Rolleicord III film advance gets stuck

[Dan0001]

Acquired this camera in thrift shop and while testing the fiim advance the knob frequently gets stuck usually after the 4th frame. The Rolleicord III does not have double exposure prevention. After exposure to advance the film, you push the black center button of the winding knob, then rotate knob. I read on the web that other users having similar problems would move the shutter release lever slightly to the left and then the knob would release. This worked only sometimes(I don't understand how this would work anyway). The unusual part however is if I hold the camera upside down and advance the the knob it usually works 1 thru 12 to the end with no resistance.
Does this sound like a simple fix like a CLA or a more difficult part replacement? I have taken apart some cameras with some success, some not. I realize that the leatherette would have to come off with the side plate. I would appreciate any input. Note: the camera works perfectly in all other aspects.

 

[shutterfinger]

You can download a Rolleiflex service manual here: http://www.kyphoto.com/classics/repairmanuals.html
The manual covers later model cameras than the one you have. It has been my experience that newer models are more refined than earlier models but have some basic similarities.
I have never touched a Rolleiflex, but would not be afraid to do so.

The unusual part however is if I hold the camera upside down and advance the the knob it usually works 1 thru 12 to the end with no resistance.

Its likely a linkage that has come loose or is heavily worn.

I read on the web that other users having similar problems would move the shutter release lever slightly to the left and then the knob would release. This worked only sometimes(I don't understand how this would work anyway)

The shutter cocking/ release may be mechanically connected to the film advance to prevent unwanted exposures. Compur shutters have three screws on the rear that hold the main plate in place, they sometimes come loose.

 

[Dan0001]

The shutter cocking/ release may be mechanically connected to the film advance to prevent unwanted exposures. Compur shutters have three screws on the rear that hold the main plate in place, they sometimes come loose.

Since this camera does not double exposure protection I don't understand why the Compure shutter would be connected to the film wind mechanism. That shutter cocking/release lever experience may have been coincidental...not really sure.

 

[shutterfinger]

Will the shutter cock and trip with the wind counter in any position or only at a set frame number? If only at a set frame number then the shutter is mechanically connected to the wind.
If you open it take good pictures as you go, it makes reassembly much easier.

 

[BrianShaw]

Correct me if I’m misinformed but I believe the shutter cock/release and film wind are totally independent on a Rolleicord.

 

[shutterfinger]

Looking at the instruction manual http://www.cameramanuals.org/rolleiflex/rolleicord_iii.pdf the position of the controls suggest that the various linkages may pass close to one another inside the case. A loose or worn linkage of one can block the operation of another unrelated control.

Does the focused distance have any affect on the winding jam? (focus at 25 feet or 10 feet, not infinity)

 

[BrianShaw]

Not intending to be argumentative but the wind, release, and exposure is on the shutter which is on the lensboard. The focus and wind is in the sides of the body. They are separate and not in close proximity unless I’m totally mistaken after using a Rommeicord for 3 decades or so.

 

[shutterfinger]

Bring me one and I'll open it with a hacksaw and cutting torch and let you know what I find.
Someday I'll be able to afford a plasma cutter, cleaner, quicker.

Rolleicord VA lots going on in there even on a III or IV.

 

[BrianShaw]

Bring me one and I'll open it with a hacksaw and cutting torch and let you know what I find.
Someday I'll be able to afford a plasma cutter, cleaner, quicker.
View attachment 196689
Rolleicord VA lots going on in there even on a III or IV.

I don’t understand. I’m not sure if your being serious or not. I’m not sharing your humor at the moment. It’s me, not you... but what do you think that exploded diagram is showing regarding this discussion?

The normal Rolleicord wind mechanism is incredibly straightforward... of course, the counter might be dirty, etc causing it to lock up early.

I am likely incorrect about Rolleikin counter (comment now deleted). The iii maybe didn’t use the replacement counter. I think Rolleikin back then had the counter in the Rolleikin back.

 

[shutterfinger]

I don’t understand. I’m not sure if your being serious or not. I’m not sharing your humor at the moment.

Some members use a hammer and cold chisel.

ut what do you think that exploded diagram is showing regarding this discussion?

More than meets the eye from the exterior. Linkages and levers pass one another at very close distances, possibly a few thousands of an inch/ tenths of a millimeter. Play in one can affect unrelated control operation.

I read on the web that other users having similar problems would move the shutter release lever slightly to the left and then the knob would release. This worked only sometimes(I don't understand how this would work anyway). The unusual part however is if I hold the camera upside down and advance the the knob it usually works 1 thru 12 to the end with no resistance.

The cable release is under the lens, not directly on the shutter so the release is by levers. An exploded diagram of the III would make the explanation easier.

Have you had the pleasure of opening one up?

 

[Dan0001]

Well I left the forum for a few hours and it seems I created a lot of discussion. I did try extending the focus out to 30 ft or so and tried the film wind again...sad to say it still jams. Again there is less of a problem with camera held upside down but occasionally it will jam there too. It looks like I have to do some surgery. Thanks for your input.

 

[BrianShaw]

Your camera needs an overhaul. Get it done professionally (by someone with more than just an Internet knowledge of Rolleis) and it will be good for the next decade or so.

Or shoot upside down. Square is square!

 

[shutterfinger]

You can teach yourself your camera but an experienced repair person will be faster.

 

[shutterfinger]

Got it unjamed yet?

 

[Dan0001]

Now that am back in my permanent home in Michigan from Florida I was able to do some simple things like putting a tiny amount of singer oil in the film push in wind knob mechanism and then exersise the film wind repeatedly. As a Rolleicord III has this push in knob in order to advance the film it is different from more recent models. I found that I may need to push in the knob for a second longer than than I normally would seems to work and I can live with that. I was grateful that I did not have to tear apart the side panel although that may be necessary sometime later.

 

[shutterfinger]

And I found a pdf on ebay that shows exploded views of the Rolleicord III through Wide angle Rolleiflex, along with their projectors and some finders.
There is no mechanical connection between the film advance and shutter on the Rolleicord III. Removing the side plate is a piece of cake.
The advance knob assembly: