Scanned film vs. traditional darkroom

[Bob Carnie]

We will accept Drew into Canada only on one condition.. He brings his best friend Bigfoot with him..... on a serious note if one wants to visit Toronto and if one is very serious about photography, the absolute best time is April 15th - May 24..Contact Photo Festival is active , some years better than others, some of the best gallerys really open their doors and make an effort, Every two or three years one of the better galleries does calls for entry from alt and silver workers for Contact.... its a great time.

Be aware all Canadians hibernate and are not available on the two four weekend... it is a nation wide hibernation that occurs every May 24....

 

[Colin Corneau]

.... if one wants to visit Toronto and if one is very serious about photography, the absolute best time is April 15th - May 24..Contact Photo Festival is active , some years better than others, some of the best gallerys really open their doors and make an effort, Every two or three years one of the better galleries does calls for entry from alt and silver workers for Contact.... its a great time....

I can concur on this point. I had the good fortune (some would say dumb luck) to exhibit with a small group at a gallery for CONTACT in 2014. It was a wonderful time to enjoy photography, and it really seemed the city was full of exhibitions and photographs.
From small corner shops to street side displays to large established galleries -- it was all there for a person to take in. Just great.

 

[Bob Carnie]

I can concur on this point. I had the good fortune (some would say dumb luck) to exhibit with a small group at a gallery for CONTACT in 2014. It was a wonderful time to enjoy photography, and it really seemed the city was full of exhibitions and photographs.
From small corner shops to street side displays to large established galleries -- it was all there for a person to take in. Just great.

I think you were in the Arta show were you not Colin?

 

[Sirius Glass]

I have the space for a darkroom, the equipment and the knowledge, so I always use the traditional darkroom.

 

[Bob Carnie]

My lease is up this year, my new space will have a huge sink in the middle , walk around with drain to the bottom under the sink and water coming from above huge hoses.

everything that I do will surround these sinks from PS station, inkjet printers, plate burners and enlargers... I hope to be able to turn it into a silver darkroom with a filck of the switch but also be able to utilize
the sink for various jobs... pt pd, gum and even staining frames...

darkroom , dim room, PS room , Framing room all in one space. screw the stairs.

 

[Adrian Bacon]

I work with both enviourments, like many here I am not linked to one way being better than the other, and I never trust second hand information or do I trust manufacturers claims...

RA4 prints are beautiful whether made by a skilled enlarger operator or skilled digital operator. I got burned in my first 15 years of colour printing as this product does fade and I have seen it in my life span of printing for others. Epson and Canon both seem to be making huge timeline claims on their product line, if you believe them I have a bridge I want to sell you. ( I am making hand made pigment prints now as I do not believe the hype of inkjet lasting 300 years, reminds me of Cibas 200 year guarantee(anyone remember that) and if so if I can find the responsible party I have a bone to pick with those marketing boneheads.

I switched from RA4 to inkjet for three reasons.... One the wet chemicals really stink and need lots of volume to keep the lines going, and today the Inkjet papers have a broader Palette of colours possible and more selection of papers. ( I just saw Ed Burtynskys show and he has switched to inkjet for the bigger prints he is showing.) This is significant as he owns both RA4 and inkjet like I did.


I did a test (seems like 10 years now) where I took 8 x10 BW negative and made an enlarger print on Ilford MG4, then I scanned the negative and made a Lambda Fibre , and a Inkjet on Bayrta paper. To be fair I had a competing printer in Toronto make the first print from the enlarger setup and then I matched with the scanned versions... These prints were at 30 x40 inch size and over a period of 1 year I showed the prints to different larger groups, Springfield Mass, and other east coast groups as well as groups in Toronto, I only asked one question and it was can anyone tell me which print was which... Sounds easy you say well no , over 300 people replied everyone had a different viewpoint and there was only one person out of 300 actually told me exactly which was which and that was Les McLean. the tip off was the enlarger print was soft in one corner... Other than Les people could only guess and most were not correct.

This was a very valuable lesson for me , and it is the reason I keep making inkjet , silver prints... People have their needs and we can satisfy them with multiple options.
A competent enlarger operator has their sets of skills , that many here can relate too. . But a competent digital PS expert has the same but different skill sets but IMHO both are equally talented. I am kind of not answering the OP's question but
reacting to ( are Digital Prints better than Enlarger Prints) the simple answer , they are both good and both have their merits.

I could not agree more. For color, I actually won't do RA4. The latest round of pro pigment inkjets are quite good and completely serviceable. For BW, I really only do enlarger prints for 8x10 prints or smaller. For anything larger, if the source is film, it's scanned in and run through a digital process and then either printed as a BW pigment print, or a digital negative is made and contact printed. I've found for the larger print sizes it's better to have a solid way to reproduce what you see on the screen as closely as possible onto Silver Gelatin, that way getting the print to look the way you want it to is done in PS and it's one shot to make the contact print. This allows easier collaboration with the taker of the picture and significantly constrains your hard costs (i.e. paper and chems), which in turn makes it more affordable so that you can print more, at least that's been my experience.

 

[Colin Corneau]

I think you were in the Arta show were you not Colin?

That's right. I had a really good experience, with the venue and staff there. I'm headed back to Trawna in April, it seems, so I'll try set aside enough time to come see you (finally).

