old age of 74 years, with a 'good' GPA (I believe it was 4.3 (I was also elected.As a Fellow of the Biological Photographic Association (now known as Biocomm.org) for my 'Contribution' of imaging in the Biological Sciences

In all reality... I believe I may have a 'wider and more extensive experience (and background) in the 'field' of photography than most of those who contribute images (and 'ideas') to the Photrio website. At the ripe old age of 80 I am quite willing (and able) to admit that I still don't "know enough" about the art and the required "Craft" of Photography.

Should you be interested... I have a substantial number of my 'post retirement' artistic endeavours on the 5x4.co.uk web site
as "KenS. in a number of the 'subjects (you MUST to sign in with your 'real' name, your e-mail and a 'password' as a 'visitor')..its for 'security purposes only.

I believe Donald Qualls has recently 'joined up' and has...or will be (or has been) posting some of his images.

Ken

I've been a member at UK LFP forum for a while...