Reversal RA-4 experiment thread.

[Photo Engineer]

By enlarger printing, you will find that Endura requires about 100R additional filtration and up to 3 stops more exposure due to the nature of this reversal process.

PE

 

[nickandre]

When I tried shooting in camera it required tungsten filtration/light with a hefty filter pack of magenta and yellow. That was with strange fuji paper though. I used paper developer standard dilution (sprint 1:9) for 2 minutes.

 

[Daire Quinlan]

By enlarger printing, you will find that Endura requires about 100R additional filtration and up to 3 stops more exposure due to the nature of this reversal process.

Yeah I think I'm actually converging on something similar to the above all right. It's a pity, I was hoping to shoot it at the same speed I'm shooting it as negative. It's looking more and more like the above though in terms of exposure & filtration. I have a few more sheets lined up for more testing this afternoon sometime hopefully.


Just as a clarification though, red is equivalent to a matching combination of yellow and magenta, right ? So 50R =50Y+50M ?

 

[Photo Engineer]

Yes. 50R = 50Y + 50M

PE

 

[Ektagraphic]

If there was a lab that did this a a good price I would never shoot a color negative for quite a while!

 

[Photo Engineer]

If there was a lab that did this a a good price I would never shoot a color negative for quite a while!

The results are not all equally good. Only some E6 shots are suitable for printing on cross processed Endura.

PE

 

[Daire Quinlan]

Just a brief update. Having run through another iteration of this I'm finally just about there.

This is the most acceptable of the filtering/exposure bracketing from the last few I did. Exposure and filtering data is contained in the picture, sort of like a proto-EXIF



So, from messing around with the scan in PS, it think it needs a touch (maybe 20 or so) less magenta and maybe a smidgeon more yellow. Plus another 1/2 stop or so. I shot another at 6 under asa 4 and it was quite overexposed, so I reckon the combination of losing some of the magenta and another 1/2 stop or so should put it in the ballpark.

Funnily enough, having re-read Bujor B's posts on photo.net again the other day, I've come close to just duplicating his data. But where's the fun in just copying someone elses findings, eh ?

 

[David Grenet]

I quite like that purple look

Thanks for posting your results!

 

[srs5694]

FWIW, I tried RA-4 reversal processing of prints made from some outdated Svema CO32D slide film that I shot a month or so ago. I've posted the result on Flickr. (The scan of the print is yellower than the actual print, although I deliberately left the print with a faint yellow cast.) You can see the negative scan (with color both corrected and uncorrected by the scanner software) on the same Flickr photostream. I'm going to have to look at the print for a while to be sure, but I think I like the effect for this shot.

FWIW, I used Dead Link Removed as my first developer. If I'd run across this thread before doing the print, I might have tried the developer suggested by hrst -- but as my goal wasn't exactly accurate color rendition, maybe I wouldn't have bothered. I'll have to give it a go sometime with more conventional slide films.

 

[Sergejs Orlovskis]

I tried Reversal RA4 on Fuji crystal archive paper and I can't get colour positive. 1 bw developer work's great and I get normal BW image but after that I wash the image pre flash it with 60 watt bulb for 2 min> And after that put image in the colour developer (developer I use is Fujifilm enviriprint MP160) and nothing happens. What is my mistake ? Developer is fresh and when I put to the developer sheet of RA4 paper on light it became black. I can get BW image with looks that but in color developer nothing hannend

 

[Photo Engineer]

I have no idea. I have never used the Fuji chemistry, but it should work. If you overexpose, there will be no color image. And, remember, to test this out you must bleach and fix or blix the image.

PE

 

[Sergejs Orlovskis]

Today I receive first colour positive picture the colours is worst but it is USSR made slide from middle 70 it is picture of my mum. Now I try to get picture from normal colour slide. If I understand write my problem was bad washing. After stop picture need to be washed in fresh running water for 5 or 10 minutes. I try to use 3 rinse wash (each 3 min) in Jobo processor but it is doesn't work it need to be removed from the drum and wash in fresh running water. Fuji paper and chemicals works but rinse is main problem now. Maybe someone have some idea.

 

[Photo Engineer]

The cycle I use at 20C is: Dektol 1:3 for 1-2 minutes, Stop 30" to 1', wash 1-2 min, re-expose, Color Develop 2', wash 30", blix 2 - 4 min.