 

[DREW WILEY]

Hi John n Bob, I did take real Canadian maple syrup with me on my last backpack trip for sake of morning pancakes. Nothing is better.

 

[removed account4]

Well, Bob, I did take real Canadian maple syrup with me on my last backpack trip for sake of morning pancakes. Nothing is better.

no poutin for your pomme frittes ?

 

[Bob Carnie]

Hi John n Bob, I did take real Canadian maple syrup with me on my last backpack trip for sake of morning pancakes. Nothing is better.

Ok this gets you close in my books... if you post a photo of you and bigfoot wearing Toronto Maple Leaf toques or Blue Jay Hats it will go a long way to get you readily accepted up here.

 

[cowanw]

if you post a photo of you and bigfoot wearing Toronto Maple Leaf toques or Blue Jay Hats it will go a long way to get you readily accepted up here.

Up here being Toronto; not so much in the rest of the country.

 

[Bob Carnie]

Up here being Toronto; not so much in the rest of the country.

I thought the canadian border was at Ottawa and Thunder Bay ... Bill

 

[MattKing]

The Blue Jays are popular out at this end of the country. Although many long for the Expos!
But the Leafs? Some yes, and some no.

 

[Bob Carnie]

I only mention the Leafs as they have some great players and management now and I am indeed jumping on the bandwagon.

 

[kevs]

<snipped>

The question is, how does a print that is generated by scanning film (along with doing the digital processing of the film, such as converting the negative to a positive image, retouching, etc.) and printing the scan with a high quality desktop printer compare to a print generated entirely in the darkroom?

<snipped>

I find that throwing light at silver-gelatin prints can reveal shadow details not readily visible in normal lighting. I've never seen that happen with dye-based media (inc. chromogenic prints) - that's not to say it doesn't happen, or course.

 

[MattKing]

I only mention the Leafs as they have some great players and management now and I am indeed jumping on the bandwagon.

I grew up as a Leaf fan (Dave Keon et al). Of course, I was born in "the centre of the universe".

 

[cowanw]

I thought the canadian border was at Ottawa and Thunder Bay ... Bill

Only for small c Canadians, eh!

 

[dmr]

I just don't have the skill, or the equipment (or the space for it) to do wet printing.

Having the scanner and a higher-end inkjet (first HP B9000, now Canon) allows me to produce far better prints than I think I could do if I had a wet darkroom.

 

[Peter Schrager]

My lease is up this year, my new space will have a huge sink in the middle , walk around with drain to the bottom under the sink and water coming from above huge hoses.

everything that I do will surround these sinks from PS station, inkjet printers, plate burners and enlargers... I hope to be able to turn it into a silver darkroom with a filck of the switch but also be able to utilize
the sink for various jobs... pt pd, gum and even staining frames...

darkroom , dim room, PS room , Framing room all in one space. screw the stairs.

Shower included bob??

 

[Peter Schrager]

I just don't have the skill, or the equipment (or the space for it) to do wet printing.

Having the scanner and a higher-end inkjet (first HP B9000, now Canon) allows me to produce far better prints than I think I could do if I had a wet darkroom.

You will never know if you dont try...
Alas many people are waking up to wet process!!

 

[Bob Carnie]

Th

Shower included bob??

is is most likely a live work building so I will have a shower but only for personal work... Super big sinks to lay in though and spray water on oneself with a hose.

 

[dmr]

You will never know if you dont try...
Alas many people are waking up to wet process!!

I've done it before, well, B&W, back in college. Color printing at the time was very expensive and involved a lot of trial and error and a lot of waste. I watched it being done, even helped a bit, but never got into it.

I currently do my own C41 color negative developing with the Jobo and I've had excellent results. I'll be doing the Ektachrome as well as soon as I shoot some.

 

[Tim Stapp]

To all of you Canuks, I'm from Michigan and a lifelong Red Wings fan. Bring back the days of Yzerman, Shanahan, Lidstrom and the "Grind Line." Speaking of which, Darren McCarty was just at a comedy club in our small town of less the 6,000 folks. Sadly, I was working out of town so didn't get to meet him.

Oh, on topic: I do both, di#gt#l and B&W silver gelatin. Still working toward RA.4.

 

[KenS]

Being now somewhat old and grey and now surviving on my pension income, I now find it somewhat difficult to
justify the cost of silver/gelatin paper and now find I appreciate more 'pleasure' and 'satisfaction' in scanning my LF negatives and printing the resultant slightly enlarged 'negative' image onto Pictorico for making prints using the 'archaic' print processes with my home built UV light source. It is a much slower means of producing a print.. but somehow... I now get a LOT more (personal) satisfaction than that which I used to 'feel' when I coud better afford
to purchase 'commercial' B/W printing papers.
Ken

 

[Bob Carnie]

Being now somewhat old and grey and now surviving on my pension income, I now find it somewhat difficult to
justify the cost of silver/gelatin paper and now find I appreciate more 'pleasure' and 'satisfaction' in scanning my LF negatives and printing the resultant slightly enlarged 'negative' image onto Pictorico for making prints using the 'archaic' print processes with my home built UV light source. It is a much slower means of producing a print.. but somehow... I now get a LOT more (personal) satisfaction than that which I used to 'feel' when I coud better afford
to purchase 'commercial' B/W printing papers.
Ken

Your not the only one Ken, I feel hand made prints give me the same excitement as when I first started to print.