Renew My Faith Please ...

[Black Dog]

Is there enough space on APUG's server for this thread?............................

 

[JBrunner]

Is there enough space on APUG's server for this thread?............................

Yes!!! In the Doom & Gloom Subforum!!!!!
Vote now!!!

 

[naturephoto1]

Yes!!! In the Doom & Gloom Subforum!!!!!
Vote now!!!

Jason,

You mean the Henny Penny Forum, the Sky is Falling Subforum???? :rolleyes:

Rich

 

[JBrunner]

Jason,

You mean the Henny Penny Forum, the Sky is Falling Subforum???? :rolleyes:

Rich

Down by the ol soap box.

 

[Ed Sukach]

I'll be darnded. I always thought they were financial documents submitted to the Securities and Exchange Commission (Form 10-K for publicly traded companies) or to the IRS (Form 1120 for privately held companies).

Are those the slick "Annual Report to Shareholders" or formal accounting documents? Usually the documents submitted to the federal Tax Agencies and the SEC are FAR larger, DRYER, much more comprehensive and much less understandable to us mere mortals - than the Slick PR stuff handed out to the .... uh ... Ragged Ass Masses that invest in the company.

I remember one Annual Report, from Western Electric (remember them?) where management cried and sobbed about the low profits they made for the previous year ... colored by a huge public outcry about "monopolistic profits".
It was to their advantage to keep the profit numbers down.
In the Annual Report, the immediate impression was that they were indeed low and reasonable - it took a little (actually more than a "little") digging to discover that the had camouflaged more that $100 million by writing off the total cost of the construction of two new Plants, Point Breeze and the Merrimack Valley Works - as "Operating Expenses". Not really lies - but certainly not the entire truth either.

Is the Annual Report to Shareholders bound by the penalties of perjury?

 

[copake_ham]

Ed and bob01721,

Other than now being WAY OT, I think you're both right and both wrong.

Ed is correct that the "slick" annual report contains a lot of fluff and "puffery" and one would be wise to read the PR parts with a skeptical eye. Particularly the MD&A* part.

bob01721 is correct that the 10k (and 10q's etc.) are formal filings to the SEC that provide as much as possible a true and accurate presentation of a Company's financial condition, including a much detailed discussion of it's contigent liabilities etc. And, yes it is very boring reading.

Ed is wrong in that he neglects to point out that the Annual Report also includes independently-audited financial statements that, absent fraud and misrepresentation (e.g. Enron), accurately reflect the financial condition of the company.

bob01721 is wrong in that he places full faith and credit in the 10k and does not recognize that there are indeed Enrons out there that will defraud in their formal filings just as they do in their PR ARs. That was the basis of the Federal criminal action - fraud on the SEC.

Now, how about we send this thread into the dungeon with Wiggy?

*MD&A: Management Discussion and Analysis (also there is the "forward looking statement").

 

[Samuel B]

I need my faith renewed.

Has your faith been renewed yet?

 

[Photo Engineer]

Has your faith been renewed yet?

Much of this thread has been about Wiggy's lack of faith based on a half-assed guesstimate of the reports he is able to get his grubby little protuberances on and read. (quote from Sylvester McCoy).

I think this thread should be closed.


PE

 

[roteague]

I think this thread should be closed.

Yes, it is time for this to go away.

 

[naturephoto1]

Murray and I do not want to have to come back to this thread at page 40. Please close it.

Rich

 

[Sean]

agreed..