PE

 

[Sergejs Orlovskis]

I use 1st developer published by Hrst in first page and can get normal BW neg image without any problem but after stop I pull out paper and wash it in fresh running water on light 10 min. After that I put image in colour developer it' s develop but very bad. Maybe developer is dead ? When I redevelop normal RA4 developer become dark but in this process developer doesn't change colour and when I put little sheet of paper to the colour developer it become black and it is means developer works OK

 

[hrst]

Try to skip exposure completely. Just run an unexposed paper in the dark through 1st dev, wash, re-exp, RA-4. You should get a black paper if the process is optimal. In any case, you should get something quite dark.

Your blix is not working, by the way, because you are having a silver negative.

Test your RA-4 developer by exposing a piece of paper to light and running it through the ra-4 developer. You should get deep black paper.

 

[Sergejs Orlovskis]

I have another question. 1st development will be in totally dark or safe light might be used.

 

[Sergejs Orlovskis]

Ok I try to do this test tomorrow. My Bliks is works OK when I put image in to the BLIX after colour developer it's become white. But colour developer doesn't work normal after 10 min wash it develop image but it is looks that

 

[WayneStevenson]

I have been doing Dektol 1:2 for 3 minutes room teperature, rinse, re-expose (or reversal bath), Kodak RA4 25C for 1 minute, Blix 1 minute.

Has worked great other than a mottled / fogged appearance. Which I am trying to figure out. I've determined it doesn't have to do with reversal (I think) as I don't get it when I use a reversal bath as opposed to re-exposure.

As mentioned in another thread ( (there was a url link here which no longer exists) ), I have tried adding bromide, benzo. I've even tried development with Xtol, Rodinol 1:10. Basically trying anything I can to figure out what causes this mottling.

Photo Engineer mentioned though he doesn't know what causes it, he has heard about it before. Especially on RC paper.

I've tried running my B&W developer hot and pulling the development time back a bit and the mottling didn't appear as bad. May be on to something. Maybe not. They're obviously harder to see in shadows anyhow. Which may be what I am experienceing. But I do know that that's the time I need to develop it for the exposure I give it (shooting Crystal Archive Type II at ISO 16.

 

[Photo Engineer]

Ok I try to do this test tomorrow. My Bliks is works OK when I put image in to the BLIX after colour developer it's become white. But colour developer doesn't work normal after 10 min wash it develop image but it is looks that View attachment 51532

This example has about 100M or R TOO MUCH. Remove all magenta and yellow filtration and try again.

PE

 

[Sergejs Orlovskis]

The reason is chemical all my filters is 0

 

[polyglot]

Assuming there aren't chemical or other problems, you can still have less M by dialing in both C and Y.

(I've never done reversal RA4)

 

[hrst]

Yes, dial in C and Y.

Yes, you have to work in complete darkness until you have stopped and washed the paper. A dim yellow special color safelight is OK only if it is really OK for normal negative RA-4 process, but better to do without any, at least when you are having problems.

 

[darkroom_rookie]

Same here with Fuji Astia/Sensia slides, M was a no-no, C was in 20-30 range, and Y went as far as 100. Printed on two types of Kodak paper, expired and already yellowed Ultra Endura from around 2003-2004 and fresh (2009) Supra Endura. Expired Ultra looked better to my eyes, a bit warmer and somehow more natural in balance. Also that paper seems to be thicker. There was mottle on both, and since the slides printed were portraits and generally 'busy' images, it wasn't particularly noticeable. I used a mixture of EfKe paper developer (hydroquinone, I believe) and D-76. Developed in drums, stopped with 1:5 white vinegar, washed and then re-exposed to household tungsten. Colour-processed in a clean drum with Kodak RA-4 RT/LU juice. Contrast was the least satisfying aspect, it was just too harsh. I guess it can be controlled to an extent with sodium sulfite, but it's a bit hard getting that in small amounts where I live.

 

[Photo Engineer]

This process is generally harsh with portraits but landscapes and nature close up scenes really have snap. In a busy landscape scene, or other busy shots, there is little visible mottle although, I am sure it is there. I have a 16x20 shot on my wall that looks pretty good.

PE

 

[Sergejs Orlovskis]

I try to do test which hrst talking about but in reverse order. All process on light and after blix I should get white sheеt of paper. my best result was yellow-grey and I think preflash is critical moment. I use 100 watt bulb and preflash 10 minute 15 cm and it is not enough paper doesn't become brilliant white. When I put in to BLIX unexposed RA4 paper it become white and it is my sample sheet. Today I try to use 300 watt bulb from enlarger. If I understand write short (not enough) pre-flash is a reason of all colour shift